D1 vs JUCO vs Draft

quote:

Originally posted by MaggSteph:
I was wondering if anyone could shed some light. My son is a 2013 and he has offers from both a D1 and a JUCO. He is also listed on the MLB projected draft list. We had never considered a D1 school before as my son wants to play and not sit on the bench. We were recently contacted with a request for my son to throw a private bullpen. The things discussed after peaked our interest tremendously in this school. We will be going for an official visit in the fall.
I am trying to keep my 16 year olds feet firmly planted on the ground but it is becoming increasingly more difficult. Scouts are calling wanting to know when and where he is pitching. We have been told to expect visits within the next 4-6 weeks. I personally would like him to attend school first before accepting an offer in the draft. I'm pretty sure I might be the only one who feels this way. Most of the people around us are pushing him to the draft and away from school. Nobody is considering what is best for him and I am getting very frustrated. Like any 16 year old he has dreams of playing in the Major's one day but I want him to enjoy the experiences of college before heading into a career in this sport. My personal feeling is for him to attend the D1 school as that gives him 3-4 years to get stronger and more mature so that he will be able to handle the minors should he get there.
As a parent what would you do?

I would not listen to anyone else. Do what you will know is best for your son -- whatever that might be. Keep in mind that he has an entire life in front of him, not just a baseball life. (But don't listen to me, either).

A private bullpen session? I assume by a JUCO or D2?
Not sure that's legal for a D1?

Not sure I quite understand the scenario?

If a kid was getting MLB scout action, he would typically be getting multiple D1 contacts also.

While I am a HUGE proponent of going to college, I have to admit its not for everyone.

quote:

My personal feeling is for him to attend the D1 school as that gives him 3-4 years to get stronger and more mature so that he will be able to handle the minors should he get there.

There are two sides to the quoted text above. He will probably get stronger and more mature. He might also begin feeling that he won't want to put up with minor league life quite so easily as he will have other options from his college degree.

This may be a good thing? Or not? But you probably shouldn't assume that 'more mature' = 'capacity to put up with (and rise above) the grind of minor league life.'

I've seen it work both ways.

Many times it depends upon the signing bonus offered and you won't know that for a while, if at all, so I wouldn't get to concerned about it yet and would move forward on the college track. If your son doesn't sign out of HS, the next highest leverage spot for a pitcher is at a JC. At the same time if the bonus is significant you do risk losing it all to injury and/or being a senior sign.

Max leverage - HS
leverage - JC
Some leverage - D1 junior year
no leverage - D1 senior year


Generally speaking the pro clubs are alot more careful with young arms and injuries then many college programs.

quote:

Originally posted by MaggSteph:
We had never considered a D1 school before as my son wants to play and not sit on the bench.

If he turns pro, he will be competing against the best pitchers in the world for one of a very few spots at the Major League level. If he is that good a pitcher (and competitor), no DI pitching staff ought to intimidate him. Rather, he ought to be confident that he can excel there.

Best of luck to your son!

If he is offered 6 or 7 four bonus PLUS college, then I would suggest signing.You can still sign a letter of intent before the draft.Then choose the better of the two.
If pro ball does not work out, your son can go to college paid for by MLB. He would also have money in the bank.
Do not believe college coaches who promise that they will take care of your son's arm. They are out to win because their job depends on it.

quote:

If he is offered 6 or 7 for bonus PLUS college, then I would suggest signing...

I think that depends heavily on each specific family and situation. Lets try not to throw out specific numbers that may work for you...as if others should have the same number.

quote:

If pro ball does not work out, your son can go to college paid for by MLB.

It is my understanding that statistically, there are not many players at all who follow through on this. There really aren't many players in the major leagues who completed 3 years of college and then went back to finish later on either. Nearly zero from what I've read.

There are also some very specific rules about how and when that money can be used. I would suggest anyone strongly considering this option to study all of the rules around it very carefully. Don't wanna get surprised down the line as I specifically know some families who were caught off-guard (to their disadvantage) when they tried to exercise aspects of this option.

quote:

Originally posted by jaggerz:
Do not believe college coaches who promise that they will take care of your son's arm. They are out to win because their job depends on it.

There are certainly plenty of college coaches who fit this description; but, there are also plenty who will make good on that promise. Looking at it strictly from a pragmatic point of view (although there's an ethical/philosophical side, as well), they recognize that their ability to consistently attract top pitchers to their program is to focus upon developing them as pitchers and to protect their arms. Because they continuously attract top pitchers, they tend to represent some of the most successful programs in the country.

How do find out which type you have? Well, you can start by looking at the record books; checking such dimensions as number of innings pitched, frequency of appearances, and pitch counts. However, the best way is to talk with current/recent pitchers and their parents at any program where you have a serious interest.

quote:

Originally posted by gitnby:
A private bullpen session? I assume by a JUCO or D2?
Not sure that's legal for a D1?

