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40 replies

Can the HSBBWEB make a difference?

M mrmom500+ posts
I've been on this website since 2000 and have seen just about every subject recycled several times.

Smart, sincere, interested people contribute and become experienced and able to share their expereinces so someone can benefit. Yet, the same pitfalls and problems resurface and too often, almost always in fact, we as a group simply shrug our shoulders and say...oh well...that's just the way it is.

But what if we could make a difference? What if everyone who shrugs their shoulders and says it's wrong, it's unfair but we can't do anything about it actually tried to do something?

This website can use its power to try and effect changes where it is clear changes should be made but there are no advocates for change.

Point in hand...there is a very long thread in the recruiting area on "over recruiting" everyone has weighed in and there are lots of problems identified and even some good suggestions. But the general conclusion of the thread is "oh well" it is wrong, it exists, and just beware of it.

Folks, this site is the people who are most affected and who care the most...why don't we do something about it? Why can't we write an open letter to the NCAA asking for them to address the problems we see and encounter year after year. An open letter with support of the thousands of HSBBWEB readers might have no effect...but it might just get someone's attention, if only to go on record and identify it publicly as an interest group.

Interest groups banded together get action...MADD, SADD, any and all...why not baseball kids?

Overrecruitment is wrong but some say well that's life...but choosing a school, getting an education and playing sports is not the same as having a job with performance parameters that everyone understands the consequences of not fulfilling...you get fired. The problem here is there aren't any performance parameters for studnet athletes to base there futures on...! It's all relative to what's available in the next recruiting class or the transfer route.

C'mon! Ostensibly every parent on this site is instructed to get the "good fit" - and every parent tries and most always think they did. Never a better time than the time between when your son signs and when he enrolls -- always the "good fit". But yet, so many parents find the good fit was really a little "squishy" Johnny plays hard contibutes to the team, gets going well in school and then WAM! A coach, brings in 4 transfers and it's "Johnny you don't fit in with our plans" Johnny soory we got a better kid. So there goes Johnnies life, either quit playing ball or find somewhere else to play. Life is uprooted, the school which did fit is out the door and Johnnie is a victim of "she's better looking than you are."

Really, kids aren't adults yet, they can't legally vote, or drink but they can be manipulated and they can be lied to and why? Because the system as set forth in the NCAA rules fosters it. Coaches work within the context of the parameters they are given! Can't blame em, but you know what! There's always going to be a "college world series winner," a conference champ, etc. What there doesn't have to be is a system which allows 17 and 18 year olds to be bid on (recruited), and then let go, because a better looking prospect becomes available. Which then causes a chain effect and it's the equivalent of moving chairs...but's it's more like migrant workers...but why? There's not a good reason, if schools were forced to sign kids for four years and only allowed to drop em for injuries or grades there would still be good teams and bad.

I say the colleges can back their word, a student athlete can have all that's good in athletics and still get a stable education. All that has to stop is the rules which allow/compel/induce/force (choose your word) coaches to be able to drop their committment after 1 year.

Do that and then the coaches have to coach, develop and take an interest in all their players...kind of like they did when they first recruited them! What they want is a finished product ready made RIGHT NOW -- it's like being a (don't kill me ladies) a middle eastern woman without rights, they can be let you go anytime if a prettier face comes along.

Oh well, it would be nice if we could find someway to use our wonderful site for the good of the game and the kids! cry

APrdon me while i get down from my soapbox...don't want to kill myself with the fall
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FungoFungoHighly Regarded and Beloved Old Timer
Mrmom, I appreciate your concern but here’s the way I see it. The entity we call the HSBBW has to remain unbiased and without opinion in order to achieve the main goal of the HSBBW --- which I think is educating the hs player wanting to advance to the next level. If we (the HSBBW) decide to ban together and present a unified front to promote a particular cause or agenda, we would get narrow minded and ultimately brainwash ourselves.

For instance and sake of discussion on over recruiting: I might take the opposite position and say that over recruiting actually helps some student athletes find a college roster to call their own. Common sense would indicate to me that if you eliminate over recruiting you ultimately reduce roster spots. I know of players that are very happy being over recruited and end up setting on the bench at a big program. Is that ALL bad?
Fungo
M mrmom500+ posts
Fungo,

Great perspective ...you are correct and I can see your point. Certainly much to be said of it in that respect. I suppose it just seems that so many of the problems recurr and don't seem to get any attention...or at least enough! Over recruiting has bothered me for some time.

