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28 replies

HBP Clarification

K Kumi10+ posts
Indiana HS game, home team brings in a pitcher whose fastball is only making it to the plate because the wind is with him. 0-2 count. The next pitch is directly at the batter from the time it comes out of his hand. The batter turns to offer his back, neither moving away nor towards the ball. Rule 7-3-4 (NFHS) states that a batter is not permitted to allow a pitched ball to touch him. The visiting manager argues that the batter's turning was his effort to get out of the way of the pitch. If in my judgement the batter never tried to move out of the path of the ball, merely turned, and intended to let the ball hit him, does he stay in the box with a 1-2 count? Or does his turning constitute an attempt to avoid the pitch?
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C Coach_Bayer10+ posts
What if it starts right at him, then curves over the plate, but the kid ducks and sticks his melon right over the plate and the ball hits him there. I think it's a strike, but everytime I've ever seen this, it's been an award of first base. I've seen this 4 times in my life and I'll never forget the time it happened when I was a Sr. in HS (yes, I was the pitcher).
K Kumi10+ posts
In a previous post, Jimmy03 stated:

Guidlines include "did the batter increase his profile to the pitch", e.g. stiking out an elbow or knee, or when turning his back to the pitch, step towards the plate.

In this case, he didn't step towards the plate, but by turning his back, he did increase his profile. Does judgement come into play in regards to intent?
piaa_umppiaa_ump5,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Kumi:
In this case, he didn't step towards the plate, but by turning his back, he did increase his profile. Does judgement come into play in regards to intent?


Absolutely it does........thats 90% of what we do....But that being said I am in the same camp as Dash....if the ball is right at him in the batters box, that turn would be enough to me to constitute avoiding.....that would clearly be HBP in my book...

but thats Dash and me..........others my differ....probably in a few mins, MST will be here to offer the differing opinion....as I am fairly liberal on HBP, MST is not....( probably one of the few things we differ on)....
T therefump100+ posts
quote:
As PIAA says, I'm tougher on this than he is but if the batter gives me something, I send him. However, I will keep them in more situations than most. The turn that you speak of will in most cases get them a base.


I totally agree with Michael. Keeping him seems to sometimes (not always) be more trouble than it's worth. I ran into this a few weeks ago. The HS coach never got off my back after that. I should've thrown him then and there but he knew not to cross that line after the argument.

However, call it the way you see it and worry about the arguing after the fact. You'll get it regardless.
bballmanbballman10,000+ posts
quote:
What if it starts right at him, then curves over the plate, but the kid ducks and sticks his melon right over the plate and the ball hits him there


What about this one guys. This happened to my son as well. He threw a big breaking ball that started at the batter. Batter ducked down to avoid the ball with his head over the plate. Pitch broke down and over the plate and hit batter in the head (in the strike zone). Ump gave batter the base. If it hits the batter in the strike zone, is it still HBP?
D dash_riprock1,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Tangents23:
How about this one. A fastball up and in is coming at the batters front shoulder when he instinctly puts his hand up to protect himself and knocks the ball down. The umpire gave him the base and the opposing coach went nuts.

If it's fair, then live ball, play on. The hands are part of the bat, so this would be a rule book bunt.
P pilsner500+ posts
Despite all of the guidelines umpires can use to determine whether a batter should be sent to first or kept at the plate, the bottom line is judgement. If we feel that the batter was making some kind of legitimate attempt to avoid being hit he goes to first. If not he stays at the plate.
In the scenario presented I would have to determine whether the batter threw up his hand as a reflex to the location of the pitch (up and in) or did it appear that he intentionally put up his hand to slap the ball away. Can't say for sure. HTBT.
If he actually caught the ball it would have to be intentional. Unless it was ball 4, he'd stay at the plate.
Last edited by pilsner
R RenoUmp10+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by bballman:
quote:
What if it starts right at him, then curves over the plate, but the kid ducks and sticks his melon right over the plate and the ball hits him there


What about this one guys. This happened to my son as well. He threw a big breaking ball that started at the batter. Batter ducked down to avoid the ball with his head over the plate. Pitch broke down and over the plate and hit batter in the head (in the strike zone). Ump gave batter the base. If it hits the batter in the strike zone, is it still HBP?


STRIKE!!!!
F firstyrcoach10+ posts
Can someone tell me if this was the rule in '02? That was my SR yr in HS and on opening day we faced a righty throwing mid to upper 80's (I played legion with him later and he was clocked at 88 max. Went on to play at UNC Chapel Hill before he got kicked out.) I batted in the three hole and the first two batters were scared out of their minds. I was sitting on 2-1 breaking ball and started my swing when an 83+ mph fastball wound up under my hands. I couldn't exactly stop my swing before I got drilled in the forearm of my top hand. I was awarded a base with no argument from the other coach. I can't honestly say whether I stopped my swing in time, in fact, I'm sure I didn't stop and actually swung thru the pitch. Was this the correct call in '02? What about in '09?
C critterump17110+ posts
I had a couple hit batters in a baberuth game. the next batter comes up and leans into the pitch it was out of the strike zone but i called him saying that he lean ball dead.

Batter was just laughing about it afterwords, one of the coach say thank you. The batter has to attempt to move to get out of the way if they move that's enough for me. I seen a lot of batters in mlb that don't move

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