Getting Black Athletes to play Baseball..

To follow up what momandcpa said, more schools, especially larger schools, seem to be pushing kids to pick one, maybe two, sports in high school to focus on. Many black athletes don't gravitate towards baseball when that happens.

Related to T-B's comment: Easier to get 'ships in football. Helps make that decision.

Baseball interferes with spring FOOTBALL & track. Summer baseball interferes with 7 on 7 FOOTBALL. Fall baseball interferes with FOOTBALL games. FOOTBALL has 100 scholy's to offer, and in some cases cars & cash too! Baseball 11.7 scholly's. Baseball cost thousands. Football gear is given to players.

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Originally posted by Texan:
Related to T-B's comment: Easier to get 'ships in football. Helps make that decision.

Yes, there are just over 11 scholarships available for a college baseball player. If you need 28 players to really run a team, there is just no money to go around. Very, very few baseball players get full rides, while about 85 football players do. If your parents are poor, what would you do?

I read a great article about this issue (just can't remember where ), but the cost was cited as the main reason why black kids aren't playing baseball. Espn showed the astronomical amounts that "rich kids" pay to play select ball. David Winfield said in an ESPN interview that he puts the blame on the select leagues that are systematical forcing black kids out of baseball.

There are plenty of prosperous black families in our communities and travel basketball isn't that much less expensive than travel baseball. If those families are into sports.

Just on a percentage basis I expect to see more black athletes than we do either in high school or summer programs.

I would say at least half of the reason is cultural and most of that is driven by marketing. I think if MBL focused on marketing their black american atheltes you would find more and more athletes willing to try baseball.

Overall, wealth does play a role in the decreased particapation from this group but not as much as one might think.

"IF BLACK America were a separate nation, it would easily be one of the richest nations in the world, both financially and socially." From - American in Black and White: One Nation, Indivisible.

Actually, I think the real question / reason we should look at is how many baseball players come from single parent or divorced parent household?

On our high school team more than 90% of the kids come from two parent households. I have seen the same rates in travel and summer ball. If a player comes from a divorced family, then most likely both parent work together to get the player to practice and to games.

Take a look at your own rosters.

If you think about that then consider this stat from the:Source: U.S. Census Bureau, Population Division and
Housing and Household Economic Statistics Division

"Single parents accounted for almost two-thirds (65 percent) of all Black family groups1 with children present (one and two parent situations combined), compared with 25 percent among Whites. "

The higher level of single parent households is the main underlining reason for significantly lower black athlete participation in baseball.

Baseball is more a sport about time than money or access and it doesn't matter if you are from a black family or a white family. It is just that much harder for young men from single parent black families to make it into baseball because there are so many more of them trying to over come that hurdle.

Disclaimer: I am a father of a baseball son with divorced parents. Fortunately, I remarried and the parents from the various teams over the years have always helped to get him to and from games when neither of his parents were available.

My soap-box has nothing to do with white or black, I only stated facts on record to make a point about single parent households and baseball and that it is even harder if you are a black athlete.

my opinion.


Its not just blacks but it effects many different kids..


1.Baseball is outside in the summer and basketball is indoors with ac.

2. All of the skilled athletes in most high schools play football (i said most not all).
Many football coaches put too much pressure on them to go through spring drills or play 7 on 7 and these athletes do not get to play fall or more importantly summer baseball. If he is a football player that plays baseball then he doesnt get the chance to stay sharp in the summer and fall. If he is a baseball player that plays football he gets to play baseball in the summer and he usually does fine in football in the fall. I have seen several baseball players that love to play football and they excel on the football field while still playing baseball in the summer.

I try my hardest to get Black kids to participate but it is hard to get them interested in the game when they have spring drills going on during our play-off run.


3.failure, this game is a game of failure and football and basketball dont revolve around failure. a Majority of our black kids are very gifted athletes and they are the stars on the court and the football fields.

unfortunately there is still a color barrier in alot of places.

Thes are just a few of the problems that i see and most of them dont even address black and white it is more about finances and family structure.

