Connor Gillespie, the 37th overall pick in the 2008 draft (Giants) got his first career hit against Dan Haren tonight. Not bad for a kid who was playing Rookie ball in Phoenix last week.
Original Post
Replies sorted oldest to newest
Way to go!
All teams should bring up some of their rising young prospects in september (especially those that aren't in the race) for experience. Kudos to the Giants.
All teams should bring up some of their rising young prospects in september (especially those that aren't in the race) for experience. Kudos to the Giants.
Sure looks like the decade for talented 3b!
That is a great story. It made me smile.
I'll bet he thought it was a prank when he actually got the call up.
I'll bet he thought it was a prank when he actually got the call up.
quote:Originally posted by TPM:
Way to go!
All teams should bring up some of their rising young prospects in september (especially those that aren't in the race) for experience. Kudos to the Giants.
It's not always as easy as just bringing up guys for experience, though. In order to bring up a player, he has to be added to the 40 man roster. There are times when the 40 man roster is already full, and there are only a few ways to open up a roster spot (and many of these options mean the team loses the rights to the player being removed from the 40 man roster).
The 40 man roster is is more business than baseball---it involves protection of players as well as players you may or may not use during September
The Jays did and they are doing better than some of the starters.
When players are called up from the minors it starts the clock on arbitration and free agent eligibility. This is why you don't see players called up unless they are needed or expected to stick with the team the following year.quote:Originally posted by TPM:
Way to go!
All teams should bring up some of their rising young prospects in september (especially those that aren't in the race) for experience. Kudos to the Giants.
That guy is a gamer! At WSU he was a stud.
quote:Originally posted by RJM:When players are called up from the minors it starts the clock on arbitration and free agent eligibility. This is why you don't see players called up unless they are needed or expected to stick with the team the following year.quote:Originally posted by TPM:
Way to go!
All teams should bring up some of their rising young prospects in september (especially those that aren't in the race) for experience. Kudos to the Giants.
Or it is written in their contract as rumored with Gillespie.
quote:Originally posted by Emanski's Heroes:quote:Originally posted by TPM:
Way to go!
All teams should bring up some of their rising young prospects in september (especially those that aren't in the race) for experience. Kudos to the Giants.
It's not always as easy as just bringing up guys for experience, though. In order to bring up a player, he has to be added to the 40 man roster. There are times when the 40 man roster is already full, and there are only a few ways to open up a roster spot (and many of these options mean the team loses the rights to the player being removed from the 40 man roster).
First, rosters expand in September and second I wasn't just talking about any player but one that they consider to make an impact the next year, this is for experience.
Giants seem not to be afraid to do that, or some other teams.
It might have been a stipulation in his milb contract so he would sign.
The MLB roster expands in September. But there is a 40 man roster year round. As noted by a previous poster to place a player on the 40 man roster means removing a player. The move runs the risk of losing that player through waivers.
quote:Originally posted by RJM:
The MLB roster expands in September. But there is a 40 man roster year round. As noted by a previous poster to place a player on the 40 man roster means removing a player. The move runs the risk of losing that player through waivers.
For anyone that missed it, I did say septmeber in my original post.
There is a year round 40 man roster.** When MLB teams call players up in September they have to be on that 40 man roster. If they're not they have to be added. Younger players usually are not on the 40 man roster. To be added someone has to be dropped. A dropped player can be claimed on waivers. It could cost the team a prospect who has been called up and sent down.quote:Originally posted by TPM:quote:Originally posted by RJM:
The MLB roster expands in September. But there is a 40 man roster year round. As noted by a previous poster to place a player on the 40 man roster means removing a player. The move runs the risk of losing that player through waivers.
For anyone that missed it, I did say september in my original post.
** Look on a minor league roster during the season. There's a column that says 40 man roster. The player is listed as Yes or No. You will usually see this at the AAA level. The players who go up and down all year are on the 40 man roster along with others. After a player is in baseball X number of year he has to be on the 40 man roster or risk being claimed by another team.
But more importantly for financially frugal teams, calling up a player in September starts the arbitration and free agency clock ticking.
RJM,
I didn't mean that they should call up every young on stud, but perhaps those that will fill a spot on the 40 man next year, to give him experience, or the young player already on the roster who came up for a game or two and sent back down. Or the player with a MLB contract when he was drafted. September is a good time to work out some kinks for these players.
