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21 replies

Country Boys...

Ken GuthrieKen Guthrie1,000+ posts
Well, as some of you may know, a few years ago I moved my family to the country. We are nestled on a couple acres up on Ray Roberts Lake in Valley View, Tx. You know, wanting the grass roots, down home simple life feeling.

So far we have enjoyed our new lifestyle. BBQ's on Sunday, bullfrogs and rabbits to catch for the boy, and mama enjoys watching the wild flowers grow this time of year.

But I have found 1 thing in life has not changed.

During the construction of our new home, I had the pleasure in meeting the man who built our metal building. I use it to store all my toys...boat, quad, duck hunting gear, ect. Anyhow, this guy is a great man and I have become somewhat close to his family.

So he asks about the baseball thing and mentions his 7 year old boy could use some help. So I mention to bring him over and we'll work on some things.

3 months later, my Wednesday nights are consumed with baseball lessons in the small town of Pilot Point just down the road. I guess word travels fast. I was reluctant at first not wanting to give up my evenings, but what could 1 night hurt?

So I start to meet people and surprisingly find out that the community has a strong youth league program. I think this is great right. Blue collar folks watching youngsters in the dandylions learn and enjoy the game.

So back to the building guy and his son. Let's just say he's a little slow and his confidence is not too strong. We work on that part all winter long and he is making incredible progress. A once embarrassed kid is now eagerly looking forward to his practices and games.

As the young season approaches, I happen to work with a kid on the field one day on his catching. Just so happens that the building guys son has a practice with the team on the same day.

So on my way out I stop to watch a little. Not surprised, there is a little more emphasis on unimportant things going on in practice but that's to be expected right?

Well I get a phone call later from the building guy and he mentions his son has become intimidated by the coach of his team. From my day watching practice, I could easily see how this could happen.

My suggestion was for this father of this 7 year old boy to request a team move back to "t-ball" with another coach for the season. This would accomplish 2 things, more time for advancement, and elimination of an intimidating environment.

Remember, the self confidence of this little boy is an obvious area for concern. Certainly THE MAJOR move down from "coach pitch" and a mentor change might help.

Word is, "the league" is concerned that a 7 year old might create an unfair advantage while allowing him on the 6 year old t-ball team.

Are you kidding me? We are talking about 6 and 7 year old boys. I don't think I played organized baseball until I was 10 or so. In fact, I think then I was more worried about what flavors would be in my "suicide" soda after the game.

Moral of the story...a 7 year old boy will most likely learn to not enjoy the game and fear future participation.

I guess the game has changed for the country boys as well.

Looking for a few acres to build my "field of dreams". Sunday pick up games might be fun don't you think?

On a side note, my son Gage has decided it's more fun to watch his dog chase the ball I bought for him than play catch with his dad. I'll admit, it's more fun for me too.
Last edited {1}
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FungoFungoHighly Regarded and Beloved Old Timer
I enjoyed your post very much Ken. My son was raised in the country and I can tell you baseball is the same in the country as it is in the city ------- with the exception that it’s harder to find a teammate and the fields don’t have any lines. You talk about your builder's son. The highs and the lows that surrounds the game knows no boundries. My youngest son was basically an only child because of age differences of his brother and sister. Dad became the long toss partner with bingo the dog chasing the heaters dad couldn’t (or wouldn’t) catch. The net, the concrete wall of the basement and the soft toss machine would often become his partner in a baseball drill. Neighbors were few and far between and those that could have joined in had no desire to play baseball. Yeah, practice and games are always a little farther away but that’s a good opportunity for mom or dad to talk with their baseball playing son about “things”. I might add there is a football goal post that still stands where the yard meets the field where my son would practice kicking field goals. He had seven footballs and would “kick” to the uprights, run to the field and punt them back. I'd sit on the porch, stopwatch in hand and call out the "hang times". I guess he’d been a quarterback if I could have run a pass pattern. Big Grin
Fungo
skysthelimitskysthelimit100+ posts
I understand your frustrations Ken but most leagues
do not allow anyone to play down.
One reason is, that if a player, that is too old to
be in that particular group, hurts another player
either with a thrown ball or batted ball, the league could be held liable for allowing a player to
play in a division he is not eligible for.
And unfortunatly in this world of lawsuits leagues
just are not willing to take that chance.
I have been part of running a rec. league in my home town for about 14 years now, and if this same
situation happened to us, it would be difficult.
If the dad went to the board and in person, explained the situation, made it clear of the boys
ability, if he is close to the cut off date in age
they might reconsider, but it would proably be easier just to get him moved to another 8u team.
S Sandy100+ posts
Oh this brings back soooo many good memories! I remember Robert laying out the field on our 16 acres so we could hold practice. Robert and the other coaches would sit out in the field and talk stategy for hours (7-9yr old stategy). The kids would run wild jumping on the trampoline and hors'in around. Robert expected the little boys to take it seriously like all the dads and most of the moms did too. Looking back we would not take it so seriously but the memories in those fields are priceless. One of the boys "drafted" on to our team would throw with the wrong foot forward and the ball would go straight up in the air and almost whack him on the head on it's way down. And by the end of the year that boy was throwin the ball straight and was the most improved on the entire team. I know those kids remember "Coach Robert". He probably took it all too serious in the beginning but he loved those boys! Even parents have to learn along the way it's just baseball...sometimes we just figure it out too late.