Guess you could correctly say...I'm a little frustrated I guess I want these darned duelers to actually make contact! I guess I'm a product of my times...."it's the system - man!!! Cool
B BobbleheadDoll5,000+ posts
quote:
if you eliminate over recruiting you ultimately reduce roster spots. I know of players that are very happy being over recruited and end up setting on the bench at a big program. Is that ALL bad


That has always been my view.
Be aware but embrase it and accept the chanllenge with knowledge.
Some kids are really hurt by this but that is BB. If you could transfer without penalty that would make it almost perfect.
FungoFungoHighly Regarded and Beloved Old Timer
This site is different to different people. I can look at the participants in this thread alone and see different needs and different providers of information. TRHit has willingly provided tons of information for many years. This information is “spoken” with that New England frankness that stirs healthy discussions. He may remember the time I called him on the phone (8 or 9 years ago) trying to get first hand information about recruiting/draft paths for my then HS aged son. The site was young and his experience in the area of evaluating players and collegiate contacts proved invaluable to me. Doc K on the other hand was a young player that contacted me seeking information and is now a strong contributor to those that are following in his footsteps. He and I have exchanged emails for years about his search for a college and how to gain exposure. BHD in addition to giving his parental perspective is from Canada and can add valuable information to those challenged by the barrier of the Canadian/American border. Two of my son’s college team mates were from Canada and both faced problem with visas or passports when draft time came around. Mrmom is much like me --- we have been here a long time and have asked more questions than we care to admit to. We have sons advance while we were members of the HSBBW and just being here has opened our eyes to many things. MrMom’s charisma comes through in his post and his command of the King’s English is obvious while adding his own personal flavor making his posts a pleasure to read. He is a real asset to the newcomers blending great information with a pleasing delivery. I love the diversity and know the HSBBW’s long tenure is in part because of that diversity and “our” ability to adjust to the needs of the all involved.
B baseballregie100+ posts
I wish you were correct and that this site had that kind of influence. Forget about the NCAA and over recruiting, I'd like to see a petition going to MLB denouncing the practice of turning their backs on American youth and going outside the US to recruit talent. Maybe threaten a boycott. Problem is, we all (and our sons) love BB so much we're all willing to accept anything MLB wants to dish out.
BumBum1,000+ posts
This being HSBBW, I think it would be more prudent to focus on the next level, rather than MLB. MLB is a business that will operate based on profit. If it is most profitable to get talent out-of-country, they will do it. Their form of "out-sourcing" is not much different than software companies out-sourcing to India. This being a free world, it cannot be stopped.

Rather, if HSBBW parents lobbied the NCAA or Congressmen regarding (NCAA) rules that have adversely impacted baseball in general and inner-city kids and scholarship availabity in particular, there would be more opportunity for success. Part of that lobbying effort is informative--let them know how the NCAA has changed the rules for the worse (to the detriment of college baseball)--and part is emotional: Is not baseball America's pasttime?

HSBBW is not a political organization, and so cannot presume to act upon the collective will of its members. We all have differing opinions. Instead, for those ambitious enough, gather together through forums and PM's and make your voices heard.
Last edited by Bum
TPMTPMHSBaseballweb Member since 2003
quote:
Originally posted by baseballregie:
I wish you were correct and that this site had that kind of influence. Forget about the NCAA and over recruiting, I'd like to see a petition going to MLB denouncing the practice of turning their backs on American youth and going outside the US to recruit talent. Maybe threaten a boycott. Problem is, we all (and our sons) love BB so much we're all willing to accept anything MLB wants to dish out.


Well if we do that we also have to boycott almost every business here in the US who have laid off americans and employed those in other countries.

MLB is a business, and the objective in any business is to make as much as you can for as cheap as you can. When I worked at American Express, the people making hundreds of thousands of dollars a year decided it was much more economical to set up call centers in other countries, the prime target was India. As a supervisor I was so busy taking calls because long time customers would not speak to anyone unless they had an american accent. After all, this was American Express. These days it is the norm to call any company and you are most likely being serviced by a call center overseas. How about Wal Mart, the original concept was to employ americans to sell goods made in America. Wal Mart should be renamed China Mart.

One of the reasons why MLB has gone in search of talent elsewhere is because our boys can't be drafted until after HS and many more players are opting for college in lieu of 1250 a month.

