I sure hope RG3 is ok.
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his future may be endangered
quote:Originally posted by smalltownmom:
I sure hope RG3 is ok.
Me too!
quote:Originally posted by smalltownmom:
I sure hope RG3 is ok.
I do too.
Latest unconfirmed report is RGIII has minor tears in the ACL and LCL. RGIII is heading to FL for further examination by the team doctor (Dr James Andrew). MRI was supposedly inconclusive due to his previous injury in college.
FWIW - Shanahan has been under heavy criticism in the local media (and fans) for allowing RGIII to continue to play after aggravating his knee early in the game. It was pretty obvious in the 2nd quarter.
My observations were why did the Redskins give up on the run game? It was working. What was Kyle thinking? And why not go to "Captain Kirk" Cousins for the 2nd half? He proved he is a capable backup after coming in for Griffin against the Ravens (lead them to an OT victory) and with his start against Cleveland (yeah I know the Browns are not that good but still.....). I'd much rather go with a 100% Cousins than a RGIII at only 60%. Just what were they thinking?
Yes, RGIII said he was okay, but somewhere along the line, a veteran coach has to draw the line and decide what is best for the "team". This sounds oh so familiar - Strasburg last year........
For the record I am not a Redskins fan, but I do live in Redskins territory and like many, like to watch him play.
Sounds like reconstructive knee surgery is on the way...and that's on a knee he's already had ACL surgery before on, right? He's a good kid...hope he can recover.
As a Seahawk fan, I was really upset to see RGIII go down. I'm glad it wasn't a Hawk that hit and injured him.
He seems to be a great person and competitor, I hope he recovers successfully and has a great career.
He seems to be a great person and competitor, I hope he recovers successfully and has a great career.
Jason Whitlock is probably happy. RG3 isn't down for the cause. He's just a cornball brother.
Shanahan is no rookie coach. When he saw his QB hobbling around after the hit before the 2nd TD he should have taken him out. Period. It's not like RG3 was effective after that. The offense was stagnant.
This loss and this kid's career are squarely on Shanahan's shoulders IMO.
This loss and this kid's career are squarely on Shanahan's shoulders IMO.
Me too. I have to admit I have not been a Redskins fan since I moved into Redskins country back in 1987. Since RG3 has come to this team, I've adopted the Redskins as my NFC team to follow. He is an intelligent young man, very well spoken, and an absolute thrill to watch. He is wise beyond his years. He is a fantastic example for young kids to follow as well. My fingers are crossed that he'll get past this injury.quote:I sure hope RG3 is ok.
It makes no sense why everybody is throwing Shanahan under the bus. The doctors cleared him to play and he is the starting QB. Even Griffith himself said he was good to go. The prevailing thought is he's better than the bench scrub at 100 percent. Lose and you got all off season to heal so you go with the best shot to win and if that was a QB at less than 100 percent, then so be it. This is why these players are payed millions of dollars.
quote:Originally posted by RJM:
Jason Whitlock is probably happy. RG3 isn't down for the cause. He's just a cornball brother.
Rob Parker not Jason Whitlock.
quote:Originally posted by zombywoof:
It makes no sense why everybody is throwing Shanahan under the bus. The doctors cleared him to play and he is the starting QB. Even Griffith himself said he was good to go. The prevailing thought is he's better than the bench scrub at 100 percent. Lose and you got all off season to heal so you go with the best shot to win and if that was a QB at less than 100 percent, then so be it. This is why these players are payed millions of dollars.
zomby, there is no way the back up (Cousins) could have been worse than RG3 in that 2nd half. He was playing on one leg which hindered his throwing as well as his running. Cousins showed he is more than adequate in two recent games.
They told the story during the game that when Griffith was originally hurt Shanahan said the doctor (Andrews) cleared him to come back into the game after checking him out. Later Andrews said he never checked him out or clear him. Sounds like Shanahan is risking this kid's future for one more super run before he hands the team over to junior.
I am a big Seahawks fan...but nobody likes or wants to see anybody get hurt, much less a dynamic, young player who appears well on his way to becoming the face of his franchise (if not the entire league). I hope and pray he will be OK, at least by the beginning of next season.
[I say that selfishly, too - I drafted RGIII in a keeper league, and really want to keep him; the consolation is I also drafted Albert Morris, and he is a potential keeper as well, if RGIII isn't healthy in time.]
FWIW, as I was watching the game, I thought Griffin should have been pulled in the second quarter. Maybe not after that first hit (though yes, he was limping around even then), but for sure after he came up really limping after falling without being hit in the second quarter. He never stopped limping after that; the threat of him running was essentially gone, and his plant leg was gone and he lost all accuracy on his throws. As several have said, Kirk Cousins played very well in Griffin's absence earlier this year, and I have a hard time believing he couldn't do better than Griffin from that point on. And more to the point: that's what would have been best for Griffin and the franchise, even if it meant a loss was more likely.
Even the sack just before the play where RGIII's knee buckled was a late opportunity to pull him. That was the kind of play where he would normally evade the rusher, but he came nowhere close to doing so - and BOTH legs got folded under him in a fairly gruesome way. I was suprised he got up as quickly as he did. If I were Shanahan, if I hadn't seen enough already (which I had), that HAD to do it. Yet...no, and the very next play it happened.
