College Summer Ball - Advice on Decision? (Great Lakes vs. Local)

I believe most rosters are filled by now. If there is an opening you better grab it.

Most college freshman who play summer leagues have had very little playing time in college, one of the reasons they are sent.

It's a great time to learn and develop confidance among more experienced college players, even if they do some more bench sitting.

JMO.

Snowball - I am no sage and have no sage advice.

On the other hand, you ask a great question that I am not sure I have seen asked before. Normally, I argue that it is more important for players to play. You might even be able to cheat right now and peak at the roster since many keep them updated over the Internet. If some kid from a big name school happens to play your son's position, you may want to consider that.

The Great Lakes League (GLL) is a big deal however imho. Your son may just grow more as a player by comingling with other players in the GLL - regardless if he happens to play as much. Just maybe he goes there and convinces himself he is more than a D3 player.

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Would echo....

Have three summers worth of family college summer baseball under our belts...two freshman summers (both local)...one soph - three states away...

Don't underestimate the growth and maturity being around, and working out with experienced college players...something that will come in very handy when college practice starts....and the value of being away from home...likely with a host family...

Having them local made me happy, but in retrospect they were ready to be gone, to have an adventure, to test themselves in a bigger environment, not just from a baseball standpoint...but a life one. And being away was great for their baseball regardless of playing time...

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I doubt there is a right answer. But, based on our experience with a DIII player and summer leagues, there might be some clues to tell you about playing time/skill level.
Normally, every player in a summer league is either recommended by the player's college coach or asked by the team, because they know about the player and think he can contribute. Our experience is that college wood bat leagues are extremely competitive and the GM's want to win. If your son was recommended by his college coach or asked by the team, then the baseball people think he can play and contribute. That should be reassuring if it is how the option came to your son.
If this came about in some other way, then you would be right to question playing time and and competitive skill level issues and the other teams could be the better option for playing time.
With that said, if your son is on a strong DIII level team, even if he isn't getting a lot of playing time, he can likely be competitive in the Great Lakes league. But he will need to head into that season recognizing he needs to earn his spot and playing time and he might need to be willing to play positions different than what he played in college. The more versatile he can be, the better opportunities for playing time.
For what it is worth, each year our son (a former DIII) played, he would be the last one to take a position in the first practice. He would watch where every other play went for a position. If he saw no one at a position, he went there. It worked well and he started nearly every game over 2 summers with very strong teams.

My guy took a different approach---he was invited to play in a Summer League in our area, NECBL. But since he was playing in the southwest all year and only had a few weeks off all year he chose to play in an local summer league filled with ex college and pro players---very strong talent pool---this gave him a chance to recharge his batteries and still play enough , 30 to 40 games, to stay sharp. At the same time he learned a heck of a lot---he had a Division III All American next to him in the outfield and faced some grizzled veteran pitchers every weekend---nearly half of his team members are now college or HS coaches

it's been our experience that summer college teams don't overload their roster with guys ...

however, we have seen guys released during season

As TPM says, summer teams are crammed with red-shirts and freshman with little playing time. Everyone is in the same boat. Everyone gets better, more confident, pushing the envelope a little bit.

Snowball;

My opportunity to play in the 1st year in the Basin League, was as a freshman at MIchigan State, when the coach asked me to take the train to Chamberlain, South Dakota. My only question was where was South Dakota and when can I play.

Over the next 3 years, the Basin League became the #1 College Summer League. One year over 40 players later made the Major Leagues, including Bob Gibson.

Run don't walk to this opportunity. "Don't look back, someone is gaining on you"!

Bob Williams

These are all GREAT responses... we appreciate it!

The local league here is much like TRHit describes. Current/former college and some pro's. In fact, 2 local tournaments are held that attract teams from several states here in Mid-Atlantic. The 1 team that is interested in son lost their starter at son's position, so he could get a lot of PT. The other team is interested but has 2 other players at same spot.