Better late than never...
N NTXDAD10+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by skysthelimit:
I understand your frustrations Ken but most leagues
do not allow anyone to play down.
One reason is, that if a player, that is too old to
be in that particular group, hurts another player
either with a thrown ball or batted ball, the league could be held liable for allowing a player to
play in a division he is not eligible for.
And unfortunatly in this world of lawsuits leagues
just are not willing to take that chance.
I have been part of running a rec. league in my home town for about 14 years now, and if this same
situation happened to us, it would be difficult.
If the dad went to the board and in person, explained the situation, made it clear of the boys
ability, if he is close to the cut off date in age
they might reconsider, but it would proably be easier just to get him moved to another 8u team.


I ran a rather large youth baseball/softball program in the Metroplex and it's very difficult to allow players to "play down". It a slippery slope that although can be accomplished, it's almost always troublesome for someone. I'd suggest reaching out to the administration and looking for a less intense coach/team in his age group. Most administrations will accommodate.
K KellerDad1,000+ posts
If this young man's father followed Ken's posting on this website, should he be resigned to just shut up and not interfere with the all knowing coach?

Why would he question the league, the coach, the God's of baseball?

Isn't that parent interference???

Aren't they supposed to pay thier money and then sit quietly in the stands?
BI Bring it100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by KellerDad:
If this young man's father followed Ken's posting on this website, should he be resigned to just shut up and not interfere with the all knowing coach?

Why would he question the league, the coach, the God's of baseball?

Isn't that parent interference???

Aren't they supposed to pay thier money and then sit quietly in the stands?

__________________________________________________

KD,

THOSE rules only apply when Ken G. is the coach.
Jewels4BaseballJewels4Baseball100+ posts
Doesn't sound like this is a "playing time issue" as most parent complaints. Sound like this is a confidence/self-esteem issue of a 7 yr old KID. Kudos to Ken and the parent for being concerned about a 7 yr old feeling intimidated by his coach. There are far too many youth coaches out there that seem to think that they are baseball Gods. Trying to make all-stars out of Little Johnny by berating him instead of TEACHING him the fundamentals of the game.

Also, kudos to Ken for donating his time to help teach our future baseball players. I'm glad to know that not everyone feels the need to charge an ungodly amount of money to teach this great game of baseball to 7 yr old boys.
Infield08Infield081,000+ posts
Loved your post, Ken. It brought a smile to my face to read of your interest in the boy and your willingness to help him develop as a player. Hopefully, he will be able to move to a different team with a different coach who can bring back some of that confidence.