Statistics from "Athletic Recruiting and College Scholarship Guide - How to Market Your Student Athlete" by Robert L. Scott

Annually - 950,000 High School football players - 150 make it to the NFL after college. Odds against a high school football player making it to the NFL - 6,318 to 1.

Annually - 515,000 High School basketball players - 50 make to the NBA after college. Less than 2.5% of the college seniors will last one year in the NBA. Odds against a high school basketball player making it to the NBA - 10,345 to 1.

"To put that into perspective: If you filled Duke University's Cameron Indoor Stadium to capacity with NBA hopefuls, then squeezed in 1,000 more, only one would make the NBA."

I think a huge number of these kids really believe they are going to the NBA or the NFL. Along the way they need to be preparing for life after ball.(Insert family influence here). It's a huge gamble to be without a secondary plan and the odds are definitely against all the athletes.

quote:

David Winfield said in an ESPN interview that he puts the blame on the select leagues that are systematical forcing black kids out of baseball.

I'm sorry Dave feels as he does. BLAME and FORCE are a strong words. In reality this has nothing to do with race. I'm sure he spoke before he looked at my pay stub and my Visa card balance during the years my son played travel ball. I'm sure he would have tempered his remarks and instead of blaming select teams he could have praised parents (no matter what their color) that were willing to make great sacrifices for their sons so they could play baseball or any other sport of their choice.
Fungo
PS: I guess what prompted me to write this it the fact that I came to see my son play baseball and I'm sitting in a motel 650 miles from home and I just finished my “budget” lunch of a homemade bologna and cheese sandwich with chips. I wonder what Mr. Winfield had for lunch?

Ctiger - what color barriers do you see or experience? I am truly curious about that statement.

Fungo


I am with you--we all make sacrifices for our kids


Also I see many kids from one parent families and they are not minority


Another thing I ahve noted---the Latino kids in the US play baseball and they are not rich nor do many of them come from two parent families---they are not into football and basketball while the black athlete is--therein may lie the reason

I have been told by a parent (several years ago) That baseball is for the white kids and basketball belongs to the blacks..

This is just an example.

Talk about an idiot needless to say that was my last year in that town.

But I get the feeling that some parents dont want some of our black kids to play because they may take little johnny's job.

But I think that is more along the lines of a football player instead of a black or white thing.

quote:

Another thing I ahve noted---the Latino kids in the US play baseball and they are not rich nor do many of them come from two parent families---they are not into football and basketball while the black athlete is--therein may lie the reason

TRhit,

In North Texas with a very large Hispanic population, I do not see a very high percentage of Hispanic players. This goes for both summer and high school teams. In high schools that are majority Hispanic, the baseball teams are mostly white kids.

I spoke to a black friend at work about this subject a few weeks ago. He said it was about the money. I was thinking that select and summer ball can be expensive but then he started talking about little league costing more than $100.

Folks I said I would not post again but I still continue to read the comments daily. However, I had to break the rule to offer the following comments.

First I want to thank John for having the courage to to bring up this subject. He raised a great topic and I offer the following comments. Most African Americans do not play baseball for the same reason they do not play hockey and golf, its expensive and most find it very boring. In all honesty I never really liked the game much until I met Dave Parker and Cade Griffis and now I can't get enough. Money was not an issue for my son and he just did not like the game; he played up age 15 and gave it up for football.

Also take a look at the at the demographics. If you go to AL, MS, LA, FL, GA, etc. the Southern States you will find a very high number of student athletes playing baseball because the majority of the schools are predominately African American as well as the cities in which they live. However I would cite economics; most of the African American including myself were raised playing football, basketball and running track. In my opinion baseball is a very difficult sport that requires a tremendous amount of didication and training if you want to be good. Football and basketball requires the same; however, African Americans have found those two sports to be more interesting and a lot less expensive to participate.

Just a different perspective. Ok I'm gone back underecover

Hey SWAC! Great to hear from you. Don't stay gone too long, we miss you're insight.

Forget about the money aspect of baseball for a minute. A kid can pick up football or basketball at any time in his life, and if he is big (or tall), strong and fast he can quickly become successful.

