Great game...questionable (at best) coaching

As much as I rail against pitch count I could possibly agree with 146 pitches in 10 innings for my son on the follow conditions:

1) that pc / inning was averaging 15 pitches with no high pitch count inning over 25.

2) The game in which he pitched 146 pitches was toward the end of the season so that the pitcher has had time to work himself up to that load

3) that the pitcher had minimum 4 days rest previously.

4) the pitcher wasn't used as a catcher.  

5) The pitcher showed or indicated no signs of discomfort throughout the game. 

You can't judge circumstances on one situation. You have to be able to look at the big picture. When did the kid pitch last? How much? When is he expected to pitch again? How much? 

If he's throwing 143 pitches per game every four or five days there's an issue. If it's a one time thing to get over a hurdle, it's a good weather day, the kid feels strong and his mechanics remain solid, no problem.

gamecock303 posted:

Tthe home team in a must win situation fighting to end the season with a championship to honor a teammate who was killed in an car accident before the season began

 

Given these circumstances, my kid would have probably stayed on the mound until his arm fell off - then he would have tried to pitch with the other one.

Sometimes you take risks.  You have to decide how much something really matters to you. The pitcher and coach felt it was worth the risk.  It's hard to judge without standing in their shoes.

This is absurd (and there are no circumstances in which this would be reasonable). It's a failure on the coach's part...this team is supposedly top 50 in the country and the coach doesn't have any other arms available? Combination of stupidity and arrogance on the coach's part. 

Did everyone miss the part where it said he threw the day before also??  Sorry, but this is probably the worst case of pitcher abuse that I've heard.  143 and 10 innings is one thing....but throwing the day before??? 

I am under the impression that there are pitching restrictions these days? 

Buckeye 2015 posted:

Did everyone miss the part where it said he threw the day before also??  Sorry, but this is probably the worst case of pitcher abuse that I've heard.  143 and 10 innings is one thing....but throwing the day before??? 

My son would have NEVER taken the mound.  He knows how to fake a sore arm.  

Buckeye 2015 posted:

Did everyone miss the part where it said he threw the day before also??  Sorry, but this is probably the worst case of pitcher abuse that I've heard.  143 and 10 innings is one thing....but throwing the day before??? 

I agree. The coach stretched out the player because he figured he wasnt going to pitch in college, thats the worst abuse I have ever heard of, all players get injured, its ALL accumulative for everyone. 

lionbaseball posted:

Buckeye 2015 posted:

Did everyone miss the part where it said he threw the day before also??  Sorry, but this is probably the worst case of pitcher abuse that I've heard.  143 and 10 innings is one thing....but throwing the day before??? 

My son would have NEVER taken the mound.  He knows how to fake a sore arm.  

If you think it is best to not pitch, that's your right.  However if your conviction is that strong be man enough to tell your coach and teammates.

I figured part of the guy's reasoning was that he wouldn't be pitching in college, but again see my note re: stupidity and arrogance. Infielders have to throw too. 

Rob T posted:

lionbaseball posted:

Buckeye 2015 posted:

Did everyone miss the part where it said he threw the day before also??  Sorry, but this is probably the worst case of pitcher abuse that I've heard.  143 and 10 innings is one thing....but throwing the day before??? 

My son would have NEVER taken the mound.  He knows how to fake a sore arm.  

If you think it is best to not pitch, that's your right.  However if your conviction is that strong be man enough to tell your coach and teammates.

Sorry, but if the coach is going to be an a-hole and have a kid throw back to back days with that amount of pitches then he doesn't deserve it.   No pitcher in high school should have to worry about pitch count.  

And in my case, I did talk to my son's coach before the season to discuss maximum pitch count and he blew me off so to hell with him.  

lionbaseball posted:

Rob T posted:

lionbaseball posted:

Buckeye 2015 posted:

Did everyone miss the part where it said he threw the day before also??  Sorry, but this is probably the worst case of pitcher abuse that I've heard.  143 and 10 innings is one thing....but throwing the day before??? 

