Fake Bunt

Its called a "Butcher Boy" and is outlawed in most youth leagues.  I am guessing it is allowed by NFHS rules. 

It is.

This is a legal play in NFHS and the higher rule codes....

Might be legal, but I just don't like it. Scares the crap out of me.

IMO, the 3b in HS and above should have the skill set to cope with such a play.  I like the play personally.

Some people teach the slash bunt this way because they don't know any better.

Does or did your son play 3b? My son is probably 50ft from home plate when the batter takes a full cut. What skill set is going to help him here? He is very quick, but a ball that would be smoked right at him, he would have little chance to catch it let alone be able to get out of the way.      

I don't think you're being over protective but if done properly it shouldn't put him at a huge risk.  I'm probably not going to word this very well so please bear with me.

I don't see how the batter can show bunt and take a full cut that would allow him to square up a ball to put the corners in jeopardy.  The purpose of this is to get the IF moving to open gaps to advance runners and hopefully reach base.  I typically play my 3B about bag even (obviously there are situations where I don't) when there is a chance of a bunt.  But I don't have them crash at the sign of a bunt.  I teach them to creep forward to help protect themselves on the off chance the batter pulls back early enough.  Batters should be taught to pull back when they know the corners are committed and then try to put ball in play.  If the corners haven't crashed then the batter should keep showing bunt.  Now he has to wait and if my corners crash after the pitcher has released the ball then it should be very difficult to get a good cut at the ball.

Hope this makes sense.

I understand what you are describing here. In these cases it was clearly a sac bunt situation, tie game 5th inning no outs runners on 1b and 2nd. Batter squares early when pitcher is in the set position. Corners move in about half way (55ft?), Pitcher goes into his motion and batter pulls back into normal stance and takes a full cut.   

Good thing your son isn't a pitcher, they are 55 feet away after every pitch.

I was thinking the exact same thing

He does pitch, and I as well in college during the hot bat era, not the same as a guy turning on a fastball. Still scary though. 

next they will want to play the game with tennis balls

You don't see the pros doing this.

Not the last second, batter shows bunt early corners come half way in, pitcher starts his delivery batter gets back into hitting position, takes a full cut. Corners cannot retreat at this time. It's not a slash, it's a swing. 

I have seen bunt and slash, not bunt and swing. Maybe I don't watch enough TV.

Unfortunately, it can be a necessary counter-move.  If a defense (runner on 1st & 2nd, no out, close game late is perfect example) decides to completely take away the bunt by hard-crashing the corners, this is one of the only options the offense has.  You can push-bunt but that is hard to execute and doesn't scare the defense into something different next time.  With a well run hard-crash where the corners also pinch toward the middle, the slash often results in a weak grounder back to P because there is no apparent hole to push through.

It does change the perspective a bit when you are the parent of one of the corners or the hitter, for that matter.

Thanks Cabbage, just looking for some perspectives from others. My son is a 145lb freshman starting 3b for his HS team. When I see this bigger upper class man fake bunt and hit, it makes me cringe.

My middle one plays the hot corner, my oldest pitches and plays first occasinally, I played 3rd in college. 

If properly coached at third, like some have mentioned, they will be okay.  Not to say that a hot shot is not possible, but I have seen corner guys take hot shots while playing even with the bag and get eaten up.

I was watching some college ball over the weekend, I think it was a UF player that did the fake bunt swing, I think it was Josh Tobias, who happens to be a 3B himself.   It is a great offensive tool to help negate a stingy defense

Down in Florida watching my son's team play and 1st and 2nd no outs bottom of 8th we are down 2 runs.....First pitch Batter squares to bunt the first baseman charges so hard and early I thought he was going to shake hands with the umpire....with him charging and early it would have been very difficult..i said the parents around me I would swing away next pitch...that might make the first baseman stay back a bit..next pitch bunt was taken off and Kid ripped a double....I think it has to be be allowed it is oart of the game...does not mean parents do not have to worry but believe it is part of the game.

Okay the consensus is, I am an overly protective parent. Oh well!

Corner guys crash but stop halfway to home, and wait and see. Still they are only 50-55 feet away.

The batter squares to bunt very early since it is a sac bunt situation, corners crash in and stop about 1/2 way. This is how they are taught at the HS, I am only commenting on what I see.  

Not understanding what is so hard to grasp here. Batter shows bunt "Very" early corners come in about 1/2 way (creep or crash is does not matter) between base and home plate. Pitcher begins his delivery batter pulls up from bunt position and is ready to take a full cut. Corners are still in the same position. 