This is a really good topic though. I think the HSBBW has made a tremendous difference for many. I think that families are making much fewer mistakes in recruiting due to this site. This site provides a variety of helpful topics from timelines,scholarships, how to market your player, where to get exposure, about coaching recruiting tactics to avoid, coaching and parenting, health issues, even discussion on rotational vs. linear Wink, etc.
Last edited by TPM
Infield08Infield081,000+ posts
quote:
But what if we could make a difference?


I just happened on this thread and agree with TPM: HSBBW does make a tremendous difference for many. Armed with the knowledge they find on this site, players and their parents now have the ability to ask hard questions of coaches who recruit them. They also have the ability to ask questions about specific programs on this site and get valuable answers that will help them make their decisions.

The more we get the word out about this site, the more people that will benefit from all this site has to offer.
Last edited by Infield08
TRhitTRhit10,000+ posts
The original post dealt with HSBBWEB being similar to a "interest group" and having political power--- 'Tain't so folks---yes we can make a difference in helping people thru the recruiting process just by talking about our individual experiences-- BUT we are not a political group with that kind of power---do not delude yourselves and try to be something we aren't

By the way I think our family here is fine just the it is--sure we may fight like brothers and sisters at times but that is family
CM Coach May1,000+ posts
This site serves many purposes and everyone is here for the same reasons and different reasons as well. Some just like to talk to other baseball folks. Share coaching tips or ideas. For many its a place to interact with other people that understand the importance that baseball has in their lives and their childrens lives.

Its hard for people to understand that do not have a dog in the fight so to speak. Here you know that people understand because if they did not really love the game and care about their kids passion they wouldnt be here in the first place. How much money have we saved people from waisting over the years? Where are you going to turn to get honest feedback about a 3,000.00 showcase camp in Dec during a dead zone?

There are so many examples of people being able to come on here and get honest feedback based on personal experiences. Its a whole lot better to learn from someone else's mistakes than your own. The fact is it is a very lonely and frustrating experience if you have no one to turn to. This site (the people) can give you a shoulder to lean on. People that are willing to talk to you on the phone , pm , make calls for you , give you advice , tell you about other people that can give you advice etc etc etc.

What we have here is special imo. We have people that actually want the same for your son that they want for their son. I say leave the politics out of it. And keep this site about people helping people. And people actually caring about other peoples children. jmho
M MTS100+ posts
I'm sorry if someone has already brought this up, but I believe a bigger issue than over-recruiting is NCAA limiting scholarships AND the roster size of college baseball teams. These actions by the NCAA serve to limit opportunities for young men to obtain a higher education, when they should instead be increasing opportunities for higher education. They also have implemented penalties applicable to baseball only that would penalize colleges if players either change majors or leave the school. An example would be a 2nd year player being draft to the MLB or a student changing majors. NCAA has implemented these penalties ONLY against men's baseball programs. Every parent in the country should be calling and writing the NCAA about this. Again, I believe that NCAA should be increasing opportunities for education, not removing opportunities for higher education.
Last edited by MTS
T TripleDad500+ posts
I havn't been shy about my feelings on over recruiting. But it really needs to be defined and to what degree is it harmful/dishonest to the recruit. Coming to a collective agreement on the definition and the affect on a recruit would be difficult at best.
I agree with fungo, to politic an idea would damage the site, from what I see there are a lot of opinions and they are all welcome. That includes the opinions of college coaches, even the ones that over recruit!

Here is a breif look at my Freshman year at the HSBBW Insitute of Baseball. (note the mispelling!)

When my son was 12 and lighting up his baseball world, it occurred to me that he might be college material. I figured that a baseball scholly was just like football and basketball..........Then

Scholly 101 - There are only 11.7! WHAT! That can't be right! OMG

Recruiting 101 - College coaches will cut a recruit if things aren't working out. WHOA! You mean a coach can just cut ya! just like that! OMG

Recruiting 102 - There is a practice that some coaches use called over recruiting. OH PLEASE! FOR PETES SAKE DON"T TELL ME.....Yes grasshopper, there is a chance your son could be recruited, show up in the fall and be fighting for a roster spot. UGGHHH!

Advanced Political Research - This is a course taken every year. It involves the nebulous empire known as the NCAA. Lots of rules and rules changes. This class evolves and morphs as needed to follow the changing landscape. This class used to be an elective, but is now a core because of the need to study the ramifications of significant rules changes coming into effect in 08.