My 18-year-old is a country boy, too. He wears Wranglers and boots every day and drives a pickup with a 6-inch lift. He's always been mad because we wouldn't pick up and move to the Hill Country and we've often said he's a country boy who's trapped in the city. So what does he do? He signs to play baseball in an even bigger city -- Big D! If you ever want to give him a respite from the Metroplex, feel free to invite him to your place. Wink He'd take you up on your offer in a heartbeat. He loves little kids and I betcha he'd even instill a love for baseball in your son Gage!
Last edited by Infield08
Panther DadPanther Dad5,000+ posts
Jewels,

I understand what you're saying and I do not disagree. Maybe you are referrig to a specific situation or generically to your experiences with your kid(s). But, Ken didn't say that this guy thought of himself as a baseball god -- did he?

Little leagues must rely on volunteers. There are one or two Ken Guthries out there. The rest do the best they can with the knowledge they have --- and yes, some dream dreams for their kids (is that a bad thing these days?). Many of us have coached. Was I a good coach??? I don't know -- who sets the standards? Ken had the benefit of working with this boy for several months before his coach met him (and 13 or so other new kids, all with different personalities and needs). All I could ask for my son is that he land with a coach that is kind, fair, and treats each kid like his own. Of course, many are tougher on their kids than others.

This is a good topic. When I coached, I probably hurt some feelings (unintentionally). I know I was too intense from time to time. But I tried to be fair and respectful of each situation -- and I was willing to learn from my mistakes. It appears to me that many of the top coaches in the world of baseball, at all levels, struggle with life's situations. They drink, they fail to balance work and home, some are cold men. Coaches are human.

There's something about the game. It gets "in" ya. Once it's in ya....it's usually there for life. Smile

Keep the discussion going!
Jewels4BaseballJewels4Baseball100+ posts
PD,
I agree with you. I think I was really speaking more on the two posts before mine. I know Ken catches a lot of c**p on this site...and most of it well deserved I'm sure. I don't know Ken other than what he posts on this site. Some of his stuff I agree with and some I don't. I believe everyone is entitled to their own opinion and I love to read all of the opinions on this forum. Big Grin

I've never really had any bad experiences with my kid as far as his coach was concerned. He learned from a great guy who was a student of the game and didn't make a dime off any of the kids he taught. Yes, he is/was an intense coach, but every kid interacts differently with each person they come in contact with throughout their life. I under that MOST of these youth coaches are volunteers, but we've all seen that ONE coach that was just over the top during the game. I fee quite sure that almost every league has one of those guys. My point was, I agree with Ken. If this kid truely has some self-esteem/confidence issues, then perhaps he would be better suited with another less intense coach.

And yes, most of us have big dreams for our kids...that's not a bad thing!
Last edited by Jewels4Baseball
Ken GuthrieKen Guthrie1,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by skysthelimit:

One reason is, that if a player, that is too old to
be in that particular group, hurts another player
either with a thrown ball or batted ball, the league could be held liable for allowing a player to
play in a division he is not eligible for.


Can a 7 year old boy really injure a 6 year old that bad?

This just amazes me.

Oh, by the way, last years T-Ball team went to State.

State? Are you kidding me?

T-Ball we're talking about here.
skysthelimitskysthelimit100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Ken Guthrie:
quote:
Originally posted by skysthelimit:

One reason is, that if a player, that is too old to
be in that particular group, hurts another player
either with a thrown ball or batted ball, the league could be held liable for allowing a player to
play in a division he is not eligible for.


Can a 7 year old boy really injure a 6 year old that bad?

This just amazes me.

Oh, by the way, last years T-Ball team went to State.

State? Are you kidding me?

T-Ball we're talking about here.


The answer is yes he can. Because you are talking
about 5 and 6 year old T-Ball. Have to be that age as of 4-30-08. vs 7 year old. That is two years at least on some kids. And you know how kids are
He could just push some kid down and that kid breaks
an arm, now you have a big problem. Sorry have seen it happen. Parents sue parents all the time over
things that when we were kids our parents would have
just said "life happens, get over it and get on with it."
So as a volunteer league you have to follow the rules set for your league to protect yourself and all leagues and all leagues have age limit rules. Our insurance company has advised us not to
allow players to play out of the age group because they would not cover any injuries to that player or
to a player that he hurts, and that is for playing
up as well as down.
Unfortunately this is a product of the world we live in at this time.
Last edited by skysthelimit

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