The concepts of this sound pretty intreguing.Has anyone read this and can endorse it? It certainly makes sense.
http://www.webball.com/cms/page1792.cfm
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Coach come on this is another sales gimmick in a world full of gimmicks.
i wouldn't call it a gimmick, if house and others are putting their names with it i'd think it has some credentials. however, though it appears interesting, i'd use my $50 to drive to some local colleges/universities or find a clinic to talk how people work hitters, exploit weaknesses, etc. maybe i'm thrifty, but I'd keep looking.
I was exposed to this in the last two Tom House/NPA Coach's Certification clinics I attended. Perry Husband himself gave a presentation at both clinics on effective velocity and at-risk pitches. His website is:
Hitting Is A Guess
You might be able to find more information there. You can also purchase the e-book there as well.
Hitting Is A Guess
You might be able to find more information there. You can also purchase the e-book there as well.
As much as I like Tom House this is re pakaging. You know like the all new dishwashing detergent.
"The philosophy of Effective Velocity helped the Houston Astros win the 2005 National League Championship"
Phil Garner
Phil Garner
Roger explain to me what is so revolutionary about this concept that hasn't existed pryor to this . Or do I have to buy the book tapes etc ?
I'm certainly no expert on this stuff but from my limited exposure, there are two main facets to it. First is the recognition that pitch location affects reaction time (inside pitches hit out front, outside pitches hit further back in the zone) and the quantification of the difference in timing. This part I would agree has been understood for quite some time although maybe that understanding has been more intuitive and less quantified.
The second facet is that of at-risk pitches and the results of throwing such pitches. An at-risk pitch is one that has the same "effective velocity" as the previous pitch. So for example, a 90mph fastball thrown down the middle of the plate has an effective velocity of 84mph when thrown outside (because the batter lets the outside pitch get deeper). At the same time, an 78mph curve has an effective velocity of 84mph when thrown inside (because the batter has to get started sooner to meet the ball out front). Thus, if these two pitches are thrown in this squence, the curve becomes an at-risk pitch. The reason is that after the fastball, that batter's mind adjusted to the timing necessary to hit that pitch. Now the curve comes and even though it has a different real velocity, it has the same effective velocity as the fastball so the batter is already adjusted to that timing.
Perry Husband and others did some research where they looked at pitches thrown during MLB games. For each pitch they looked at, they captured the pitch location and velocity which allowed them to compute the effective velocity. They also captured the result of the pitch. Then they computed what they call a hard hit batting average. In the end, they were able to correlate at-risk pitches to higher hard hit averages. So, sequencing your pitches to avoid at-risk pitches lowers your opponent's hard hit average which is a good thing for you. This is the more "revolutionary" (your word) part.
That's about all I know on this subject so if you want to know more you'll have to buy the book. (No, I don't get any kickbacks. I have no affiliation with Perry Husband nor Hitting Is A Guess.)
The second facet is that of at-risk pitches and the results of throwing such pitches. An at-risk pitch is one that has the same "effective velocity" as the previous pitch. So for example, a 90mph fastball thrown down the middle of the plate has an effective velocity of 84mph when thrown outside (because the batter lets the outside pitch get deeper). At the same time, an 78mph curve has an effective velocity of 84mph when thrown inside (because the batter has to get started sooner to meet the ball out front). Thus, if these two pitches are thrown in this squence, the curve becomes an at-risk pitch. The reason is that after the fastball, that batter's mind adjusted to the timing necessary to hit that pitch. Now the curve comes and even though it has a different real velocity, it has the same effective velocity as the fastball so the batter is already adjusted to that timing.
Perry Husband and others did some research where they looked at pitches thrown during MLB games. For each pitch they looked at, they captured the pitch location and velocity which allowed them to compute the effective velocity. They also captured the result of the pitch. Then they computed what they call a hard hit batting average. In the end, they were able to correlate at-risk pitches to higher hard hit averages. So, sequencing your pitches to avoid at-risk pitches lowers your opponent's hard hit average which is a good thing for you. This is the more "revolutionary" (your word) part.
That's about all I know on this subject so if you want to know more you'll have to buy the book. (No, I don't get any kickbacks. I have no affiliation with Perry Husband nor Hitting Is A Guess.)
