HeadFirst and Showball pitching velo

Registered my son for one in CA in a couple weeks, so following... son is uncommitted 2020 6'3" 180# LHP that sat 82-84, T85 at a showcase yesterday, 1370 SAT. Hoping for a good trip. 

These are high academic showcases - mostly D3 schools with some smaller D1s mixed in. I'm not sure you're going to find a velo chart anywhere but expect mostly high 70s-low 80s. Obviously the harder you throw the better but the guys throwing upper 80s/90s are usually higher level D1 players or already have their commitments sorted out. Like every showcase there will be some guys who aren't that talented and don't belong.

Either way you shouldn't worry about the competition, just worry about performing well for the schools you're interested in. 

I have only been to one of these - HF in CA.  Based on that I think there's quite a range.  Some real poo-chuckers, and a few kids who didn't seem to pitch too much. Plenty of decent looking low 80's.  Some mid 80's, but not many above that.  

The most important thing is for your kid to be ready to take his hacks.  

During the simulated games, batters have a 1-1 count.  A kid should look for a fastball anywhere that he can drive it and put his best swing on it.   When I was there, it was kind of sad watching the over-anxious kids flail at off-speed out of the zone, and the overly-picky kids get rung up on borderline fastballs.  And of course if you're not leading off, go to school on what the pitcher does with the batters ahead of you.

Went to HF and Showball,  1-2 guys high 80's w occasional 90ish guy, few guys 83-86, lots of guys 77-80.  Lots of 77-80 guys throwing curve balls.  

He'll be throwing more pitches at HF than Showball, be aware of the pitching schedule, have a plan how to manage his ARM.

Your son sounds projectable for HA's, good luck. 

TheRightScuff posted:

Registered my son for one in CA in a couple weeks, so following... son is uncommitted 2020 6'3" 180# LHP that sat 82-84, T85 at a showcase yesterday, 1370 SAT. Hoping for a good trip. 

Almost identical, same but for RHP 6' 185. Tw months til showcases, hope to have the velo up a tick or two by then.

I'm not sure how much crossover there is between HF/Showball and PG HA, but at least the numbers are public with PG.

https://www.perfectgame.org/Ev...ults.aspx?event=7662

PA, JCG, and GOVs numbers match my recollection. Any rising senior touching upper 80s will get immediate calls - if academics are ok. Lots of mid to low-80s. In this group the guys who have good control, consistent mechanics, and a decent off-speed will get calls

Seems to be some consensus, anyone else want to chime in?

My son is a 2020 and not yet committed, so take this fwiw:  

I don’t think I’m disagreeing with Goosegg, but I’d say that while there were quite a few low to mid 80s pitchers, most were a a few ticks lower (more like 78-80).   Pitchers in the low 80s (touching ~85+) with at least one off-speed pitch will attract some interest from D3s as rising seniors. (Younger guys, tall thin players who look like they have room to get stronger, and lefties can throw proportionately slower, of course.)  As a rising Jr at HF and Showball, my 6’1” RHP son got a fair bit of email from D3s (and a few D1s) while sitting 81-84 mph. BUT, your son has to lay the foundation by getting in touch with coaches before the event and seeking them out while he is there  

It is frustrating IMO that HF and Showball don’t publish velos or at least formally report them to Ps.  Coaches will usually tell your son what velos they had him at if he asks.  Also, a couple of the guys who caught my son at these showcases told him they heard the coaches (who sit behind home plate) discussing his gun readings and let my son know what they said his velo was. I’d ask my catcher to keep his ears open for me. 

Finally, most HA schools want to see 3 years of HS grades before they seriously recruit. If your son is younger than a rising senior, don’t expect more than “we liked what we saw, keep us posted” (unless your kid is throwing 90+ and/or is 6’8”).  

The player can ask what velo they had for him.  The owner of Showball will give you your metrics if you email him after the event, but it may take a few days for him to respond given he has consecutive events.  (the dad can casually be behind where a few radar guns are...)

Some coaches will use other coaches to check out a kid for him...Decker at Harvard is buddy's with a Tufts AC, he'll use him to watch a few kids, Decker typically acts like he's there for the sun.