I know that this usually happens when a player is close to his 5 years (6 for new draftees) but CG was a recent draft pick doing well and I like that he was given a spot and a chance.
Thanks for the explanation anyway.
I didn't mean that they should call up every young on stud, but perhaps those that will fill a spot on the 40 man next year, to give him experience, or the young player already on the roster who came up for a game or two and sent back down. Or the player with a MLB contract when he was drafted. September is a good time to work out some kinks for these players.
I know that this usually happens when a player is close to his 5 years (6 for new draftees) but CG was a recent draft pick doing well and I like that he was given a spot and a chance.
Thanks for the explanation anyway.
quote:Originally posted by TPM:
but CG was a recent draft pick doing well and I like that he was given a spot and a chance.
IMHO the Giants must be thin in talent and have no respect for their other prospects if they feel a kid who playing in the AZ is ready for the bigs according to the above scenario. Below was his pre-draft scouting report. Nice but not good enough for a big league call up without minor league experience. Heck he he only has 24 rookie games, 90 AB, and a .269 MILB average
Hitting Ability: It's Gillaspie's best tool. He's a very good hitter who has a good idea of what he's doing at the plate.
Power: He doesn't have much and doesn't profile to have much. He's a base-hit machine.
Running Speed: He's got below-average speed.
Base running: Despite not being fleet footed, he's an excellent base runner and uses his smarts to steal some bases.
Arm Strength: He's got an average arm at third.
Fielding: He'll make for an adequate third baseman.
Range: His range is a little limited, but it's OK.
Physical Description: Gillaspie is a left-handed hitting third baseman in a Bill Mueller-type mold.
Medical Update: A small back issue kept him out of action for a little while, but he appears fine now.
Strengths: Pure hitting ability.
Weaknesses: Lack of power keeps him from having a true profile position.
The pro stuff is way outta my league, but to say:
.....OUCH.
Somebody thought the kid was good enough to get a shot. Shouldnt the rest of us applaud him for getting a chance and wish him well?
Am I missing something here?
quote:the Giants must be thin in talent and have no respect for their other
.....OUCH.
Somebody thought the kid was good enough to get a shot. Shouldnt the rest of us applaud him for getting a chance and wish him well?
Am I missing something here?
All I'm saying it has to be contract related and not proven ability
I think he had some unique language written into his contract. I don't know whether he got a major league deal or if other provisions were outlined. Not sure how they get around the 40 man roster issue, but the SF Chronicle joked that Gillespie was up with the big club on a scholarship.
quote:All I'm saying it has to be contract related and not proven ability
I see.
( thanks )
Who cares how he got there, he got there, and got a hit to boot.
Not many get that opportunity. Ever. Even if for one game.
Not many get that opportunity. Ever. Even if for one game.
quote:he got there, and got a hit to boot. Not many get that opportunity. Ever. Even if for one game.
Yep. That was kind of my thinking too. I'll clap for continued success to him!
This why I feel it was only a business move assiciated with contract verbage or a hand shake.
I feel for players like 22 yr old Josh Mazzola who playes for the Giants Adv A team who was passed up for a call up with these 2008 numbers.
Mazzola stats
Its not what you are, but who you are in many cases and thats why I wont tip my hat to Gillespie.
I feel for players like 22 yr old Josh Mazzola who playes for the Giants Adv A team who was passed up for a call up with these 2008 numbers.
Mazzola stats
Its not what you are, but who you are in many cases and thats why I wont tip my hat to Gillespie.
quote:Originally posted by TPM:
Who cares how he got there, he got there, and got a hit to boot.
Not many get that opportunity. Ever. Even if for one game.
In my school they taught us that you earned your rewards.
rz1 and RJM have this right.
The Giants are thin, very thin, very very thin. As a result, the did not have to waive anyone off the 40 man to provide a spot for Gillespie. I think the Giants have had something like 22 players on the ML roster at points during this year without MLB experience. They are moving players from A ball to MLB. Check out Pablo Sandoval. Started in high A and ends up being a top line player since called up. Until he got hurt, their starting shortstop moved from high A to MLB. Their 2B at the start of this season was a Rule V kid who played behind our son in the Jays minor league system. The Giants had decimated their minor league system for years. The guys there now have a huge advantage over systems with depth in Milb and on the MLB roster.
Secondly, it was contract related.