Roger there is nothing new about any of this.
I have been around pitchers at all levels for 10+ years. Mt son's doctor is a co author of Tom House. We had a minor league team in our city for 8yrs and I was involved with many of thye pitchers. We have all understood these concepts for years. This guy is repackaging what is already known and putting a fancy label on it.
In a world were guys are looking for answers they are easy pray to slick marketing.
I have been around pitchers at all levels for 10+ years. Mt son's doctor is a co author of Tom House. We had a minor league team in our city for 8yrs and I was involved with many of thye pitchers. We have all understood these concepts for years. This guy is repackaging what is already known and putting a fancy label on it.
In a world were guys are looking for answers they are easy pray to slick marketing.
Bobblehead,
There are many of us newcomers that have not heard what has been out there for years. Where would we go to get that information?
When I read the small part from the web page, it was clear and made sense to me.
When I read Roger Tomas reply, it was clear and made sense to me. Just because something is repackaged existing information, does not mean it is bad.
Two things I would like to know:
1. Where can I go to get the "Original" packaging?
2. Is there anything that is not correct or missing from the website?
Thanks
There are many of us newcomers that have not heard what has been out there for years. Where would we go to get that information?
When I read the small part from the web page, it was clear and made sense to me.
When I read Roger Tomas reply, it was clear and made sense to me. Just because something is repackaged existing information, does not mean it is bad.
Two things I would like to know:
1. Where can I go to get the "Original" packaging?
2. Is there anything that is not correct or missing from the website?
Thanks
Our program had to be built up from one where we struggled to get kids to throw strikes(we went through 17walk and 19walk games on Varsity), but now I've had a mechanics program in place for enough years to finally get the pitchers to throw strikes, so we're looking at the next step. Yes, we've been using location and change of speed, but never have I seen the two put together the way Husband seems to have. If you could steer me to a resource that has this packaged already I would be greatful.
Coach Labeots,
Sent you a PM.
Sent you a PM.
quote:Originally posted by BobbleheadDoll:
Roger there is nothing new about any of this.
I have been around pitchers at all levels for 10+ years. Mt son's doctor is a co author of Tom House. We had a minor league team in our city for 8yrs and I was involved with many of thye pitchers. We have all understood these concepts for years. This guy is repackaging what is already known and putting a fancy label on it.
In a world were guys are looking for answers they are easy pray to slick marketing.
This stuff was new to me. But I haven't been involved with pitchers as long as you nor have I been involved with baseball at the level you have.
So I'll have to take your word.
I always look at things like this skeptically. I receive constant bombardment from this type of stuff > Makes you wonder how pitchers ever got along before.
To the new guys who have not been involved with pitching I suggest you get some good instruction from ML guys. Go to the library there are lots of great instructional books and they are free. Tom House is an excellent writer and his books are great for all levels.
IMOP that many of these guys are just trying to separate themselves from the masses by creating new catch words. It is a way of pumping up sales and not letting their approacg get old.
To the new guys who have not been involved with pitching I suggest you get some good instruction from ML guys. Go to the library there are lots of great instructional books and they are free. Tom House is an excellent writer and his books are great for all levels.
IMOP that many of these guys are just trying to separate themselves from the masses by creating new catch words. It is a way of pumping up sales and not letting their approacg get old.
Cpach L that is a lot of walks. I saw one once with 21 but it was not the pitchers fault. The UMP could not call a CB unless it was right down the center of the plate. It was very long game.
My son had to pitch the second game and he had to use his CB speringly. The coaches to their credit noticed the big outside corner and used it well.
I would also like to point out that there are 3 dimensions to a plate and a great pitcher uses all 3 dimensions. Also look at the type of hitter you are facing and that will give you (cather/coach) a clue on how to pitch him. How well you do will depend a lot on how well you understand who you are facing and how well you control your pitches.
My son had to pitch the second game and he had to use his CB speringly. The coaches to their credit noticed the big outside corner and used it well.
I would also like to point out that there are 3 dimensions to a plate and a great pitcher uses all 3 dimensions. Also look at the type of hitter you are facing and that will give you (cather/coach) a clue on how to pitch him. How well you do will depend a lot on how well you understand who you are facing and how well you control your pitches.