Baseball is a whole different story. It is a game that looks easy and is so very difficult to know how to play correctly, it takes many years of practice to become a good, knowledgeable player. This means starting early and falling in love with this great game. For those who find it boring, it is usually because they pick it up at a later age and think they see what is going on in the game, but they don't really see all that is going on, because they have not been taught.

Obrady having attended a historical black institution I will provide some insight on the show you were speaking of. The HBCU (Historical Black Colleges and Universities) to which they are referred are mandated just like UT, A & M, Ole Miss, MSU, etc. to diversify the student population to continue and receive federal funds and grants. being from MS I can tell you that the three HBCUs Alcorn State University, Jackson State University and Mississippi Valley State University are working hard to bring their non-black enrollments to at least 10 percent for three consecutive years to tap into millions in funds from a settlement of a higher education desegregation lawsuit. All three universities are doing stronger recruitment, offering full scholarships and new academic programs attracting dozens of students from the United States, Russia, Canada, Latin America and other places.

When you speak of sports what better way to do it than through baseball, golf, tennis, cross country, etc. where there is literally no interest among African Americans. It’s a win for all because the non-black students received a paid education.

Obrady you gave some excellent insight however your last comments that African Americans don't play baseball because they can't celebrate is so absurd.

quote:

Originally posted by 316sports:
Espn showed the astronomical amounts that "rich kids" pay to play select ball. David Winfield said in an ESPN interview that he puts the blame on the select leagues that are systematical forcing black kids out of baseball.

David Winfield is wrong and the probable slant of ESPN's story is wron, if the above description is accurate. Let's not dumb down to the lowest common denominator. If kids and their parents want to invest their time and resources in obtaining great skills in anything productive in society, that is good thing, not a bad thing. It always was and still is a competitive world (what's evolution and survival of the fittest about) and sports are a great thing for teaching competitiveness. A basic assumption of the ESPN story, as described, is wrong anyway. Great athletes effectively receive scholarships (subsidies) in select ball just like in college ball. The real issues with black athletes and baseball are the lack of NCAA scholarship funding for baseball and a diminished interested in the culture for baseball.

Whoaaaa horsie. This could get out of hand real quick.

Cool heads must prevail here.

I had a whole post already typed out regarding a certain post about latinos, and the notion in one posters eye, that WE don't play football and basketball, and something about "they are not rich nor do many of them come from two parent families".

After contemplating hitting the Post Now button, I called my mother AND father (not really, I just wanted to make a point, and even if I did they were on the TPC Woodlands course playing golf), after a long excrutiating debate with myself, I chose to simply close out the pop-up window and pretend like I never wanted to post anything.

Be careful fellas, this could get ugly.

quote:

Originally posted by ctiger:
2. All of the skilled athletes in most high schools play football (i said most not all).

Wait a minute. Saying "most not all" does not get you off the hook. You should retract the words "most" and "all" or change the word "skilled" to something else. Football does encompass skills, but there are a lot of complex skills in sports like baseball, basketball, s****r, tennis, etc. It is totally wrong to imply football requires more skills than other sports. How many shots must you practice to make a 3 pointer 4 out of 10 times? Many more than the number of tackles you must practice breaking to break a tackle. In football, if you are big and fast, you don't need that much practice, period. Ask Michael Jordan about hitting.

quote:

Originally posted by ctiger:
unfortunately there is still a color barrier in alot of places.

If you believe that, you should spell where you mean. I don't see any H.S. coaches not wanting to play black athletes.

quote:

Baseball is a whole different story. It is a game that looks easy and is so very difficult to know how to play correctly, it takes many years of practice to become a good, knowledgeable player. This means starting early and falling in love with this great game.

This is the absolute bottom line of the problem. Very few (if any) athletes can take up baseball in their teens and have success. My oldest son first played football when he was thirteen. He scored 22 touchdowns in 12 games because he was fast and athletic. You cannot have that kind of success in baseball at that age if you have never played the game before. It takes a lot of practice and competition at a high level to know the game and become good at it. Great athletes can succeed faster in football. So, a lot of athletes migrate to the game and are not drawn to baseball.

