Bonds would skip Hall of Fame induction if there's an asterisk in Cooperstown

Good!!!!!!!! Great!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PROMISE??

I hope he doesn't even get inducted.

Ok, I read the article. (Thanks for posting it). But I have a question----it states that the guy who came up with the ball after it was hit had to sell it because he "couldn't afford to pay the taxes required to keep it".....Huh?....Why would he be required to pay taxes on that ball? How much would that be? I'm really puzzled....

If- he gets inducted I'm boycotting the hall of fame period.

play baseball, I heard that as well. I suppose it is because it is considered income. Kind of like when someone wins a car for hitting a hole in one in golf. When the insurance company hands over title to the auto, you also get a 1099 (Tax due)

My sister-in-law won a landrover on a game show many years back and had to come up with 12k to keep it.

If anyone cares, the reporter who interviewed him will be on Olbermann tonight. From the excerpts I heard on Countdown last night, Bonds contradicted himslef repeatedly --- adamantly saying several times he would never go to the HOF if the asterisk-ball was there, then the 'we'll see' as quoted.

Said he was working out and wanted to play next year, then saying he'd retire a Giant --- pretty much coming down firmly on both sides of the fence on both questions.

If you allow for all options, you're never wrong.

I don't understand the tax thing either, pb. The ball had no "value" until somebody wrote a check for it. Then he has to pay taxes....

re taxes: the irs set a value on the ball and were proceeding to access capital gains tax on the guy who recovered it .. they maintain value it's increased when the guy picked it up, hence a capital gain.

imo, a good lawyer could'a beat the irs
but it takes $$ to pay a good law team and you can't afford them unless you sell the ball



the way I see it that $10 baseball increased in value as soon as it cleared the HR fence in flight in fair territory (not when the guy recovered it) .. the guy that recovered it was just lucky & picked up something valuable that according to baseball etiquette belongs to whomever gets it.

irs back-up plan was to classify it as a "taxable prize" as being a ticketholder to that game was in effect paying for a chance to get that ball .. again more bogus logic -- 90+% of fans attending were NOT SITTING behind the HR fence had -0- chance of getting any hr ball.

just more intimidation by the guys whose carreer is picking our pockets $$

Thanks----Does anyone have an idea what the irs considered it to be worth? And what the guy had to pay when he sold it? I'm fascinated......

The tax thing is incredible, I don't get it.
Has this happened to the other balls that were caught and sold?
Did he have to pay taxes after someone bought it?
Was Bonds signature on it?

Taxable prize? Does that now refer to any ball caught in a park?

quote:

Thanks----Does anyone have an idea what the irs considered it to be worth? And what the guy had to pay when he sold it? I'm fascinated......

About $6.00. You don't pay tax until the gain is realized if it is taxable at all. It is illogical to tax an item like that because if he sells it it would be taxed again. Game show prizes are atxed in the US but they are new and have market value and you play the game to win the prize.

USA Today HR Ball

And from what I understand,... The Tax Code, Under Regulations sections 1.61-14 Miscellaneous Items of Gross Income, Home Run balls are considered a sort of Treasure Trove and thus constitutes gross income for the taxable year in which it is reduced to undisputed possession. The ball would be taxed to the extent of its value in United States Currency. Because the ball has a greater value than a regular baseball it is taxed as gross income to the undisputed possessor in the amount of the balls relative worth (in the case of Bond's record breaking ball, over $500,000) Although the ball had not been sold, it still had an appraised value of far more than the retail price of a baseball.

quote:

It is illogical to tax an item like that because if he sells it it would be taxed again.

No , if the IRS established a value for the ball and taxed it accordingly, then the ball would have a basis for future tax relations.

For example, If IRS placed a 500,000 value in the ball and taxed it, the balls tax basis would be 500,000.
If the owner of the ball later sold the ball for 600,000 the owner would be taxed on the 100,000 gain. However, if the owner sold it for 400,000, he would be able to claim a loss of 100,000


IMO, considering the nature and circumstance of the ball. I highly doubt the IRS would tax the ball until a transaction took place (Sold ball). If the kid wanted to keep the ball, but the IRS was FORCING the sell due to taxation, it would be a public relations DEBACLE for the IRS.

I agree with Tripledad,

Note that the IRS has not commented on the ball only Tax Attorneys. If the ball became taxable when it was recovered the opportunity to catch a key ball and keep it as a souvenir would be lost forever. Average fans would not be able to keep the ball on the mantelpiece. They would be required to sell in order to pay tax. Not a popular position for the IRS to take regarding America's Pastime!

quote:

If the kid wanted to keep the ball, but the IRS was FORCING the sell due to taxation, it would be a public relations DEBACLE for the IRS.

is that an oxymoron?

quote:

Originally posted by TripleDad:
it would be a public relations DEBACLE for the IRS.

Does the IRS care? They hold all the cards. You're guilty until proven innocent with the IRS.

I would take the ball and donate it to a charity and live tax free for many years.
Get a reciept for $600,000. and write off al cost related to being at the ball park like the season tickets, gas, car expense etc and let them fight over that.

Nice try Bobble, but capitol losses (Which the ball would be clssified as) are only deductible to the extent of your capitol gains. You would need to have a few nice years in stocks or real estate to make it work.

I don't think you are quite right on that Triple, although I agree that Bobble's plan wouldn't work.

The way I see it: when you catch the ball, you have taxable income for the value of the ball, tax paid that year. That value is the basis for the asset, and any future sale is taxed against that basis.

If you donate the ball to charity, it isn't a capital loss, it is a tax deduction of the value of the asset. But it would only act to eliminate your tax liability you incurred from the "income" of catching the ball.

So, Bobble, it wouldn't allow you to live tax free in future years.

You'd recognize income of, say $500K current year, and a deduction of $500K for the donation. No tax that year, nothing to carry forward to future years.

Actually I would immigrate to Canada where winnings and windfalls are not taxable.

Actually here if it were a taxable gain it would be based on the date it became atax gain. Many people donate homes ,cars etc and they are valued at the date that it is donated. and that would be $500K The IRS would have to get it appraised and that would be the value.
Hey I wrote off every dime I spent on my sons BB education leading to a taxable scholarship. I had no problem showing that what he did was as much an education as plumbing or anyother apprentice ship. They are there to collect taxes on future earnings including scholarships.

You could set up a charitable remainder trust. You could have the ball appraised, assess the tax liability. Gift the asset and recieve the tax deduction. The charity would then liquidate the asset and pay you a taxable income for a specified number of years which could include your lifetime or the lifetime of you and one other individual. At your death the charity would have access of those funds (trust corpus) that were created by the sale of the ball.

the baseball at whatever value was not earned, AND does NOT fit any type of income listed in irs tax bulletins -

does not even fit "other income" requirement

let a jury decide

There are lots of classifications of unearned income. But I sure don't know what the baseball would be. I still don't think the IRS would mess with it.

Rob, that sounds right, if you gave it as charity it would not be classified as a capitol loss. haha but thats even worse for tax purposes.

wow the off season is in full force now

Barry wont go.

What a shame. LOL