Chico Escuela posted:

My son is a 2020 and not yet committed, so take this fwiw:  

I don’t think I’m disagreeing with Goosegg, but I’d say that while there were quite a few low to mid 80s pitchers, most were a a few ticks lower (more like 78-80).   Pitchers in the low 80s (touching ~85+) with at least one off-speed pitch will attract some interest from D3s as rising seniors. (Younger guys, tall thin players who look like they have room to get stronger, and lefties can throw proportionately slower, of course.)  As a rising Jr at HF and Showball, my 6’1” RHP son got a fair bit of email from D3s (and a few D1s) while sitting 81-84 mph. BUT, your son has to lay the foundation by getting in touch with coaches before the event and seeking them out while he is there  

It is frustrating IMO that HF and Showball don’t publish velos or at least formally report them to Ps.  Coaches will usually tell your son what velos they had him at if he asks.  Also, a couple of the guys who caught my son at these showcases told him they heard the coaches (who sit behind home plate) discussing his gun readings and let my son know what they said his velo was. I’d ask my catcher to keep his ears open for me. 

Finally, most HA schools want to see 3 years of HS grades before they seriously recruit. If your son is younger than a rising senior, don’t expect more than “we liked what we saw, keep us posted” (unless your kid is throwing 90+ and/or is 6’8”).  

Agree with the bolded and would say sitting upper 80s will get strong interest from most of the D1s at HF. In fact, the Yale RC said at to a kid at one of the Sacramento HF sessions last summer that their standard for a RHP was touching 88 multiple times in the same inning.

If you're there, it's not that hard to see what the guns say. Also, sometimes the coaches tell kids.

HF provides the velo times and other testing metrics to all of the coaches in attendance but not to the players.  I asked and they said they really want the players focused on their game actions and interaction with coaches, not obsessing about their metrics.  I'm not sure I buy that, but they have survived just fine with that policy.

It is always a good idea to do a Perfect Game or Baseball Factory event before one of these recruiting showcases.  First, the player gets a chance to go through the drills that they will be tested on to become more familiar and work on them before the showcase.  And more significantly, the player will get their metrics before the showcase, and if they are really good, use their player page as a link in e-mails that they send to the coaches before the showcase.  Totally agree with Chico...this should be done BEFORE the showcase.  The coach will then more likely be inclined to watch the player if they liked the metrics and the kid has the academics to go along with it.

Concur Chico and Backstop: the attending college coaches have a list of players to check out based on emails, calls, and referrals.

Make sure your player asks what his 60 time was immediately after the run (and other metrics if possible).  HF gave my 2018 the other guys 60 time of 7.8....didn’t find out until the end of the second day.  Columbia HC:  “you really are fast for a 7.8 guy”... 

The Coaches will use the HF/SB metrics to highlight or cross off players to allocate time to watch.

Also, when a player knows his team and #, send a quick email to the colleges coach and let him know... You’ll save the coach time.

While these are HA colleges coaches attending, remind yourself, they are  baseball guys down to the bone. If your skills stand out, then, they hope you have the academic chops to support through admissions.

Almost all the things said above jive with my 2018's experience. He got his 60 time after asking. There were very few pitchers getting into the high 80's, but I did see a few that touched 86-7, while sitting 84-6. Some of them were very good pitchers, others just throwers. There was quite a few P's in the high 70's, and probably an equal amount in the low 80's. 

     I would like to emphasis that while velo is definitely attractive, a sharp breaking pitch or a diving changeup  that makes batters look bad also gets attention. A local guy with mid 80's stuff ended up at Columbia. My sense was that it wasn't just his velo, but his total pkg. as a pitcher that caught the attention of the HC. He had great command, and more or less toyed with batters. Kind of funny, because just a few short months before my son and his HS team was smashing him around. You never know when it will come together for a player.

A little off the original topic, but did anyone who attended HF last summer notice any special handling of the underclassmen with regard to D1 coaches? D1 rules basically prohibit contact before September 1st of junior year. Are D1 coaches in the dugouts? Are the underclassmen identified with a different color shirt or something?

MidAtlanticDad posted:

A little off the original topic, but did anyone who attended HF last summer notice any special handling of the underclassmen with regard to D1 coaches? D1 rules basically prohibit contact before September 1st of junior year. Are D1 coaches in the dugouts? Are the underclassmen identified with a different color shirt or something?

Yes, they used wristbands I think to distinguish them.

Anyone at Showball or Headfirst in CA last weekend with anything to share? 