Third, they did not do the same for Buster Posey, the first round pick.
Finally, Gillespie got up to the major league team and promptly announced he was good enough to play at this level. Boy, that got met with a deep freeze from the players who worked their bu** to get to this level.
For those who love the fast riser, this has nothing to do with earning anything. It was contract related.
Fast risers have to prove themselves. Some do, some don't, It surely is wonderful that Gillespie got this chance.
If you want to applaud someone who has paid his dues, applaud the career 36 year old career minor leaguer who also got a chance with the Sept. call up and hit his first Major league homerun.
The Giants are thin, very thin, very very thin. As a result, the did not have to waive anyone off the 40 man to provide a spot for Gillespie. I think the Giants have had something like 22 players on the ML roster at points during this year without MLB experience. They are moving players from A ball to MLB. Check out Pablo Sandoval. Started in high A and ends up being a top line player since called up. Until he got hurt, their starting shortstop moved from high A to MLB. Their 2B at the start of this season was a Rule V kid who played behind our son in the Jays minor league system. The Giants had decimated their minor league system for years. The guys there now have a huge advantage over systems with depth in Milb and on the MLB roster.
Secondly, it was contract related.
Third, they did not do the same for Buster Posey, the first round pick.
Finally, Gillespie got up to the major league team and promptly announced he was good enough to play at this level. Boy, that got met with a deep freeze from the players who worked their bu** to get to this level.
For those who love the fast riser, this has nothing to do with earning anything. It was contract related.
Fast risers have to prove themselves. Some do, some don't, It surely is wonderful that Gillespie got this chance.
If you want to applaud someone who has paid his dues, applaud the career 36 year old career minor leaguer who also got a chance with the Sept. call up and hit his first Major league homerun.
quote:Originally posted by infielddad:
It surely is wonderful that Gillespie got this chance.
I think that is the point.
What about the 160 or so guys in the Giants Milb system who worked their a** off who didn't?
They sent OF Clay Timpner to AAA....to make room Gillespie.
What do you expect him to say when he get there, I am not ready?
Maybe he was watching TV and what a potential VP said, I am ready!
What do you expect him to say when he get there, I am not ready?
Maybe he was watching TV and what a potential VP said, I am ready!
Bitterness received and acknowledged, but I'm not sure it's warranted IFD. Giants fans were clamoring for fresh faces when the vets were playing. Now they get a truly fresh face, and we hear that the kid hasn't paid his dues. Lincecum sure didn't stay in the minors very long.
I'd expect him to say how grateful he is to get a chance, how excited he is, and how he looks working forward to working his a** off to earn his spot.
Gillespie has certainly done a lot in Milb to "earn" that promotion?
Timpner, a darn good player who has worked hard and proven himself throughout the Giants system sure got treated well,huh?
Gillespie has certainly done a lot in Milb to "earn" that promotion?
Timpner, a darn good player who has worked hard and proven himself throughout the Giants system sure got treated well,huh?
spizzle,
No problems here with Sandoval, Velez, Scheurholtz and each and every one of those guys who worked, worked, and worked.
My son worked for the San Jose Giants this year and sent me a video of Sandoval getting blown up in a huge collision at home plate. That was in June and he was raving about Sandoval. Lincecum stayed in Milb long enough to prove he had nothing to prove at that level. I forget exactly but in AAA ball didn't he have an ERA under .50 after about 10 starts.
We are going pretty far astray comparing Gillespie and Lincecum or Sandoval, or Velez or any of these guys who truly earned that opportunity.
No problems here with Sandoval, Velez, Scheurholtz and each and every one of those guys who worked, worked, and worked.
My son worked for the San Jose Giants this year and sent me a video of Sandoval getting blown up in a huge collision at home plate. That was in June and he was raving about Sandoval. Lincecum stayed in Milb long enough to prove he had nothing to prove at that level. I forget exactly but in AAA ball didn't he have an ERA under .50 after about 10 starts.
We are going pretty far astray comparing Gillespie and Lincecum or Sandoval, or Velez or any of these guys who truly earned that opportunity.
quote:We are going pretty far astray comparing Gillespie and Lincecum or Sandoval, or Velez or any of these guys who truly earned that opportunity.
True. Maybe Gillespie's contractual antics will backfire and he'll be forever again a minor leaguer. On the other hand, he did make the most of his ABs so far, and getting a base knock off a guy who was dealing was an encouraging sign for a kid who's still wet behind the ears.