Wow, that was some education in frosh year! I hear next year is the hardest......GETTING RECRUITED! My stomach is queezy... I go puke now... Big Grin
B bb1100+ posts
HSBBWEB has already made a huge difference to both me and more importantly my son. The advice that we have been given has been priceless. People here have been through what we are going through and have responded wtih all kinds of advice. All have been helpful in one way or another. Just knowing that there is some place to turn when things aren't going quite right. This site helped me stay on the right track, to see the bigger picture, to see how things that I say and feel affect my son and it really helped him (and me). This past year on the field was great for him. That is what it's really all about, having fun, getting better and not worrying about anything else. Without Hsbbweb my son would be in a different school, missing his friends, learning less and still searching for the grass to be greener. We stayed, he had a great summer and made a huge impression. Thanks to everyone.
RJMRJMHSBaseballWeb member since 2007
quote:
This website can use its power to try and effect changes where it is clear changes should be made but there are no advocates for change.

HSBBW is a very powerful tool for those who choose to use it. Having people from PG, high school and travel coaches who have placed players in college programs lends much cerdibility to the site. But in the realm of all the athletes playing college baseball in the country, does HSBBW have power or is it just a dot on the map, even if it's a better dot than the other dots? If the site takes a stance and petitions it's stance, it's no longer a site of exchanging opinions. It's more of a think tank.
CPLZCPLZ1,000+ posts
Even if we were to have a unified voice relevant to any baseball discussion, the one thing we would lack, that organizations like MADD and SADD have, is clout. They can get legislation heard and passed because they can sway votes over politicians.

The NCAA is autocratic. Originally conceived as a the purest form of governance, because it would be run by University Presidents who would always place the student/athletes welfare above all other criteria, it has become the polar opposite. It is insulated from reality, stuck within the mortar and windowless walls of academia. It foists legislation upon the athletic world with no understanding of athletes, athletics or the relationship of the University to the student and world at large. It holds complete dominion over its empire and simply shuts its doors to cover up the din rising from its oppressed subjects that cry for nothing more than some common sense.

We have no power, no voice, nothing. I just shake my head and go watch my kid play.
O Orlando1,000+ posts
Coach May said it well -- the hsbbweb does make a difference already.

As worrying as overrecruiting can be, let's not see ghosts. How many programs overrecruit? 60%, 50%, 40%, 25%......or 5%? Is it really an over-riding problem? If Columbus State were overecruiting, would we be talking about it, or is it because it's high-profile ASU? How many players does ASU's practice impact?

Then there's the question as to why there is "overrecruiting", which pretty much comes down to the definition of the word. How many players historically are lost to the draft (which will primarily be a problem in the high-profile schools first), SAT/academics before entry, academic eligibility after they start, and injury? Any lost to finances with parents who haven't considered the cost in the excitement of a Big Name Offer? Is it "overrecruiting" or "insurance"?

Scouting isn't an exact science and these coaches are paid to win. 'Seniority', contacts, politics, etc. have much less influence than they did in hs or travel ball. Living away from home, more self-motivation needed for academics, additional distractions, more pressure to perform can handicap a player of any talent level.

A coach who recruits strictly to needs without taking these veryreal/probable problems into account will likely find himself scrambling by Spring.

A highly-talented player doesn't have a problem with overrecruiting however it's defined. A good player may. And a mostly-overlooked but talented player may benefit from such overrecruiting by being given a shot he might otherwise not have were those signing places restricted to a few.

I believe it was in '98 that a guy from our local LL was drafted. The article said he was part of a 42 player signing class for LSU. THAT was overrecruiting.
Last edited by Orlando
TPMTPMHSBaseballweb Member since 2003
Orlanso,
That was a great post.

I see no problem with the 35 man roster limit. Is it fair that Big State U has money to bring in 45 on a roster while smaller programs can't afford to do that? Recruited walk ons have always existed, not everyone on the roster gets baseball money. With 35 or less, yor sons have more of an opportunity to play, maybe not start but to be used more often.

Transfer rule, you can transfer, you just now need to sit out a year, that makes the player think twice and the coach who recruited him. I am not sold on that one, other than it apparently does affect graduation rates and the APR in the long run. Ask any college player how frustrating it is to work hard for your position and scholarship, then the next year the coach brings in 2-3 transfers to play right away. Think about how much that now impacts all of your sons not having to compete all over again against those experienced D1 players.