LET THE BOY PLAY ANOTHER POSITION

Such great advice! Problem is I wasn't looking for it. Just here to get others perspective on the play.  

I agree, this has run its course.

You're being overprotective.  As others have said, that's where pitchers are every pitch.  In addition to that, I don't think the corners are being taught the right way.  I don't think they should ever be that far in when the pitcher is in his windup.  You see the batter square, move in MAYBE 10 feet from the basepath and be moving slowly forward so your momentum is carrying you towards the plate when the pitch is delivered.  The big thing is, you don't want to be caught off guard by a bunt.  If you are in a little and inching forward at the pitch and the ball is bunted, you still have plenty of time to make the play.  If you don't, the batter executed a perfect bunt and you just have to take your hat off.  JMHO.

batter is already showing bunt before pitcher is even in his set position (pitcher is still getting his sign from the catcher). Have you not ever seen a hitter give him self up early?

Standballdad,

I hear ya.  I'm also pretty shocked this was hard for alot to comprehend.  I see it all the time in our HS conference.  Mainly, this is a coaching decision/how the coach instructs their corner IF guys to crash.  When a batter shows bunt early, I see many coaches instruct their 3B to rush in close like you said.  I mean CLOSE.  Last year I personally saw a 3B almost get his head taken off from about 20 ft.  

I never have my defense do this, but I never go a season without seeing it multiple times.  Batter squares early, 3B or 1B runs in about 30 ft away and stays there.  Pitcher is going through motion-and batter is still squared for bunt.  Pitch is just about to be released and then the batter starts to pull it back for a hack.  Leaves those corner IF guys with little to zero chance to react.

When the batter pulls back to swing, the 3B does not have much time to react.  I've seen some guys stop and quickly try to run back.  2 years ago I saw a 3B just dive/jump over the line into foul territory to avoid getting nailed.  

Granted, this is a rare occurrence.  And yes, pitchers are that close all the time. 

Thank You! I thought maybe I was starting to imagine things.

I agree with these statements.  Hope I'm not taking your comments out of context James G. 

Standballdad, I understand perfectly what you are saying the situation is.  Like I said in my previous post, I'm just not sure I agree with how the corners are being taught to defense this.

I don't have a problem with the batter strategy.  It's part of baseball.  Fielders should play it different.

Not disagreeing with you, but this is how the Coaches have taught it. I am only a spectator dad. I leave the coaching up to the coaches, just wanted to get some other perspectives. Thanks

I understand.  My son is a pitcher, so I pretty much feel that way everytime a ball goes screaming by his head, or between his legs from 50-55 ft. away.  Haha.  It really is just part of the game.  Baseball is a game played with a HARD ball being thrown and hit by big strong guys.  There is an inherent risk involved.  Unless you completely want to change the game, there is nothing you can do about it.  Take a deep breath, thank god nothing happened on that play and enjoy the next one.

I don't think that you send your corners crashing at the first sign of the bunt because that helps the offense make the decision to pull back and take a cut.  Let me see if I can't paint the picture - probably bunt situation so you have corners playing even or slightly up about 2 or 3 steps.  Batter shows bunt early but the corners don't crash.  Pitcher comes set and corners take a creep step or two.  So at this point they are probably 75 - 80 feet from the plate.  Once the pitcher has reached the point of no return on his delivery if the batter is still showing bunt then you crash.  At this point the batter cannot pull back and take a full cut.  They can pull back and slash to contact but it shouldn't be a screamer due to the fact that most of their muscles will be tensed on the quick pull back.

Hope that makes sense.

I understand what you are saying. My sons says coaches want him to crash 1/2 way and stop, once it is clear batter cannot pull back they continue to move forward.

Just to clarify one point about the youth leagues.  It's my understanding that Little League allows "slash hitting".  I agree that it's part of the game but that should be on full-sized fields...not 60 foot bases for 12 year olds and younger.  We tried to disallow it as a local rule but the umpires would not enforce it.  With all of the emphasis on safety, this is an example  how Little League Baseball chokes on a gnat but swallows a camel!    

I also disagree with Standball that the batter will likely not square the ball up with power while slash hitting.  It requires very good timing but pulling the bat back from the bunt position can actually relax the batter more as it is puts the batter in a good "load position".  I witnessed an 11 year old send one over the ear of our charging third baseman for a double down the LF line...it was scary.