I saw a funny quip about Sandoval. He was nailed by a foul while standing in the on deck circle, and shook it off. All his coaches could offer was they were surprised that he didn't swing at it.
Now if you want to talk about Sandoval, I'm in!!!
Catches, plays 1B/3B. Plays hard and well, very well.
Even has Carney Lansford, a rigid plate discipline guy, doing soft toss with balls over his head, in the dirt, inside, outside, just like Sandoval's approach in a game.
Now that kid is fun to watch and has earned every AB...and more.
For Gillespie, I wish him well. There isn't any doubt he has worked hard to get to this point.
But one thing I learned about Milb is they quickly find your weakness. When they do, they consistently pound it until you prove you can adjust. Gillespie will encounter that next season. That is when he will find out whether he "can play at this level."
The Giant's have bet a lot of money he and Posey will succeed when their weaknesses are discovered.
Being a Giants fan, I hope they are right.
Catches, plays 1B/3B. Plays hard and well, very well.
Even has Carney Lansford, a rigid plate discipline guy, doing soft toss with balls over his head, in the dirt, inside, outside, just like Sandoval's approach in a game.
Now that kid is fun to watch and has earned every AB...and more.
For Gillespie, I wish him well. There isn't any doubt he has worked hard to get to this point.
But one thing I learned about Milb is they quickly find your weakness. When they do, they consistently pound it until you prove you can adjust. Gillespie will encounter that next season. That is when he will find out whether he "can play at this level."
The Giant's have bet a lot of money he and Posey will succeed when their weaknesses are discovered.
Being a Giants fan, I hope they are right.
I don't know the player your posting on but if he went from rookie ball to the MLB I would guess it was in his contract. I wish him good luck and hope he does well.
One thing I learned about this sport it will humble you... It may be in rookie ball, AA, or not until your in the MLB...but it will humble you.
Working your way up through the system you gain invaluable experience on the game and the game behind the game.
One thing I learned about this sport it will humble you... It may be in rookie ball, AA, or not until your in the MLB...but it will humble you.
Working your way up through the system you gain invaluable experience on the game and the game behind the game.
quote:Originally posted by TPM:quote:Originally posted by Emanski's Heroes:quote:Originally posted by TPM:
Way to go!
All teams should bring up some of their rising young prospects in september (especially those that aren't in the race) for experience. Kudos to the Giants.
It's not always as easy as just bringing up guys for experience, though. In order to bring up a player, he has to be added to the 40 man roster. There are times when the 40 man roster is already full, and there are only a few ways to open up a roster spot (and many of these options mean the team loses the rights to the player being removed from the 40 man roster).
First, rosters expand in September and second I wasn't just talking about any player but one that they consider to make an impact the next year, this is for experience.
Giants seem not to be afraid to do that, or some other teams.
It might have been a stipulation in his milb contract so he would sign.
The 40 man roster never expands. The 25 man active roster expands allowing teams to call up anyone who is on their 40 man roster. However, if a player isn't on the 40 man roster, he can't just be added unless the team has less than 40 players on the 40 man roster. A spot has to be opened up to allow the player to be added.
There are some ways to open a roster spot without losing a player (such as the 60 day DL). In this case, the Giants outrighted Timpner to AAA in order to remove him from the 40 man roster. They didn't lose the rights to Timpner, but they can't outright him in the future without his consent.
From this morning's SF Chronicle:
The kid: Manager Bruce Bochy said he might find one start at third base for 2008 draft pick Conor Gillaspie, who got his first big-league hit against Dan Haren on Tuesday night.
"Being that he's left-handed, I think (today) would be a good day for him," Bochy joked. The Giants face Randy Johnson.
More seriously, Bochy said of Gillaspie, "He's not ready for the major leagues right now, but he's close. He's going to be on a fast pace. When you come up here the year you're drafted, that's probably added pressure on you as a player. You get drafted and dream of making it to the major leagues, and you're here already. I like the way he carries himself. I like the way he's worked."
The Giants' top draft pick, Buster Posey, is expected to visit China Basin on Tuesday for the first time. He will be introduced to season-ticket holders and perhaps take batting practice.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/09/17/SPRF12VP40.DTL
The kid: Manager Bruce Bochy said he might find one start at third base for 2008 draft pick Conor Gillaspie, who got his first big-league hit against Dan Haren on Tuesday night.