In one interview I saw with Winfield, he said that after being drafted in all three professional sports (at least the ones that matter) he chose baseball because it was the #1 sport in America when he was growing up. If that is true (which I believe it was) how is it that baseball is not played in junior high while football, basketball, and track are? If baseball were being offered in junior high, maybe more athletes of all races would have the opportunity to be exposed to the "great game" at no cost.


I have learned one fairly valuable lesson in life about business. If you want to understand a person's motivation, follow the money. Most people will take the path that offers the most economic benefit for the least amount of effort. Try thinking this theory through as it relates to this topic. I believe that you will come to the same conclusion that my good friend Natural just offered.

quote:

Originally posted by Uncle Ethan:
In one interview I saw with Winfield, he said that after being drafted in all three professional sports (at least the ones that matter) he chose baseball because it was the #1 sport in America when he was growing up. If that is true (which I believe it was) how is it that baseball is not played in junior high while football, basketball, and track are?

I've got a very simple answer to your question. Baseball is summer sport. Getting high school baseball crowded into a spring only works decently in southern states. How many junior high schools have field houses or indoor batting cages when the weather is inclement? Now imagine the weather in Buffalo, NY, Minnesota or Chicago in February and March and even April. Outdoor baseball fields are big in the first place, and you can't put a track around them to pull double duty.

I'm so happy someone started this post. Theirs many reasons black kids don't play. Mainly because many are from the innercity. If you look at a sport like basketball it's so much more convienent because you can play many places. "Basicly find a court on every corner, expecially New-York and other large cities". Such as finding a baseball field is a "rare" thing to see. Also, influences, basketball is a predomently a 'black" sport, because of influences such as peers in school, hip-hop,etc. Which in many peoples minds makes basketball/football more fun because of constant movement/actions. It truly is a shame, that every baseball team that I've been apart of, that I'm the only black kid. Just the other day someone tried to make fun of me for being on the "baseball team". When truth is if I was white that person would not of even said that to me. Which is why I'm happy that I'm doing this. I guess, it feels good to be differnent. So when I go out in public and older people approach me "mainly black males" about baseball and how I should keep playing and stick with it. It makes me feel better because I know african american people care, it's just baseball needs to become more exposed to younger black kids so we can become intrusted in the game. Hopefully one day it'll change.

I asked my son a few months back which was the harder sport to play, football or baseball? He is a QB, in baseball he has played P,C,1B,3B,CF. His answer was "Are you kidding me? Baseball is way harder, there is no comparison."
Just one athlete's perspective.

In addition to finding fields....it's difficult to play baseball without a larger groups of kids. Sure, you can play catch, but you can't really play one-on-one or two-on-two without a lot of imagination. Football is similar, but you can play a pickup game with 4 kids and one piece of equipment.

In Texas, baseball interferes with basketball and football. If you're a good athlete, the coaches want you on the football field in the spring, summer, and fall --- and in the weightroom in the winter.

Economics is an issue, but year-round basketball is not inexpensive.

quote:

Originally posted by All-starshortstop3:
I'm so happy someone started this post. Theirs many reasons black kids don't play. Mainly because many are from the innercity. If you look at a sport like basketball it's so much more convienent because you can play many places. "Basicly find a court on every corner, expecially New-York and other large cities". Such as finding a baseball field is a "rare" thing to see. Also, influences, basketball is a predomently a 'black" sport, because of influences such as peers in school, hip-hop,etc. Which in many peoples minds makes basketball/football more fun because of constant movement/actions. It truly is a shame, that every baseball team that I've been apart of, that I'm the only black kid. Just the other day someone tried to make fun of me for being on the "baseball team". When truth is if I was white that person would not of even said that to me. Which is why I'm happy that I'm doing this. I guess, it feels good to be differnent. So when I go out in public and older people approach me "mainly black males" about baseball and how I should keep playing and stick with it. It makes me feel better because I know african american people care, it's just baseball needs to become more exposed to younger black kids so we can become intrusted in the game. Hopefully one day it'll change.

Great post......thanks for sharing it with the Texas crowd!