Scholarship minimum, now some players will be getting MORE than they might have before. It's the 11.7 that needs improvement, IMO. No matter how we look at it, baseball is a non reveue sport, so athletic departments pocketbooks are not getting hurt.

My understanding is there are adjustments that coaches want, not happy because of the ones that abused the system (revolving door type programs and not caring about academic progress). Now coaches will take more of an interest in their players keeping on target for graduation, if that works, you might see changes again.

After all, beleive it or not, you are going to college to earn a degree.
Infield08Infield081,000+ posts
quote:
Ask any college player how frustrating it is to work hard for your position and scholarship, then the next year the coach brings in 2-3 transfers to play right away.


Good points, Tiger Paw Mom. I know this is off the topic, but regarding TPM's comment above, how will the new rules affect JUCO players transferring to a D1? Will they be required to sit out a year before playing for the D1?
RJMRJMHSBaseballWeb member since 2007
quote:
Ask any college player how frustrating it is to work hard for your position and scholarship, then the next year the coach brings in 2-3 transfers to play right away.
Welcome to the real world! College is prep for real world. I'll bet plenty of people on this board have worked in business environments where they were in line for a promotion and the company went outside to fill the position.
Last edited by RJM
T TripleDad500+ posts
quote:
Welcome to the real world! College is prep for real world. I'll bet plenty of people on this board have worked in business environments where they were in line for a promotion and the company went outside to fill the position.


Ya but, I am unaware anyone that was hired by a company, moved to take the position, arrive on the job and find out 2 others were hired for the same position... Ain't the same, Folks I don't buy the comparisons to the workforce or the real world. The whole college experience is nothing like the real world. It prepares you through some life lessons, but it ain't the real world.
RJMRJMHSBaseballWeb member since 2007
quote:
Originally posted by TripleDad:
quote:
Welcome to the real world! College is prep for real world. I'll bet plenty of people on this board have worked in business environments where they were in line for a promotion and the company went outside to fill the position.


Ya but, I am unaware anyone that was hired by a company, moved to take the position, arrive on the job and find out 2 others were hired for the same position... Ain't the same, Folks I don't buy the comparisons to the workforce or the real world. The whole college experience is nothing like the real world. It prepares you through some life lessons, but it ain't the real world.
If you're going to disagree with my statement, please read carefully enough to see what I'm responding to and not create your own scenario from nowhere.

"... then the next year the coach brings in 2-3 transfers to play right away."

Your response is: " ... arrive on the job and find out 2 others were hired for the same position"

Our high school has guidance counselors very versed in placing student-athletes. One gave my daughter a pamphlet from the NCAA that read (parapharasing): "When you select the college you chose to attend is it important to play early in your college career and secure your position or play in an environment where they coaching staff may be looking to replace you with a more quality athlete every year?" One scenario lends itself to D3. One lends itself to D1. It's in the open. It's not a surprise. Buyer beware.

I use a local athlete as an example what can happen at a D1. He was all-everything in high school football. He ran for 2500+ yards and about 35 TD's. He gets to a major conference program. There are five more just like him. He was redshirted his freshman year and switched to DB his RS-freshman year. Buyer beware. It's fierce at the top.
Last edited by RJM
T TripleDad500+ posts
RJM, Kind of seemed like left field, but comment was based on the tone of the thread and another thread. I don't really disagree with you, but the comparisons to college and the workplace I don't think apply very well. For instance, in your example; if company goes out an promotes someone else outside of company it could be for many reasons....politics, nepotism, age, race, gender, shareholders, internal affairs, socioeconomic backround, your personality, your dress, who you know, who does your dad know, a change in business plan, your credit standing, and on and on. Now if a coach goes and gets a transfer for your position, its probably because he is a better player, thats all! The workplace is a multi faceted beast where adults/professionals interact in very complex ways with many forces at play that can change a career. If I had a nickel for everytime someone posted "the best players play" I would have some extra cash for Christmas...The real world doesn't really work that way. Maybe it is me, but I just don't like it when the workplace/real world comparison is made.
I do understand that high level competition, the demands of college/sports/academics certainly begins the foundation for what lies ahead.

This is starting to smell like a rant/hijack, excuse me, I shall stop.
Moc1Moc1500+ posts
Let's just take this scenerio that compares college baseball to business.

