clueless dad with young pitcher

Hey clueless, I have a 2020.

My first question to you would be what specifically makes you think your son is a good pitcher?  Is it his choice of pitches, movement, velocity (as compared with others his age), or simple results that leads you to believe he is a good pitcher.

To answer your question about making the JV squad as a PO, it's possible, and completely dependent on your local talent.  We have debates on here a lot that some people's Varsity stats would be unlikely to make other people's JV squads.  It generally boils down to how big is your pond, and is your kid a big fish in that pond.

At this age I would not worry about what level your son is playing at for the HS.  Yes its good for the ego, but its not always the best thing for development.  Im not sure about NC but here in IL what we see during HS summer ball is not entirely reflective of the HS season.  Kids are pitching for both their travel teams and the HS summer teams so some of the best pitchers don't always pitch.  In addition its more about getting the kids reps to develop then it is about showing off your best players.

Also, there is still a lot of development to be had between frosh year and Sr./Jr. year.  While a frosh may look good playing with other frosh's there is probably a world of difference between them and a Sr.  

Finally, at many schools they carry a number of PO's.  There is nothing wrong with being a PO.  If he does not get a lot of fielding or hitting time don't stress over it.  Let him be a PO.

My youngest son is a 2017 and my oldest is a Jr. in college (does not play anymore) so we are just a little in front of you.  The best advice I can give you is to sit back and enjoy this time it will go by quick.  Don't get caught up in all the nonsense about who is doing what and who should be playing.  

Many thanks to both of you for replying.  According to his PC, he has an exceptional CU (deception and movement) and a good FB with tail.  Certainly not the highest velocity FB we've seen on the AAU/USSSA travel circuit, but definitely one of the better ones.  

Obviously, his PC is comparing him to the area kids his age and not to older kids.  Son has no dreams of making varsity squad right now, he is just worried about making the JV team. I think it would be great for him to PO at the JV level and keep working on his hitting and fielding to see if he can bring them up a few more notches...

Thanks again.

It is my opinion, and others might disagree, that if a high school kid is weak on his fielding and hitting then why try to push that?  Why not spend that money on pitching lessons, or pitching camps, and strengthening programs to be the best pitcher he can be?  He might not make JV this year, but if he works hard at developing his pitching maybe next year will be better.

Many of us have a bad habit of trying to fit our kids in a specific box rather than playing to their actual strengths.  If your kid enjoys pitching, and is good at it, why are you trying to make him into a mediocre fielder/hitter?  Why not focus on what he IS good at? Just My opinion.

cluelessDad2019,

Welcome to the High School Baseball Web! Love the fact that your screen name incorporates a condition from which many of us suffered when we stumbled upon this site, but about which we were quieter. Of course, it was obvious as soon as we asked our first questions! In any case, I thought I might add one thing to the already good advice you've received here.

Your son is reaching the age where he'd benefit from a session or two with a good sports physical therapist. One of the most common sources of injury, generally, for young pitchers is that they don't give the small muscles in the shoulder and back enough opportunity to develop along with the larger ones that they support. A good sports physical therapist can show your son some exercises that, if performed consistently, will really help him develop in several important ways.

You may already know someone there; or, perhaps one of his coaches does. Make certain that the person you choose has a lot of experience working with young pitchers. If you run into difficulty finding one, let me know via the Dialog feature here. I know an excellent one in Charlotte, who is certain to know a couple of peers in your area that he'd be willing to recommend.

Best of luck to your son!

I don't disagree with anything you've said...  If fact that is where I've been for a while.  It is HIS goal and hope that he can be a better rounded ball player.  In my rambling way, I was asking the question whether a PO situation is even possible at the HS level.  I'm learning stuff as I go here and hope to not screw things up for him.

Thanks Prepster...  

Son has significantly benefited from the folks at the Duke Sports Medicine facility.  In addition to advice on rotator exercises, he has significantly benefited from Postoral Restoration Institute (PRI -- the balloon guys) exercises.  In fact, it was shocking how much of an improvement it made in the smoothness of his delivery (my view) and the effort he needed to put into each pitch (his view).  As his bullpen catcher I immediately saw a benefit in velocity and movement...  Extension became easier and that led to gain in pitch movement.

