Is it a foul ball if you get hit on the hands and no attempt to swing the bat and every attempt to avoid contact has been made?
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I'm going to say no because the hands are the hands and part of the body and the bat is not part of your body.
My guess anyway.
My guess anyway.
I can understand if the batter is swinging or checking ,then the hands could be part of the bat but not when an attempt isn't being made.
I have seen players hit in the hands before and awarded 1st base.
This was an instructional league and they wanted my son to hit but he just turned 9 and is a thinker,even he would like to know and understand the rule.
I have seen players hit in the hands before and awarded 1st base.
This was an instructional league and they wanted my son to hit but he just turned 9 and is a thinker,even he would like to know and understand the rule.
The idea that "the hands are a part of the bat" -- while it sounds pretty official, it's simply one of many baseball myths.
quote:Originally posted by tfox:
Is it a foul ball if you get hit on the hands and no attempt to swing the bat and every attempt to avoid contact has been made?
hit-by-pitch, take your base.
If the batter swings and misses the pitch, but is struck by the pitch, then its a dead ball, but batter stays in the box with a strike added to the count.
Not a problem at all Tfox...teach your son this..........the hands are NEVER part of the bat.........
It can only be one of two things......Both result in a dead ball.......It can be dead ball HBP.......or it can be dead ball Strike.......
Hit in the Hands not swinging and the hands are not in the strike zone is a HBP.
Hit in the Hands swinging is a dead ball strike.
Hit in the Hands and the hands are in the strike zone is a dead ball strike.
And as a passing addition.......If you ever say "the hands are part of the bat" to an umpire, he will then have very little regard for any of your baseball rules statements or questions.....this is the one statement that pretty much lets an umpire know you are dealing with someone with limited rules knowledge.
as an aside if you ever hear an umpire say that feel free to think the same thing about him........
what if batter swings, ball hits hands and bounces fair.
My assumption would be dead ball strike.
Saw this happen, ump let it play. I argued it , ump said if it went foul it would have been a strike, therfore fair it is a hit. I don't the rule but I think he was wrong.
My assumption would be dead ball strike.
Saw this happen, ump let it play. I argued it , ump said if it went foul it would have been a strike, therfore fair it is a hit. I don't the rule but I think he was wrong.
Along those lines it's kind of funny to see a kid (usually th young ones) swing get beaned in the body, ump calls a strike and the parents come unglued 
quote:what if batter swings, ball hits hands and bounces fair.
Dead ball Strike.......
And the second example is tough....the little ones get hit, and then the tears come and they expect to get to go to 1st....but then you call the strike.....
When doing youth ball, there are just some things you come to expect due to the nature of the participants and spectators.....at the lower levels........"hands are part of the bat' and the dead ball strike for being hit while swinging always makes the boo birds come out...
quote:Originally posted by piaa_ump:
Not a problem at all Tfox...teach your son this..........the hands are NEVER part of the bat.........
It can only be one of two things......Both result in a dead ball.......It can be dead ball HBP.......or it can be dead ball Strike.......
Hit in the Hands not swinging and the hands are not in the strike zone is a HBP.
Hit in the Hands swinging is a dead ball strike.
Hit in the Hands and the hands are in the strike zone is a dead ball strike.
And as a passing addition.......If you ever say "the hands are part of the bat" to an umpire, he will then have very little regard for any of your baseball rules statements or questions.....this is the one statement that pretty much lets an umpire know you are dealing with someone with limited rules knowledge.
as an aside if you ever hear an umpire say that feel free to think the same thing about him.........
Thanks,this is exactly what I thought.
It was an instructional league and one of the assistants sent him back up to bat.The coach said he should be on first but we wnat him to hit.(fine with me,but I want to teach the rules)
I talked to the assistant later and he said the hands were part of the bat and I have been around baseball a little while now and have never heard that.
If it is a dead ball strike,would it be a strike out on a 3rd strike or is it like a foul ball?
Strike 3
Thanks
WOW,this happened again tonight(I have been working on teaching him to turn away from the pitch and protect his hands BUT,you know how that goes.He actually does it most of the time)
He was hit and the ump called foul ball,I couldn't believe it.
I didn't argue it but I did say something to another coach with ALOT of experience,high school head coaching experience and I believe some minor league experience.He told me hands were part of the bat,I said no but he insisted so I didn't argue.
So,the reason I brought this back up was to find out where in the rules is this stated.
Thanks
He was hit and the ump called foul ball,I couldn't believe it.
I didn't argue it but I did say something to another coach with ALOT of experience,high school head coaching experience and I believe some minor league experience.He told me hands were part of the bat,I said no but he insisted so I didn't argue.
