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BBCOR Bats (my take)

trojan-skippertrojan-skipper1,000+ posts
I didn't know what i would think of the whole thing with BBCOR replacing the rocket launcher BESR over the past year.

Here are my observations - not based on science- just based on the fact i coach a lot of games, throw a boatload of bp, and watch a lot of amatuer baseball...

The BBCOR is a superior bat to the BESR (or at least darn close to being better... i know I'm hedging here but it just didn't turn the game into a wood bat game which many folks thought it would)

BESR seemingly had one goal: to hit the ball far.
The BBCOR seems to have better all around play... it still sends a ball hit on the nose over the fence, but it has a certain balance that lends to better overall hitting....

So, in my opinion, the pitchers didn't really get much of a bargain with the change; but they did gain safety and i know that was number one.
Pitching in high school is still very difficult because you are facing guys with high tech metal, you have a short season so there is pressure to win every game and the strike zone is hitter friendly.
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Bolts-Coach-PRBolts-Coach-PR10,000+ posts
I kind of agree with some of the things you say, but the thing I take issue with is "The BBCOR is a superior bat to the BESR..."

From what standpoint? Technological? Manufacturing? Performance?

You could find balanced BESR bats that swung the same as current BBCOR bats, but they out-performed them all...

Basically my take is that they absolutely nailed it on-the-money with BBCOR. No bat now can really outperform another (although the performance is greater than wood, BBCOR does mimic the way there is no advantage between Ash or Maple, and bat preference is now about balance, feel, and esthetics). The guys that could hit before are still hitting, and the guys with flaws are being exposed easier... There are no rewards for high-tech materials anymore as the standard doesn't allow for it.
F freddy775,000+ posts
Bolts,
I agree they nailed it with BBCOR.
It's a reasonable compromise, and levels the field.

In terms of BBCOR bats being wood-like, I think most here will agree that:
On the field (not in the laboratory), BBCOR baseball is still gorilla ball when compared to woodbat baseball.

Descending down the performance ladder, BESR baseball is very different from BBCOR baseball, which is very different from woodbat baseball. It's three different games.
Last edited by freddy77
bballdad2016bballdad20161,000+ posts
Ill add my thoughts:

We are in our third season with BBCOR in Ca and are we are seeing balls hit harder now than they were 2-3 years ago when BBCOR first made its appearance. My thoughts, the younger players that have used BBCOR or wood from the onset are becoming better hitters. Better swing mechanics and not relying on the bat itself to do the work for them.

My 2 cents.
Bolts-Coach-PRBolts-Coach-PR10,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by bballdad2016:
Ill add my thoughts:

We are in our third season with BBCOR in Ca and are we are seeing balls hit harder now than they were 2-3 years ago when BBCOR first made its appearance. My thoughts, the younger players that have used BBCOR or wood from the onset are becoming better hitters. Better swing mechanics and not relying on the bat itself to do the work for them.

My 2 cents.
Agree 100%, nice post!
D Doughnutman1,000+ posts
quote:
Posted November 15, 2012 11:34 AMHide Post
Ill add my thoughts:

We are in our third season with BBCOR in Ca and are we are seeing balls hit harder now than they were 2-3 years ago when BBCOR first made its appearance. My thoughts, the younger players that have used BBCOR or wood from the onset are becoming better hitters. Better swing mechanics and not relying on the bat itself to do the work for them.

My 2 cents.



Devils Advocate time. I am sure that the kids from 3 years ago could hit. Plenty of draft picks and college guys from CA. How about this idea. The bat manufacturers may have found better ways to get around the testing after a couple of years. This makes more sense to me. Kids can hit, but profit is a great motivator. Remember, they all cheated with the old standards and I am pretty sure they are cheating and spending a pretty penny trying to get around the testing.
Last edited by Doughnutman
Bolts-Coach-PRBolts-Coach-PR10,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Doughnutman:
Devils Advocate time. I am sure that the kids from 3 years ago could hit. Plenty of draft picks and college guys from CA. How about this idea. The bat manufacturers may have found better ways to get around the testing after a couple of years. This makes more sense to me. Kids can hit, but profit is a great motivator. Remember, they all cheated with the old standards and I am pretty sure they are cheating and spending a pretty penny trying to get around the testing.
What testing are you talking about? The BBCOR Standard lessens the rebound effect of the barrel... They can only cheat if they are tampering with the structure of the bat after market... .50 is .50, the Manufacturer's can't get around that... I just don't see it. We've seen 4 Home Runs this fall in High School games and Showcase Events (Perfect Game, Prospect Wire and Under Armour) COMBINED...
bballdad2016bballdad20161,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Doughnutman:

Devils Advocate time. I am sure that the kids from 3 years ago could hit. Plenty of draft picks and college guys from CA. How about this idea. The bat manufacturers may have found better ways to get around the testing after a couple of years. This makes more sense to me. Kids can hit, but profit is a great motivator. Remember, they all cheated with the old standards and I am pretty sure they are cheating and spending a pretty penny trying to get around the testing.


I agree that the BBCOR bats are getting better. The manufactures are producing better bats that are still within the BBCOR standard. My point being, those who never had a BESR bat in their hand and were never forced to switch to BBCOR are becoming better hitters for it.

Think about it this way. If I gave a HS sophomore that is smashing the ball right now and has only ever used BBCOR or wood, a -3 BESR bat and told him to take BP he would probably pi$$ himself with the results.


Short version, I like what BBCOR had done for the game and for hitters. It’s not perfect and it’s not wood, but it’s not a bad solution at this point.
MidAtlanticDadMidAtlanticDad10,000+ posts
I wouldn’t call it cheating if they are meeting the defined standard. I would call it cheating if they are shipping a different bat than they submitted for testing. Another possibility, is that their manufacturing tolerances are not tight enough to guarantee that every bat manufactured passes the test (Marucci CAT5?). They may make a bat where 80% of them will test at .50, but the rest test higher. Another manufacturer may have made a bat that tested .49 just to make sure the outliers didn’t exceed .50.

I tend to agree with Doughnutman’s speculation. Every year they learn more about how to “improve” the bats while still meeting the standard. For example, larger sweet spots, closer tolerances, better balance point, etc.
B 4baseknock100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by bballdad2016:
My thoughts, the younger players that have used BBCOR or wood from the onset are becoming better hitters. Better swing mechanics and not relying on the bat itself to do the work for them.


Agree also as others have stated. If you have the correct balance, hand path, and overall swing mechanics, you will barrel up the baseball correctly on the sweet spot more times than not, which is most important whether BBCOR or wood.

The BBCOR provides slightly more foregiveness if your contact is slightly off the sweet spot vs. wood. A great hitter who barrels a wood bat up on the sweet spot can drive it just as far as a BBCOR as the wood bat still has more give and potential for rebound due to the wood fibers.
Last edited by 4baseknock

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