It's possible, but there are many factors - the coach himself, roster size, fielding/hitting ability, etc.

During my son's senior year they had 15 on the roster with three pitchers.  One of the starting pitchers was a PO due to his poor hitting ability.  I think he had one hit all season long when the coach inserted him into the line up against a very weak opponent.  When he did start, the coach usually had a DH for his spot in the line up.

absolutely yes.  If he can pitch and the team needs pitching the coach will fill find a place for him even at the right level. If it is not a PO in name, it could be de facto PO.  There are always kids on each roster that will see less playing time in the field, so even if they don't call him a PO but use him mostly as a pitcher, it doesn't really matter.  Chances are by the time he is on varsity, it may be as PO if that is what he is looking for or the skill set dictates.  

Perfect!

This is a story I heard from the year-end Baseball banquet. Our head coach introduced his ace pitcher, and said that the kid was (and still is) not very coordinated, "can't chew gum while walking at the same time." At Freshman level, he almost got cut because he can't field, can't hit, can pitch but not that good. However, he's a 6'5" tall left hander,  so the coach decided to give him a chance. He was a PO since freshman and kept getting better and better. In the last season as a Senior, he was the ace pitcher, made 1st team all county, 1st team all state, and led the team to second place finish in the state tournament.

It may not be common, but it does happen, and it happened right in front of my eyes.

BTW, maybe that's why the HC asked about your son's parent's height. It made a big difference for this kid. If he were not a 6'5" left hander, he wouldn't have made the freshman team and his baseball career would have ended at middle school level.  

My 2017 has been a JV PO.

During the summer he is one of his team's 3 catchers, but is only used when absolutely necessary.

During the HS season, the coaches don't like to have pitchers also catching.  For games he is not available to pitch he is used as a courtesy/pinch runner, which he actually enjoys doing.

Be careful what pitching instructors tell you or your son. They want you to to keep coming back and spending money. The best determination of your son's potential would be from a knowledgeable baseball person with nothing to gain financially.

First, welcome to the site! As for your screen name, I'm pretty sure I've had that adjective attached to me -- I just didn't think of including it in my screen name!

From your description, it sounds like your kid loves to pitch. That's a good starting point -- things we love we tend to work hard at, and thus tend to get better at. As to whether or not he will be a P.O. -- and around here we definitely have them in high school -- I've always assumed that decision comes from the coaches. In other words, if he can add value at the plate and in the field (at whatever level he makes -- frosh, JV, varsity) then the coaches will want to play him there. If he can add value only on the hill, then they'll pitch him, only. Maybe that's an overly simplistic way of thinking about it . . . but I tend to try not to overcomplicate things.

thanks to all for taking the time to share your thoughts.  Two things are true...  boy loves to pitch, dad is clueless   All my kids have thought the same...  this is just the first time its been about baseball.

Gracias

Originally Posted by cluelessDad2019:

Many thanks to both of you for replying.  According to his PC, he has an exceptional CU (deception and movement) and a good FB with tail….

Obviously, his PC is comparing him to the area kids his age and not to older kids. …

Clueless,

I’m not trying to say this is the case in your situation, but I am saying it in general. If you’re paying this PC, don’t bet your house on what he’s telling you. Remember, he’s getting $$$$$ for a service, and it doesn’t benefit him to tell you anything that will increase the chances that you look elsewhere for help.

Now if for instance he says your boy is really progressing well as far as his FB velocity goes, has readings from all of his students for it taken at regular intervals and your boy is among the ones doing better, then you can believe him. But when he says something like he has an exceptional CU (deception and movement), ask him how he’s measured that. What I’m trying to say in a round-about-way is, if you want a real evaluation, get it from an independent source who doesn’t have any connection what-so-ever to your boy or his PC.