My 2020 LHP went to Showball at SF State as a PO. Satisfied with how Showball executed the event overall. First day was not much for him - no more bullpens for primary pitchers on day 1, only the secondary pitchers who will not pitch on day 2 threw them near the end of the session. So, lots of shagging for any POs. Of the secondary pitchers, I heard one RHP was maybe 87. Maybe saw a couple RHPs in mid-80s. Best of the rest probably sat 79-81 to my unofficial eyeballs.

End of session was a meet n greet with coaches. Kind of a rushed affair, but I am very happy Showball offered it. Son probably talked with ~8 HCs. Probably had no impact on whether son will or won't be recruited by any schools he talked to, but it was a good experience for him to practice communicating with HCs nonetheless. A mix of interactions, too... some coaches interested in connecting and others probably wishing it never began.

Day 2 my son pitched 3 innings, I think limited to 4 batters in the first, 3 in the second, and 4 in the third. 1-1 counts for each at bat. Coach calling strikes from behind the mound, seemed a little reluctant to call a borderline strikes on the first pitch but otherwise it was a fair zone. Fast paced game, which was great. A coach afterward gave son about a 4-min evaluation talk; my son was told he sat 83 with good movement, which seemed right to me. Never heard where he topped, but son never asked either. 

In a parent talk session, head coaches said they were eager to recruit, but my son has not heard much yet (only been two days). In fact, I saw very little if any 'recruiting' on site. Ironically, son fielded a few unsolicited calls the next day from a D1 and a couple D3s not in attendance asking how he did and to not commit anywhere before talking to them first, lol. 'Tis the season for 2020s. 

sittng 82

TheRightScuff posted:

Anyone at Showball or Headfirst in CA last weekend with anything to share? 

My 2020 LHP went to Showball at SF State as a PO. Satisfied with how Showball executed the event overall. First day was not much for him - no more bullpens for primary pitchers on day 1, only the secondary pitchers who will not pitch on day 2 threw them near the end of the session. So, lots of shagging for any POs. Of the secondary pitchers, I heard one RHP was maybe 87. Maybe saw a couple RHPs in mid-80s. Best of the rest probably sat 79-81 to my unofficial eyeballs.

End of session was a meet n greet with coaches. Kind of a rushed affair, but I am very happy Showball offered it. Son probably talked with ~8 HCs. Probably had no impact on whether son will or won't be recruited by any schools he talked to, but it was a good experience for him to practice communicating with HCs nonetheless. A mix of interactions, too... some coaches interested in connecting and others probably wishing it never began.

Day 2 my son pitched 3 innings, I think limited to 4 batters in the first, 3 in the second, and 4 in the third. 1-1 counts for each at bat. Coach calling strikes from behind the mound, seemed a little reluctant to call a borderline strikes on the first pitch but otherwise it was a fair zone. Fast paced game, which was great. A coach afterward gave son about a 4-min evaluation talk; my son was told he sat 83 with good movement, which seemed right to me. Never heard where he topped, but son never asked either. 

In a parent talk session, head coaches said they were eager to recruit, but my son has not heard much yet (only been two days). In fact, I saw very little if any 'recruiting' on site. Ironically, son fielded a few unsolicited calls the next day from a D1 and a couple D3s not in attendance asking how he did and to not commit anywhere before talking to them first, lol. 'Tis the season for 2020s. 

Sitting 83 is good for Showball. What velo's can you report from the second day PO's? 

I'm curious, how did most pitchers handle the 1-1 count? alot of first pitch curveball's? What would you say is the best way to approach pitching the 1-1 count?

I only watched one game of the six or so played on day 2, but I saw a similar mix of velos from the primary pitchers, maybe more sitting low 80s than upper 70s.  

My son looked up some of the players on the opposing roster on PG and PBR for his game beforehand (roster and schedules were posted about 3 days in advance) and was certain to throw first pitch breaking balls to the better hitters (it worked, induced the groundouts and foul balls desired). It did seem like a higher percentage of 1-1 breaking balls than you would typically expect on a 0-0 count for a high school game. Also, since there were no walks (after ball 4, counts went back to 2-1 and only fastballs were allowed), there were more 3-2 breaking balls than normal, too.

Good report. Thanks, 'scuff.