So,the reason I brought this back up was to find out where in the rules is this stated.
Thanks
This is something you'll see all the way up through high school ball. My brother's team played a few weeks ago for the Nevada 2A state championship. Batter started his hands forward, realized how close the pitch was and pulled them toward chest. He didn't swing and was hit by the pitch on the hand. Ump called dead ball strike which I personally thought should have been a hit by pitch, but you should have heard the crowd reaction. It wasn't pretty, but I really got a good idea of how little most of the spectators actually know. The hands are not part of the bat and people who insist that they are only make themselves sound stupid.
Tfox, if you're looking for something in the rulebook saying "The hands are NOT a part of the bat" ... you'll not find it, because the rules are not written in a format that states what ISN'T true.
But it does state what IS true:
6.08
The batter becomes a runner and is entitled to first base... when
(b) He is touched by a pitched ball which he is not attempting to hit unless (1) The ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, or (2) The batter makes no attempt to avoid being touched by the ball; If the ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a strike, whether or not the batter tries to avoid the ball. If the ball is outside the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a ball if he makes no attempt to avoid being touched. APPROVED RULING: When the batter is touched by a pitched ball which does not entitle him to first base, the ball is dead and no runner may advance.
As long as someone doesn't have a problem with the fact that the hands are a part of the batter, then they shouldn't have any problem with the batter being awarded first base when that happens.
Hope that helps.
But it does state what IS true:
6.08
The batter becomes a runner and is entitled to first base... when
(b) He is touched by a pitched ball which he is not attempting to hit unless (1) The ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, or (2) The batter makes no attempt to avoid being touched by the ball; If the ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a strike, whether or not the batter tries to avoid the ball. If the ball is outside the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a ball if he makes no attempt to avoid being touched. APPROVED RULING: When the batter is touched by a pitched ball which does not entitle him to first base, the ball is dead and no runner may advance.
As long as someone doesn't have a problem with the fact that the hands are a part of the batter, then they shouldn't have any problem with the batter being awarded first base when that happens.
Hope that helps.
We even had a kid a couple weeks ago hit the ball fair and the ball hit his hands.You should have seen the looks I got from people when I said that should have been a dead ball strike. 
quote:Originally posted by RPD:
Tfox, if you're looking for something in the rulebook saying "The hands are NOT a part of the bat" ... you'll not find it, because the rules are not written in a format that states what ISN'T true.
But it does state what IS true:
6.08
The batter becomes a runner and is entitled to first base... when
(b) He is touched by a pitched ball which he is not attempting to hit unless (1) The ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, or (2) The batter makes no attempt to avoid being touched by the ball; If the ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a strike, whether or not the batter tries to avoid the ball. If the ball is outside the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a ball if he makes no attempt to avoid being touched. APPROVED RULING: When the batter is touched by a pitched ball which does not entitle him to first base, the ball is dead and no runner may advance.
As long as someone doesn't have a problem with the fact that the hands are a part of the batter, then they shouldn't have any problem with the batter being awarded first base when that happens.
Hope that helps.
I was not expecting it to be worded as the hand are not part of the bat but was hoping there was a rule that addressed that actuall situation but in reality,that does.Just common since really.
Thanks,I quess I will just have to live with it.This ump that made the call was actually one of the better ones.And the coach has an impressive resume.
Thanks
tfox,
This definitions from Rule 2 may also help:
"The PERSON of a player or an umpire is any part of his body, his clothing or his equipment. "
This is the rule that shows, among other things, that if a pitched ball strikes the batter's uniform, it is a HBP. The bolded phrase tells me that the hands are part of his person, and not part of the bat.
This definitions from Rule 2 may also help:
"The PERSON of a player or an umpire is any part of his body, his clothing or his equipment. "
This is the rule that shows, among other things, that if a pitched ball strikes the batter's uniform, it is a HBP. The bolded phrase tells me that the hands are part of his person, and not part of the bat.
Thanks guys,just thought of something else.The ump played high school ball for the coach so it would make sense they were both on the same page with the wrong call. 
how about this one? batter squares to bunt, pitch comes inside, really inside and hits batter(right handed) in left knee cap(still in batter's box). batter didn't really pull back bat, but attempted to move weight forward and kick his legs out behind him. from the side you could tell that he abandoned any attempt at hitting the ball and was just trying to get out of the way. ball never hit the bat and was definitely not in the strike zone.
He gets the base. He doesn't have to pull the bat back, he just can't offer at the pitch or it's a strike.
As Dash said, Its a hit batter, he gets first.
He dose not have to pull the bat back. If he did not offer at the pitch, it is a HBP.
He dose not have to pull the bat back. If he did not offer at the pitch, it is a HBP.