"Being that he's left-handed, I think (today) would be a good day for him," Bochy joked. The Giants face Randy Johnson.
More seriously, Bochy said of Gillaspie, "He's not ready for the major leagues right now, but he's close. He's going to be on a fast pace. When you come up here the year you're drafted, that's probably added pressure on you as a player. You get drafted and dream of making it to the major leagues, and you're here already. I like the way he carries himself. I like the way he's worked."
The Giants' top draft pick, Buster Posey, is expected to visit China Basin on Tuesday for the first time. He will be introduced to season-ticket holders and perhaps take batting practice.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/09/17/SPRF12VP40.DTL
While I agree with those of you that have posted that Gillaspie's trip to the majors this fall was unfair to those who have paid their dues - and I am never in favor of people jumping ahead in line, I think that this promotion was due to an agent who was pretty darn shrewd. Getting him to the majors this year kicks off the major league service clock. 3 years from now he will be eligible for arbitration and 6 years from now free agency. With a normal, even a fast path to the majors, all of that would be shifted back 2-3 years. Gillaspie held out to the end - and then signed for slot money. I think this call up was the payoff for that holdout.
quote:Originally posted by 08Dad:
While I agree with those of you that have posted that Gillaspie's trip to the majors this fall was unfair to those who have paid their dues - and I am never in favor of people jumping ahead in line, I think that this promotion was due to an agent who was pretty darn shrewd. Getting him to the majors this year kicks off the major league service clock. 3 years from now he will be eligible for arbitration and 6 years from now free agency. With a normal, even a fast path to the majors, all of that would be shifted back 2-3 years. Gillaspie held out to the end - and then signed for slot money. I think this call up was the payoff for that holdout.
He won't get enough service time this year to affect his arbitration or his free agency. Just because he's in the majors this year doesn't mean he has a year of service time. If he sticks in the majors early next year (unlikely), he would be arbitration eligible after the 2011 season and a free agent after the 2014 season.
It is possible that he could get called up later next year and the combination of service time from this season and next season could mean one year of service time in total. Even in that case, the earliest he'd be eligible for arbitration would still be after 2011, and free agency after 2014.
By the way, when you say "3 years from now he will be eligible for arbitration and 6 years from now free agency", I am assuming you mean three seasons from now with this season being season one. So I think you're thinking he'd be arbitration eligible after 2010. If I misinterpreted what you wrote, I apologize.
If he wasn't on the 40 man before now, he will now start using up options by being called up. Options are based on years. You can go up and down 4 or 5 times in the same year and it is considered one option. 40 man guys invited to MLB spring training use up an option when sent to the minor leagues. They can get recalled, sent down, recalled again and sent down again that season and it is one option used. That's why so many of these types are call ups in September while others who might appear more deserving are not called up. 3 options and they have to keep the player on the 25 man MLB roster, or waive the player. That takes three years once the they've been in the Major Leagues.
All that said, this does start Gillaspie early, regarding options available to the MLB club. I really don't understand it, other than it must have been some kind of a contractual agreement when he signed.
All that said, this does start Gillaspie early, regarding options available to the MLB club. I really don't understand it, other than it must have been some kind of a contractual agreement when he signed.
I knew that name sounded familier, My son a freshman at the time faced off against Conner Gillaspie in 2007.
I did not know he faced such a big prospect??
EH
Wichita State 8th - Krol hit by pitch (1-1). Dirks singled to left field
(0-0); Krol advanced to second. Workman out at first p to 2b, SAC, bunt (0-1);
Dirks advanced to second; Krol advanced to third. J. Durrance to p for B.
Enright. Sublett struck out looking (2-2). Gillaspie grounded out to 2b (0-1).
0 runs, 1 hit, 0 errors, 2 LOB.
I did not know he faced such a big prospect??
EH
Wichita State 8th - Krol hit by pitch (1-1). Dirks singled to left field
(0-0); Krol advanced to second. Workman out at first p to 2b, SAC, bunt (0-1);
Dirks advanced to second; Krol advanced to third. J. Durrance to p for B.
Enright. Sublett struck out looking (2-2). Gillaspie grounded out to 2b (0-1).
0 runs, 1 hit, 0 errors, 2 LOB.