Reviving this thread rather than starting a new one, because I have a minor question:  Did your sons take paper copies of their baseball "resume" and transcript/test scores to give to coaches at HF or Showball?  Some threads here and other online resources suggest this; but given how much info is available online now, I am not sure it is still done.  I have never seen coaches collecting papers from players at showcases...  Easy enough to for my son stick some copies in his baseball bag--but is there any real need to do so?

Chico Escuela posted:

Reviving this thread rather than starting a new one, because I have a minor question:  Did your sons take paper copies of their baseball "resume" and transcript/test scores to give to coaches at HF or Showball?  Some threads here and other online resources suggest this; but given how much info is available online now, I am not sure it is still done.  I have never seen coaches collecting papers from players at showcases...  Easy enough to for my son stick some copies in his baseball bag--but is there any real need to do so?

My son (2020) has never brought hardcopy stuff to showcases/camps and I've never seen other players handing this information out to coaches. They will ask about GPA and test scores, but my son would e-mail this info as part of his follow-up. Good luck!

In four HA showcases I saw one person handing out paper.  If the coaches like what they saw they ask what your scores are, and the player is able to email them as a backup.

Chico, I think your son should reach out to coaches in advance (and can send transcripts etc. as part of that). If he's in contact with coaches before the showcase, and they're looking for him at the event, it is likely to work better, IMHO, rather than just hoping he catches a random coach's eye. 

Chico Escuela posted:

Reviving this thread rather than starting a new one, because I have a minor question:  Did your sons take paper copies of their baseball "resume" and transcript/test scores to give to coaches at HF or Showball?  Some threads here and other online resources suggest this; but given how much info is available online now, I am not sure it is still done.  I have never seen coaches collecting papers from players at showcases...  Easy enough to for my son stick some copies in his baseball bag--but is there any real need to do so?

My son brought hardcopy transcripts, scores, etc to Headfirst.  He did this based on an old post I had read.  Coaches he spoke with wanted follow-up e-mails, and not hardcopy.  I'd say there is no need to bring paper copies.

2019Dad posted:

Chico, I think your son should reach out to coaches in advance (and can send transcripts etc. as part of that). If he's in contact with coaches before the showcase, and they're looking for him at the event, it is likely to work better, IMHO, rather than just hoping he catches a random coach's eye. 

Thanks 2019Dad. Chico Jr has been emailing coaches for a while now and has had phone and text exchanges with several, so I think he's in good shape on that front (so long as he pitches well this summer...).

My 2017 brought a few hard copies of his test scores and transcript to HF.  There was one coach who asked him for it, but others asked him to send them PDF copies later.  That was a couple of years ago so now maybe nobody asks for them.  But he should be diligent in having them ready to send electronically after the showcase. 

This generation of kids never check their e-mail, and I had to remind my son to check it twice a day after the showcases.  I know texting is a preferred method for kids and coaches nowadays. But the schools require them to use their e-mails, and some coaches prefer e-mail communication to keep better records.  The last thing a kid should do is not respond promptly to any coach e-mails he receives.

My son had his academic transcripts (scores, grades, courses) in sealed envelopes which he gave to every coach whose school he had interest AND to every coach who approached him one-on-one.

Did it work? Who knows; BUT, coaches watched his outings (thereby laying eyes on his baseball skills and deciding if he made the "cut") and coaches approached after those outings and ALWAYS asked about grades. By having the academic resume in hand (actually it was back pocket) he was able to carry on a full conversation with a coach who had already seen and decided his baseball was good enough and was immediately aware that academics would not be any impediment. Conversations got serious at that point - so serious he got calls on the ride home from his targets.

A paper resume allows the coach to have a face-to-face with all the necessary info; it allows the coach to put a face to the stats. If you wait, other similar recruits (skillwise and academically) blend into a homogeneous mass in the coach's brain.

In other words, a paper resume gives a huge advantage in separating candidates (imo). (Think of it this way: every coach will tell any player to send an email [costs the coach nothing], and dozens, hundreds, blizzards of emails then inundate a coach. A player may get lostin that mass. Handing an appropriate resume during a face-to-face following a hot outing allows the coach to talk nuts and bolts. Son got his OV offers this way.)

A salesman NEVER let's  a hot prospect walk away empty handed (in this case the salesman is the player and the hot prospect is one of his target schools. If coach doesn't want the paper, he can throw it away).