I'm sure that Shanahan is getting all the flack from 'Skins fans that FoxDad says he is, and I couldn't agree more with fillsfan that he deserves that criticism. Interestingly though, the story here in Seattle is more about the poor condition of the turf and whether that contributed not only to RGIII's injury, but also the ACL injury suffered by the Seahawks' leading pash rusher, Chris Clemons. And regardless of whether either injury can be said to have been CAUSED by the turf condition (maybe, maybe not - but it sure didn't help), that criticism is entirely justified, too. I don't think I've ever seen a field in poorer condition for an NFL game. I've seen better conditions on rain-soaked northwest high school fields.
In answer to FoxDad's question, "why did the Redskins give up on the run game? It was working" I would say that it stopped working because it became obvious that the Seahawks no longer had to key on RGIII running. They keyed on Morris and dared them to throw, and Griffin wasn't healthy enough to do it effectively. Of course, that begs your question about why they didn't go to Cousins, but there you go.
Finally, fenwaysouth wrote:
"I have to admit I have not been a Redskins fan since I moved into Redskins country back in 1987. Since RG3 has come to this team, I've adopted the Redskins as my NFC team to follow. He is an intelligent young man, very well spoken, and an absolute thrill to watch. He is wise beyond his years. He is a fantastic example for young kids to follow as well."
I had to comment on this, because as true as it is w/r/t RGIII, you could have written this EXACT paragraph about Russell Wilson! The quality of the 2012 rookie class, particularly at QB (but certainly not limited to QBs) is really unbelievable.
Thoughts and prayers to Mr. Griffin for a speedy recovery. You made the 2012 NFL season one of the most enjoyable to watch in many, many years. I'm anxious for more...get well.
[I say that selfishly, too - I drafted RGIII in a keeper league, and really want to keep him; the consolation is I also drafted Albert Morris, and he is a potential keeper as well, if RGIII isn't healthy in time.]
FWIW, as I was watching the game, I thought Griffin should have been pulled in the second quarter. Maybe not after that first hit (though yes, he was limping around even then), but for sure after he came up really limping after falling without being hit in the second quarter. He never stopped limping after that; the threat of him running was essentially gone, and his plant leg was gone and he lost all accuracy on his throws. As several have said, Kirk Cousins played very well in Griffin's absence earlier this year, and I have a hard time believing he couldn't do better than Griffin from that point on. And more to the point: that's what would have been best for Griffin and the franchise, even if it meant a loss was more likely.
Even the sack just before the play where RGIII's knee buckled was a late opportunity to pull him. That was the kind of play where he would normally evade the rusher, but he came nowhere close to doing so - and BOTH legs got folded under him in a fairly gruesome way. I was suprised he got up as quickly as he did. If I were Shanahan, if I hadn't seen enough already (which I had), that HAD to do it. Yet...no, and the very next play it happened.
I'm sure that Shanahan is getting all the flack from 'Skins fans that FoxDad says he is, and I couldn't agree more with fillsfan that he deserves that criticism. Interestingly though, the story here in Seattle is more about the poor condition of the turf and whether that contributed not only to RGIII's injury, but also the ACL injury suffered by the Seahawks' leading pash rusher, Chris Clemons. And regardless of whether either injury can be said to have been CAUSED by the turf condition (maybe, maybe not - but it sure didn't help), that criticism is entirely justified, too. I don't think I've ever seen a field in poorer condition for an NFL game. I've seen better conditions on rain-soaked northwest high school fields.
In answer to FoxDad's question, "why did the Redskins give up on the run game? It was working" I would say that it stopped working because it became obvious that the Seahawks no longer had to key on RGIII running. They keyed on Morris and dared them to throw, and Griffin wasn't healthy enough to do it effectively. Of course, that begs your question about why they didn't go to Cousins, but there you go.
Finally, fenwaysouth wrote:
"I have to admit I have not been a Redskins fan since I moved into Redskins country back in 1987. Since RG3 has come to this team, I've adopted the Redskins as my NFC team to follow. He is an intelligent young man, very well spoken, and an absolute thrill to watch. He is wise beyond his years. He is a fantastic example for young kids to follow as well."
I had to comment on this, because as true as it is w/r/t RGIII, you could have written this EXACT paragraph about Russell Wilson! The quality of the 2012 rookie class, particularly at QB (but certainly not limited to QBs) is really unbelievable.
Thoughts and prayers to Mr. Griffin for a speedy recovery. You made the 2012 NFL season one of the most enjoyable to watch in many, many years. I'm anxious for more...get well.
Edgarfan,quote:Edgarfan posted:
Finally, fenwaysouth wrote: "I have to admit I have not been a Redskins fan since I moved into Redskins country back in 1987. Since RG3 has come to this team, I've adopted the Redskins as my NFC team to follow. He is an intelligent young man, very well spoken, and an absolute thrill to watch. He is wise beyond his years. He is a fantastic example for young kids to follow as well."