The GLL team has 2 players at son's position (including son).

You will find that many of the summer leagues play just about everyday (especially when they get backed up from rainy days). It is virtually impossible to expect any starter at any position to play everyday, that is usually why they have more than one for the position.
Also, most summer leagues are not known for instruction (players actually instruct among themselves ) though many do pick up valuable pointers along the way.

Choosing to play another position during the summer is IMO very smart decision!

quote:

The local league here is much like TRHit describes. Current/former college and some pro's

that type can also be great competition, but - if scouted at all, it's not scouted to the extent that Great Lakes league would be .. if that is a consideration

quote:

Originally posted by Bee>:

quote:

The local league here is much like TRHit describes. Current/former college and some pro's

that type can also be great competition, but - if scouted at all, it's not scouted to the extent that Great Lakes league would be .. if that is a consideration

Bingo! Not that it can't happen elsewhere, but IMO I would opt for the best venue possible which in this senario seems to be the GLL.

nothin worse than what if.tell him to go have a ball and make some memory's. things happen for a reason. and lets face it lifes to short, enjoy it.

For what it's worth, I say go for it. Summer ball is so much more than just playing baseball. With the plethora of college summer leagues, almost any kid can play somewhere. Just have fun.

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quote:

Run don't walk to this opportunity. "Don't look back, someone is gaining on you"!

Coming from Bob Williams...this is a quality endorsement...

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Even though he may not be playing much in games, he is still probably playing a lot during the week in scrimmages. I worried about this myself when my son, who had not pitched in a game his freshman year, went to the Valley League that summer. He had a rough first few innings but ended up as a Pitcher of the Week one week and played in the All-Star game. More important, he learned so much from his coach and his teammates that summer about pitching that helped him the following year back at college.

I'm not recommending one over the other. But if your son was invited to play, it just seems that they probably think he has the talent to compete there. Another advantage of not playing much in freshman year is that you are fresher to play in the summer. A lot of the older kids are already exhausted, sore, etc.

quote:

Summer ball is so much more than just playing baseball

Agree 100%+ (if it is possible) with 316sports. Our son is still meeting players from both of his summer teams ... actually hit one during an at bat this week (wonder if he spoke with the guy afterward?) ... competed with or against in college ball and now more of the same in pro ball.

If it is possible for your son to play in the Great Lakes League ... and I am only giving my 'advice' because that is what you asked for ... I say go for it for the opportunities on and off the field Have always been a big believer in playing with the best competition a plater can find so that the player is always 'playing up'.

Thanks everyone for your input and advice. It is much appreciated! Some of your ideas were similar to ours.... while others had not even occurred to us.

As it stands, son has decided to "go for it" on the Great Lakes team. I passed along this thread to him and I know it helped him think through his decision-making process.

As a side note, I am seeing payback already because it's put a spark into his "bench-riding" as his attitude and outlook have stepped up a notch or two. He's working even harder on his own outside of games and practices than usual, in anticipation of the summer. And, the few innings of play that he does get here and there, he appreciates all the more as they are helping him prepare. Also, the application process itself required that he get the head coach's reference... which he was a little worried about. But, the coach was very supportive... which also helped son's overall cause.

Thanks again!

Hi All,

Thought I'd provide a "post-op" on what ended up happening (better late than never, eh?).

Son decided to go the Great Lakes route. What a wild ride it was. His team finished with just a handful of wins, but I have NEVER, EVER seen so many close losses in my life. It was really bizarre.

The overall experience was a confidence booster.. and a reality check. My son was the 3rd catcher on team, and by end of season, he was the only catcher as the rest all got hurt. He absolutely loved catching this level of pitching (compared it to playing a video game). Although hitting this pitching was a challenge. He finally figured it out late (a little timing tip from a Senior teammate), but I don't think he quite reached the Mendosa line. Still, all in all, inside of his "knower", he now "knows" he can play at this level. Had he not been injured himself, and asked to carry out all the catching duties at the same time (sometime playing AND doing Bullpen), I think he would have had a little more success.