My son would have NEVER taken the mound.  He knows how to fake a sore arm.  

If you think it is best to not pitch, that's your right.  However if your conviction is that strong be man enough to tell your coach and teammates.

Sorry, but if the coach is going to be an a-hole and have a kid throw back to back days with that amount of pitches then he doesn't deserve it.   No pitcher in high school should have to worry about pitch count.  

And in my case, I did talk to my son's coach before the season to discuss maximum pitch count and he blew me off so to hell with him.  

 

Then just tell him you aren't going to pitch. Obviously you don't think highly of him so it shouldn't be difficult.

Even if you feel the coach doesn't deserve honesty, your teammates do.

Rob T posted:

lionbaseball posted:

Rob T posted:

lionbaseball posted:

Buckeye 2015 posted:

Did everyone miss the part where it said he threw the day before also??  Sorry, but this is probably the worst case of pitcher abuse that I've heard.  143 and 10 innings is one thing....but throwing the day before??? 

My son would have NEVER taken the mound.  He knows how to fake a sore arm.  

If you think it is best to not pitch, that's your right.  However if your conviction is that strong be man enough to tell your coach and teammates.

Sorry, but if the coach is going to be an a-hole and have a kid throw back to back days with that amount of pitches then he doesn't deserve it.   No pitcher in high school should have to worry about pitch count.  

And in my case, I did talk to my son's coach before the season to discuss maximum pitch count and he blew me off so to hell with him.  

 

Then just tell him you aren't going to pitch. Obviously you don't think highly of him so it shouldn't be difficult.

Even if you feel the coach doesn't deserve honesty, your teammates do.

See, I put the responsibility on the coach.  The team deserves better than that.  So if the coach isn't warming another pitcher between innings in preparation to relieve  my son, that's on the coach.   When my son reaches a pre-determine pitch count he comes out.  Not my son's fault nor his problem.  How he comes out of the game (faking an arm soreness or just telling the coach I'm done) is irrelevant. 

lionbaseball posted

See, I put the responsibility on the coach.  The team deserves better than that.  So if the coach isn't warming another pitcher between innings in preparation to relieve  my son, that's on the coach.   When my son reaches a pre-determine pitch count he comes out.  Not my son's fault nor his problem.  How he comes out of the game (faking an arm soreness or just telling the coach I'm done) is irrelevant. 

It's not irrelevant.  One is honest one is not.

One says, "Coach, I don't think you are doing a good job."

One says - well, I guess it says that the pitcher wants to avoid the subject.

Buckeye 2015 posted:

Did everyone miss the part where it said he threw the day before also??  Sorry, but this is probably the worst case of pitcher abuse that I've heard.  143 and 10 innings is one thing....but throwing the day before??? 

" I had to leave somewhere around the 8th or 9th, once I got home I was looking to find the score only to find out that the winning team's starter threw all 10 innings.  143 pitches all after pitching Friday to get them to the championship series"

The OP posted on 5-19 at 2: am  that he saw the game that night, he said the pitcher threw on Friday, I am assuming it was  Friday 5-13,  4-5 days rest between starts?   Big difference than back to back days,  I must have missed the pitching the day before part ? 

Rob T posted:

lionbaseball posted

See, I put the responsibility on the coach.  The team deserves better than that.  So if the coach isn't warming another pitcher between innings in preparation to relieve  my son, that's on the coach.   When my son reaches a pre-determine pitch count he comes out.  Not my son's fault nor his problem.  How he comes out of the game (faking an arm soreness or just telling the coach I'm done) is irrelevant. 

It's not irrelevant.  One is honest one is not.

One says, "Coach, I don't think you are doing a good job."

One says - well, I guess it says that the pitcher wants to avoid the subject.

I'm sure we have all been honest when our wives asked us "Honey, does this make me look fat?"