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18 replies

...dead ball when a balk

CM Chin Music10+ posts
Runner on first base. Left handed pitcher in set position goes through motion and breaks the plane with his right foot. Seeing 1st base runner go; he then turns foot toward 1st base...umpire calls balk.

Pitcher delivers bad throw to 1st baseman that gets past 1st baseman and runner rounds 2nd and goes onto 3rd base.

High School rules this a dead ball when a balk is called. Return runner on 3rd back to 2nd base.

Is rule the same for other levels of play?
Original Post

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yawetagyawetag100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by piaa_ump:
NFHS rules are the only code where a balk is an immediate dead ball....other notable codes (OBR, NCAA) are delayed dead ball...if all runners including batter runner advance at least one base the balk is ignored.....


PIAA, read the OP again. The pick-off was thrown over F3's head. Therefore, the runner has the opportunity to advance.

So, in OP's situation, the runner would remain on 3B.
yawetagyawetag100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Michael S. Taylor:
Not in HS Andrew, it is an immediate dead ball so you only get one. You would be correct for OBR and college.


Sorry, I read "other notable codes (OBR, NCAA) are delayed dead ball...if all runners including batter runner advance at least one base the balk is ignored....." as one statement and assumed PIAA was speaking of those, not Fed. I also assumed it, as the OP was asking about the rules for non-Fed.

If that's not the case, then I apologize.
Last edited by yawetag
yawetagyawetag100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by JMoff:
Assume OBR.

In this case the batter didn't advance, so I assume you only apply that part of it if there is a batter runner and not when there is only a batter?


No.

R1 and R3. Pitcher balks while pitching to the batter. The pitch is a ball. The balk will be upheld and R1 and R3 advance one base.

In a non-Fed balk, there are five possibilities:
1) The batter hits the pitch and someone doesn't advance a base. Result: balk upheld
2) The batter hits the pitch and everyone advances a base. Result: balk ignored
3) The pitch is completed without the batter hitting the ball. Result: balk upheld
4) A pick-off is not thrown away to allow the runners to advance. Result: balk upheld
5) A pick-off is thrown away, allowing runners to advance at least one base. Result: balk ignored

In basics, if it's a PITCH and the everyone (including the batter) advances one base, the balk is ignored. If it's NOT a pitch, the balk is upheld UNLESS the original pick-off is thrown away.

Note that the pick-off rule doesn't count if a run-down begins and the ball is thrown away.
F fwdcoogMember
quote:
Originally posted by yawetag:
quote:
Originally posted by JMoff:
Assume OBR.

In this case the batter didn't advance, so I assume you only apply that part of it if there is a batter runner and not when there is only a batter?


No.

R1 and R3. Pitcher balks while pitching to the batter. The pitch is a ball. The balk will be upheld and R1 and R3 advance one base.

In a non-Fed balk, there are five possibilities:
1) The batter hits the pitch and someone doesn't advance a base. Result: balk upheld
2) The batter hits the pitch and everyone advances a base. Result: balk ignored
3) The pitch is completed without the batter hitting the ball. Result: balk upheld
4) A pick-off is not thrown away to allow the runners to advance. Result: balk upheld
5) A pick-off is thrown away, allowing runners to advance at least one base. Result: balk ignored

In basics, if it's a PITCH and the everyone (including the batter) advances one base, the balk is ignored. If it's NOT a pitch, the balk is upheld UNLESS the original pick-off is thrown away.

Note that the pick-off rule doesn't count if a run-down begins and the ball is thrown away.



When the ball is batted, is the batter automatically awarded first base whether he is thrown out or not? If he doesn't swing is it a no pitch? Debate whther the Batter is awarded a base as well as the runners on base ...
M Matt1310,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by fwdcoog:
When the ball is batted, is the batter automatically awarded first base whether he is thrown out or not? If he doesn't swing is it a no pitch? Debate whther the Batter is awarded a base as well as the runners on base ...


A batter is never awarded a base due to a balk. A pitch not swung at is not a pitch if there is a balk (unless it is ball four or an uncaught third strike and all runners are forced and the batter-runner reaches first.)
Last edited by Matt13
O otownmike100+ posts
quote:
1) The batter hits the pitch and someone doesn't advance a base. Result: balk upheld

Here is a crazy one....playing 14-under over the weekend - Babe Ruth District Tourney - MLB rules unless a local rule supercedes....balk called with runners on 1B & 2B- batter hits shot to RF on the pitch - RF comes up throwing to 1B and gets BR

By Rule: BR was returned to plate on the balk call and runners had advanced to 2B-3B so they stay there.

From HS-up you don't see BR thrown out at 1B on hit to RF, but this seemed like a weird call.
M Matt1310,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by otownmike:
quote:
1) The batter hits the pitch and someone doesn't advance a base. Result: balk upheld

Here is a crazy one....playing 14-under over the weekend - Babe Ruth District Tourney - MLB rules unless a local rule supercedes....balk called with runners on 1B & 2B- batter hits shot to RF on the pitch - RF comes up throwing to 1B and gets BR

By Rule: BR was returned to plate on the balk call and runners had advanced to 2B-3B so they stay there.

From HS-up you don't see BR thrown out at 1B on hit to RF, but this seemed like a weird call.


Funny you say that--I've seen BR thrown out at first from RF twice this season and one banger that was safe. The first was a HS game, and the other two were summer college-level (although, the weather was responsible for those--with a consistent 35-mph wind coming from right, F9 was playing about 20 feet off the infield dirt.)
M Matt1310,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by luv baseball:
Suppose R2 scores from 2B on the play.

Doesn't the offense have the option of keeping the run?


There is never an option on a balk. Either all runners and the batter-runner reach the next base, and balk is ignored (the play stands,) or not, and the balk is enforced (no pitch, runners advance one base, same count on batter.)
Michael S. TaylorMichael S. Taylor1,000+ posts
There is never an option on a balk, CI yes, but balk, no. In Fed,it is an imediate dead ball so you will just be awarding a base, pitched ball or not. In OBR and NCAA, it is delayed dead ball. If the the pitcher pitches the ball anything that happens, a walk,a hit or even an error that advances ALL the runners plus the batter one base then ignore the balk. If any of these conditions aren't met then enforce the balk, award the base/s, rreturn the batter to the plate with the same count.
yawetagyawetag100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Michael S. Taylor:
If the the pitcher pitches the ball anything that happens, a walk,a hit or even an error that advances ALL the runners plus the batter one base then ignore the balk.


There is one exception that only requires the runners to advance one base. If the balk is committed during a pick-off and the ball is thrown away, runners are allowed to attempt to advance.
Last edited by yawetag

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