Welcome Clueless, this board can be great for your baseball anxieties...i know it was for several of mine. All solid posts, find someone you can trust who comes with references and someone who has directly impacted kids' performance on the field. Talk to other coaches and ask them for opinions...not just the kids parents. If his ball moves, that is a great thing...foster that desire and let him have fun being a pitcher while putting in the work to be the best he can be.

many thanks yet again.  PC is a longA PC for an MLB team.  He's been there done that for a long time and he has helped countless local pitchers fulfill HS, D1 or pro dreams.  When he is in his off season his schedule is packed and he has a waiting list of kids wanting to work with him.  My BS meter is set on a hair trigger and I'm satisfied.  Plenty of feedback from coaches to confirm all the things said about 2019son thus far (good and bad).  I do appreciate the concern and the suggestions of caution.  One problem with current anxieties is we are making a big transition and he is off being a pro.  dang him   This forum has been invaluable and I thank you all...

I don't know if things have changed, but when I played, there was always a sophomore on varsity who would suit up for varsity games when he was scheduled to start, to add depth in tournaments, or for bullpen depth in general. Said player did not have a varsity level bat, so on games where he wasn't needed, he suited up for the JV squad and got his AB's there. Same went for freshman splitting time between JV and Freshman team. Again, don't know if this is within the rules now and if coaches still do it. The only drawback, which I experienced myself as a HS freshman, is sometimes there are jealous teammates at the lower level.

And I second the warning about certain pitching coaches. There are certainly a lot of smart guys out there. There are also guys who have God-given gifts and played past high school based off just that but did not listen to anything or learn anything and are making money off just something on a resume (I have several ex-teammates who fit into this), there are BSers who lie about their past and fool people, and then there are people who just want your money and will tell you what you want to hear to keep you coming back. And there are so many different theories of the game, what works for one player may not be good for the next, eg: a coach who believes pitchers should rest and then go after it hard with long toss several times between outings, vs a guy who believes in rest, a little long toss, some flatground work, and a light pen.

I'd just let things ride out, make sure your kid is taking care of his arm (and core and legs), and if you have the money for private instruction, just be cautious. I've had friends who everyone swore as HS freshman were going to be D1/Drafted players and didn't play past high school, and an old teammate who rarely pitched from ages 13 through 16, and all of a sudden he is 90 plus, became one of the best pitchers in the city and eventually pitched part of three seasons in the majors. As he starts to play in high school you can start to gauge where things are at in terms of where he is, but there are still so many factors that change (mostly growth) from 14-18, you still don't know.

It is definitely possible for your son to be a PO on JV this year but what you need to find out is how many, if any kids were carried as POs on JV in previous years because the way they do it at my school which is moderate size is just look at you as a complete player your freshman year, unless they believe you can make a difference pitching at the varsity level. Honestly I think it would be more beneficial for your sons growth as a ballplayer to play on the freshman team this year to humble him a bit, most of the kids who play JV or Varsity their freshman year get a sense of entitlement that nobody, including college coaches, like to see. It also really depends on how he stacks up against the sophomore and junior pitchers that are going to be placed on JV, the most beneficial thing for him as a freshman is just to make as many outings as he can. No good comes from sitting on a bench all season

is that common, a freshman, JV, and V team?  I don't think we have Freshman only teams locally.  

Depends on the region and the size of the school.  Locally, there aren't any freshman teams - only JV and Varsity.  Our local HS has a student population of ~1,300 and typically they get 50-60 trying out for JV and Varsity.  They recently started a MS team and under VHSL rules, if there is a MS team, 8th graders cannot tryout for JV.

My son's High School has a population of about 2,000, they do not have a freshman team.  The neighboring High School has a population of 2,300 and they do have a Freshman team.  It's always best to check local rules, in GA an 8th grader can play on JV but not varsity.

As others have said Frosh teams depend on your area.  We have a HS of about 3,800 kids.  Our baseball program is structured as:

-Frosh A

-Froh B

-Sophs

-Varsity / JV.  JV games are for players not getting playing time in V games.