We made a couple of trips to see him. He had a wonderful host family, but they lived in "the middle of nowhere"... no TV/cable, no internet, no job. Drove him nuts. I thought it was a hoot <grin>.

I thought the level of play was good... certainly the pitching was a notch higher than D3. But, honestly, I wasn't particularly overwhelmed (and my son wasn't). I am not sure what we were expecting. There were indeed a few really good position players.. but nothing we hadn't seen in our D3 circles. Scout presence was very, very light... near as I could tell. But, every now and then you'd see one. Of course, since the team wasn't doing so hot, that was probably a factor.

Some of the GLL teams are REALLY into this thing... a real community event (radio, giveaways, fireworks, etc.) It was very neat. It reminded me of what baseball must have been like in days of old. Meanwhile, other teams were clearly struggling financially and were just trying to get by (like ours). LOTS of travel and LOTS of games. It was particularly neat to see the one game that our team did a community night. Afterwards, all these youngsters were lined up looking for autographs. It was also cool that a lot of the games were broadcast over the internet so I was able to listen in on a lot of the games from home.

My son was invited back for this summer. Not sure if he's going to do it though. He has his eye on this American Baseball Institute out of Seattle. Seems pretty interesting... it is built conceptually off of the Dominican League model. It's basically a full-time academy (aside from a part-time job they set you up with to cover the costs). Here's the link... http://www.americanbaseballinstitute.com/index.html

Since y'all gave such great advice last time, maybe you know something about this? It's pretty new as I understand it. I think this is only it's second or third year. He likes what he sees of the opportunity to really focus on improving all aspects of his game through the intense training and the playing. I am just concerned that it is legitimate.

Thanks for all the insights provided last time. It definitely helped! I thought you might like to see the fruit of your advice.

I looked at their website and I have a few concerns for you:

1) I have never heard of this place. Being from the NW, that surprised even me.

2) Perusing their website, it actually appears they try to dissuade kids from going the D1 route. Why? Is this a pseudo-birdscout running the deal?

3) Their video of kids throwing off the mound were scary. Really, really bad mechanics on one. Is this what they teach?

4) Your kid is forgoing Summer ball for this "academy"? That seems risky for me. He needs to play ball in the Summer and train in the Winter.

If you decide to do it, let us know how it turns out.

Those are the worst mechanics I have ever seen
My son is throwing like that and is having a terrible season.
After 2 great seasons he is just awful. I have been trying to get him back to solid basics and it is hard. Those mechanics make me ill.

Thanks for the input, guys. I appreciate it.

I am admittedly clueless on pitching mechanics. Bum and Bobble, are you talking about the mechanics of the pitcher on their main lead-in video? Or are you talking about the before/after video seen here...
http://www.americanbaseballinstitute.com/Before_and_Aft...efore_and_After.html

Just wondering.

Thanks!

Their main lead-in video, shortly after you see a clip of a catcher making his throw. The subsequent clip of a pitcher throwing wildly, his head flailing about not even looking at the target, falling off the mound, yea that one. Scary. Now, my sound card is not working so hopefully they have a voice dub that says "this is not the way to throw a baseball" but if not, and they're using this clip to promote their business, head for the exit.

There are tons of great collegiate leagues out there, including a great one here in the NW (West Coast Collegiate Baseball League). If you son wants to go to Seattle, have him get on a team here and he check out this institute on the side.

Snowball-
I made a few inquiries on your behalf to baseball professionals in the NW. Sorry, none heard of the place, it seems they would know about it to some degree. One found the testimonials , well, questionable? I think more research is recommended. Playing in any of the summer collegiate leagues is really considered practice in real terms - refining your game. He can always condition - but he won't be enhancing his game. JMHO

I agree with both above posts.