I had to comment on this, because as true as it is w/r/t RGIII, you could have written this EXACT paragraph about Russell Wilson! The quality of the 2012 rookie class, particularly at QB (but certainly not limited to QBs) is really unbelievable.
Thoughts and prayers to Mr. Griffin for a speedy recovery. You made the 2012 NFL season one of the most enjoyable to watch in many, many years. I'm anxious for more...get well.
Well said. I'm also a huge Russell Wilson fan as well. Wilson is a Richmond, VA native, and very well known and celebrated here. Richmond is Redskin's central, and I know many Redskins fans were also (secetly) cheering for Russell to do well last weekend.
The rest of the country learned what all of us (Richmonders) knew about Russell Wilson and Michael Robinson for a long time. Great kids grow up to be great leaders.
I'll be cheering for the Seahawks to make the Super Bowl against the Patriots.
You're right. I had the wrong racist.quote:Originally posted by Emanski's Heroes:quote:Originally posted by RJM:
Jason Whitlock is probably happy. RG3 isn't down for the cause. He's just a cornball brother.
Rob Parker not Jason Whitlock.
It's real easy to be a morning after QB. If Shanahan had pulled RG3 at 14-0 and lost he would have been called a bonehead. Cousins beat the Browns in his one start. The Seahawks are not the Browns. How did Cousins look against the Seahawks when the Skins were only down seven? Dr Andrews was on the Redskins sidelines. He didn't say, "Do not play him." Even a healthy QB is subject to injury on the next play. Football is a very physical game.
quote:Originally posted by RJM:
"It's real easy to be a morning after QB."
Well, I know I can't prove it to you, but I swear that I was saying it in the second quarter, not "morning after" QB'ing Shanahan's decision. Watching the game, I thought it was obvious that Griffin was severely compromised. Regardless of whether there was a chance he could make his injury worse - something you seem to disagree with, but I think became obvious fairly early in the game, though we can agree to disagree on that - he simply was not effective after the first two drives. No, Cousins did not look good once he came in, and yes, the Seahawks are not the Browns (though he also looked very good in short spurts against both the Ravens and Falcons, who are good teams), but I honestly believed at the time - as I do now - that the Redskins would have had a better chance from about mid-2nd quarter on with Cousins than with RGIII. I don't mean that as a knock on RGIII - he was just hurt. Though I admire his desire to suck it up and be there for his team, that's why the coach is there - to make that kind of decision for the sake of the kid, his health and future. And also for the future of the franchise, but not JUST the future. I think they sacrificed PRESENT chances by sticking with him, regardless of whether you believe leaving him in jeopardized his health. YMMV.
for the money involved they take risks
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quote:Originally posted by TRhit:
"for the money involved they take risks"
I agree, TR, and I never suggested they don't or shouldn't. My point was that RGIII was not effective enough to justify taking that risk.
I will suggest that you are wrong in ONE way: franchises do (and to some extent should) consider a player's long-term health. There are some risks players should not be allowed full freedom to accept, because the team has too much money invested in them. Not to say the right decision was made in the Nationals' case, but this is very remniscent of the decision to shut Strasburg down - and he wasn't even already hurt!
The season is more important than any one game, and the next 5-10 seasons is more important than any one season. In this case, the whole season WAS on the line, but it only made sense to take the risk they were taking if RGIII was still the best and most effective option they had. I'd argue that it was painfully obvious to most people watching that game that RGIII was not that.
quote:Originally posted by EdgarFan:
The season is more important than any one game, and the next 5-10 seasons is more important than any one season. game that RGIII was not that.
Why is that? Why is season 5 diiferent than say season 1? Season 5, they could be battling for the cellar while this year, they have a shot at the SB. NFL is one game at a time, one play at a time. The next play could be anyone's last. Why worry about 5 yrs from now when you're trying to win now and have no clue what tomorrow brings no less 5-10 yrs.
quote:Originally posted by EdgarFan:
I agree, TR, and I never suggested they don't or shouldn't. My point was that RGIII was not effective enough to justify taking that risk.
Completely agree. They drafted RGIII to have many competitive years, not just one.
ESPN is reporting RGIII is to have knee reconstructive surgery. Both the LCL and ACL have partial tears. Expected to take 6-8 months to recover.
I'm willing to bet 32 coaches and 32 starting QBs would have made the same decision as Shanahan and RG3.
quote:Originally posted by zombywoof:
"Why is that? Why is season 5 diiferent than say season 1? Season 5, they could be battling for the cellar while this year, they have a shot at the SB."
I think we agree more than we disagree, but I think you misinterpreted me (or maybe I just wasn't very clear). I didn't say season 1 is less important than season 5. I said season 2-5 (or really, 2-10) is more important than season 1. And, while I agree with you that you should seize the day when the brass ring is right in front of you (to mix several metaphors), I do think there is a limit to that.
Bottom line: what I saw was a great quarterback who was ineffective because he was injured. Ineffective to the point that I thought the back-up was a better option. YMMV, but if you get to that point, are you saying that there is NO POINT at which you bench your starting QB so that he might live for another day rather than risk what happened there? Are you arguing that what happened to RGIII (given what had happened earlier in the game) was in NO WAY foreseeable?