Not sure I quite understand the scenario?

If a kid was getting MLB scout action, he would typically be getting multiple D1 contacts also.

Welcome!
I am with you, I am really not sure I understand all that the OP is trying to get across.

Private bullpen for a MLB team or a D1 school? There is no such thing at a D1 program.

What number is he projected on the MLB list? 2013 or those from Canada? If he is projected to be a very high pick (at 17), agents would be knocking at your door. Is that happening?

The draft is 10 months away, at this time your son doesn't have to make any decision other than where he wants to go to school to play ball. Signing at any college does not exclude him from being drafted. He also needs that commitment for better leverage if he is drafted. Again, it's very early in the year, things change.

If you could be a little clearer on what is really going on it may be easier to give better advice.

quote:

Originally posted by jaggerz:
If he is offered 6 or 7 four bonus PLUS college, then I would suggest signing.You can still sign a letter of intent before the draft.Then choose the better of the two.
If pro ball does not work out, your son can go to college paid for by MLB. He would also have money in the bank.
Do not believe college coaches who promise that they will take care of your son's arm. They are out to win because their job depends on it.

The above, IMO is bad advice.
This is a personal decision, everyone's situation is different.
Advice to anyone, know exactly what is included in the MLB scholarship.
Generally, college coaches are pretty concerned about players arms and their reputation.

quote:

Originally posted by TPM:
Private bullpen for a MLB team or a D1 school? There is no such thing at a D1 program.

By rule, no tryouts are allowed at a D1. In actuality, it is done frequently.

[/QUOTE]
By rule, no tryouts are allowed at a D1. In actuality, it is done frequently.[/QUOTE]

Really? Inquiring minds want to know!

quote:

By rule, no tryouts are allowed at a D1. In actuality, it is done frequently.

Have never seen nor heard of it.

I will fully admit I do not know all of the NCAA rules when it comes to recruiting. I can however assure you whether right or wrong there were only 6 people there the day he threw the bullpen for this coach. Those 6 people consisted of myself, my husband, my son, the back catcher, my sons coach and the college coach. I can also assure you it is a D1 school as I have visited the website quite often. My goal here was not to get anyone in trouble. It was to seek out advice from parents who may have gone through this and their experience.

Up until February of this year nobody had really seen my son pitch. He was a relative unknown. He was invited to an MLB invite only Showcase. Since then we have gone to 3 of them. He has been to 1 PG event which was just last month in Atlanta. We have been told that he should go within the first 3 rounds of the draft however as another poster replied a lot can change between now and then. We have done the eye exam, the medical forms and the psych forms which were requested by the scouting bureau in California. He has had mlb scouts at his games getting video of him. They have been contacting him to find out what his fall ball schedule looks like and when he will be pitching.

I really don't understand a lot about how any of this works. The stuff we have been told I take with a grain of salt. I think my head is the only one that is not in the clouds. All I was looking for was different opinions on different routes and as a parent what you would do. I apologize for the confusion.

TPM and justbaseball,
Like MaggSteph, I have no desire to get anyone or any program in trouble, so I'll not be specific. But I know of California D1s that have brought in players for evaluation, either singly or in a very small group. The cases I know of took place in the spring, and involved players who had either been hurt for a substantial period, or who had only recently emerged as worthy of recruiting. In other words, players who are difficult to evaluate through ordinary methods.

Perhaps "frequent" was too strong a word, but it's not uncommon.

Maybe it happens often but I don't know anyone who has tried out for a D1 coach. If that the case I might question the integrity of him and how he runs his program.

If your son is projected that high, has good grades, D1 programs, agents/advisors and scouts would be knocking on his door, you mentioned CA but your location is Canada. Where do you live?

Keep in mind that scouts who tell you where they think your son will fall in the draft is giving wrong information as they do not draft your son, they only recommend him for consideration.

You cannot make the decision for your son but at his age it is your responsibility to understand the pros and cons of milb vs. college for a 17 year old and guide him to make a decision that is best for him and his family.

I understand your concern as a mother. When my son began to get draft interest in HS I made it my business to find out as much as I could about life in the pros vs. college baseball. Perhaps you have been contacted by an agent/advisor, if so, start picking their brains and ask lots of questions.

Again, the only thing that should be considered at this time is the college commitment, the rest will take care of itself. Your son is very young, you may want to consider a year at a high profile JUCO. If he is that good he will be drafted after one year and not have to attend 3 to be eligible for the draft.

Best of luck.

Regarding a private bullpen for a DI: my friend and his son drove 3 hours for such a session. Before the kid threw his first pitch to the catcher (unclear if he was a college catcher or another high schooler), the coach turned to the dad and said "by the way, the cost for our camp today is $5." The dad gave him $5 and his son was now enrolled in the "camp." One way around the rule, I suppose.