Player recruited and plays first year = employee recruited and works for pay first year.

Player wants to come back second year but is told scholarship is gone and so is his position on the team = employee either fired or layed off because management found someone they liked better.

With me so far?

Player now cannot go to another D1 college,but sure he can go DII, DIII, or Juco. Employee, however can go wherever he wants-even to his former emplorers direct
competitor if they will hire him.

Somehow this last scenerio does not equate. If you're fired from your college team or your job why does your former coach/employer have the right to tell you where you CANNOT go to continue your work? By the way, coach and NCAA are interchangeable.

IMO comparing baseball to employment not the best analogy.
Last edited by Moc1
Dad04Dad045,000+ posts
quote:
Moc1 posted: If you're fired from your college team or your job why does your former coach/employer have the right to tell you where you CANNOT go to continue your work? By the way, coach and NCAA are interchangeable.

IMO comparing baseball to employment not the best analogy.

Exactly. A non-compete clause for a first year employee, under 6 figures, is is generally unheard of.
Last edited by Dad04
OLDSLUGGER8OLDSLUGGER81,000+ posts
Figure I would toss a few cents in on the subject. I did my NCAA website surf to look at more rules, specifically the APR. What was interesting was this:

"The Academic Progress Rate (APR) is a key measure used to identify both high and low academic performing teams in the Division I Academic Performance Program (APP). Intended as a four-year rate of measure, the first full four-year data set will include academic years 2003-04, 2004-05, 2005-06, and 2006-07."

That was part of the original draft. It ended with this:

"Elimination of the squad-size adjustment will begin with the 2007-08 APR reports for any team with an aggregate cohort of 30 or more student-athletes."

***If I read it correctly, it looks like they once gave programs a "pass" for the draft eligible underclassmen, those leaving for Pro baseball. That now appears to be phased out?

So the question is this:

If a programs APR will be reduced by academically eligible kids that opt for the draft prior to graduation, does a D1 coach need to overly concern himself not only with grades of recruits, but with "grades" of recruits, i.e too many blue-chippers?

What if a D1 head coach gets lucky and has a dozen potential underclass players that have peaked the interest of MLB. What happens to his APR with a mass exodus ? Would this change how he deals with these players and the scouts that are tracking them?

Does the coach need to have a roster foundation of "for sure seniors-to-be" with good grades to offset the departures?

Ever notice that past rosters were represented the least by seniors?

Do you think senior-laden teams are the future now ?

I suppose if a kid can rake a baseball or consistently get kids out as a pitcher, then they have no concerns.

I also disagree with the new transfer rule waiting period. If a kid wants to transfer,and does, and waits an entire season to play, he will still not graduate from his original program and affect the APR in a negative fashion.

Is that one year wait that much of a deterrent if the coach has told him he won't play there?

Maybe I'm readin into this too much, but it seems like the NCAA has hired the banished CPA's who conjured up Enron............LOL
Last edited by OLDSLUGGER8
T TripleDad500+ posts
quote:
Maybe I'm readin into this too much, but it seems like the NCAA has hired the banished CPA's who conjured up Enron............LOL


I wondered where those Enron CPA's were! I happened to have a position in that stock, however it was short!..was loooking to buy those idiots a beer if I ever found em. Too bad I can't position short on the NCAA!

Good post oldslugger..leaves us even more to think about.
RJMRJMHSBaseballWeb member since 2007
quote:
Originally posted by Moc1:
Let's just take this scenerio that compares college baseball to business.

Player recruited and plays first year = employee recruited and works for pay first year.

Player wants to come back second year but is told scholarship is gone and so is his position on the team = employee either fired or layed off because management found someone they liked better.

With me so far?

Player now cannot go to another D1 college,but sure he can go DII, DIII, or Juco. Employee, however can go wherever he wants-even to his former emplorers direct
competitor if they will hire him.

Somehow this last scenerio does not equate. If you're fired from your college team or your job why does your former coach/employer have the right to tell you where you CANNOT go to continue your work? By the way, coach and NCAA are interchangeable.

IMO comparing baseball to employment not the best analogy.
You guys are going off on all kinds of tangents to disprove my point.

Original point ... Coach finds new players to replace last year's players.

My response: Welcome to the real world. It's how the real world works.

Nothing more. Nothing less. No other tangents. Welcome to the real world, PERIOD.
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