Or it's a self fulfilling prophecy / he feels guilty and subconsciously wants to be punished more.
There is not one person on this site that doesn't detest this crime and have total sympathy for the victims. The only differences in opinion is how this perpetrator should be allowed to live out the remainder of his life. I am conflicted between my desire to want to give the individual an opportunity to make amends and simply seeing him go away. But really there is no way anyone here would not find this offense utterly reprehensible and sickening. I hope the victims can find peace and healing. There are things that should never happen.
It came across as a condescending statement in the form of a question. As for playing in the CWS he did the right thing by backing away from the team. It would be nice to think it was his idea. I wouldn't be surprised if he was advised to do so. Otherwise I believe the president of the university would have stepped in and removed him.
As for being drafted he has the right. I'm guessing every franchise sees it as a poor business decision. It would be dissing a good portion of the fan base (women especially and parents who would be revolted by him being in the organization). If he's drafted it will probably a desperate franchise looking for talent on the cheap.
He's not entitled to a good life. No one is. It has to be earned. He doesn't have to play baseball to have a good life. Hopefully there's more to him as a person than just being a baseball player. I believe it would be very difficult to have a quality, peaceful life in the public spotlight. He would be better off fitting anonymously into a community.
If he were to choose pro baseball (assuming an organization would have him) he would have to do something incredible in the community to earn redemption and respect. For it to happen starts with, "I made a huge mistake. I'm incredibly sorry." He may have already said it in court. But for him to play baseball the public has to hear it. Then he has to live it.
Personally, as I said previously the game of baseball is bigger than anyone player. If Heimlich never plays baseball again so be it. There's no guarantee he makes the majors anyway. Any organization who takes him on has to think about how much pain it woud cause victims in their community. Unfortunately in the business it world it will come down to dollars and cents not emotions.
RJM posted:It came across as a condescending statement in the form of a question. As for playing in the CWS he did the right thing by backing away from the team. It would be nice to think it was his idea. I wouldn't be surprised if he was advised I do so. Otherwise I believe the president of the university would have stepped in and removed him.
As for being drafted he has the right. I'm guessing every franchise sees it as a poor business decision. It would be dissing a good portion of the fan base (women especially and parents who would be revolted by him being in the organization). If he's drafted it will probably a desperate franchise looking for talent on the cheap.
He's not entitled to a good life. No one is. It has to be earned. He doesn't have to play baseball to have a good life. Hopefully there's more to him as a person than just being a baseball player. I believe it would be very difficult to have a quality, peaceful life in the public spotlight. He would be better off fitting anonymously into a community.
If he were to choose pro baseball (assuming an organization would have him) he would have to do something incredible in the community to earn redemption and respect. For it to happen starts with, "I made a huge mistake. I'm incredibly sorry." He may have already said it in court. But for him to play baseball the public has to hear it. Then he has to live it.
Personally, as I said previously the game of baseball is bigger than anyone player. If Heimlich never plays baseball again so be it. There's no guarantee he makes the majors anyway. Any organization who takes him on has to think about how much pain it woud cause victims in their community. Unfortunately in the business it world it will come down to dollars and cents not emotions.
I'm sure his counsel has advised him to stay quiet and not to say anything publicly or privately on the matter for the (most likely) civil suits that may follow.
RJM posted:It came across as a condescending statement in the form of a question. As for playing in the CWS he did the right thing by backing away from the team. It would be nice to think it was his idea. I wouldn't be surprised if he was advised I do so. Otherwise I believe the president of the university would have stepped in and removed him.
As for being drafted he has the right. I'm guessing every franchise sees it as a poor business decision. It would be dissing a good portion of the fan base (women especially and parents who would be revolted by him being in the organization). If he's drafted it will probably a desperate franchise looking for talent on the cheap.
He's not entitled to a good life. No one is. It has to be earned. He doesn't have to play baseball to have a good life. Hopefully there's more to him as a person than just being a baseball player. I believe it would be very difficult to have a quality, peaceful life in the public spotlight. He would be better off fitting anonymously into a community.
If he were to choose pro baseball (assuming an organization would have him) he would have to do something incredible in the community to earn redemption and respect. For it to happen starts with, "I made a huge mistake. I'm incredibly sorry." He may have already said it in court. But for him to play baseball the public has to hear it. Then he has to live it.
Personally, as I said previously the game of baseball is bigger than anyone player. If Heimlich never plays baseball again so be it. There's no guarantee he makes the majors anyway. Any organization who takes him on has to think about how much pain it woud cause victims in their community. Unfortunately in the business it world it will come down to dollars and cents not emotions.
Wow.
If I had to decide who was the "better person" based on what I've read about this kid and what you've posted here you might not like my answer.
I feel that if you look back at all the atrocities committed against/by mankind, feeding christens to the lions, gladiators, the French and beheadings, Salem and the witch hunts, gas chambers and concentration camps, there was always people like you screaming for blood. Just so sure of thier own holiness and the sins of others....
RJM posted:(snip)
As for being drafted he has the right. I'm guessing every franchise sees it as a poor business decision. It would be dissing a good portion of the fan base (women especially and parents who would be revolted by him being in the organization). If he's drafted it will probably a desperate franchise looking for talent on the cheap.
(Snip)
In case it hasn't been noticed...I'm a woman and I'm a parent (boy and girl) and I wouldn't be "revolted" to have this kid WHO HAS SERVED HIS TIME join the Atlanta Braves.
Double WOW!!! I'm not the freak'n child molester. He is. I'm not denying him anything. Anything he is denied he brought on himself by putting himself in he position to be judged by others. For a MLB franchise to take him on is a business decision. Most people would view it as a very poor business decision. Heimlich was a top fifty prospect. After 315 picks he's still on the board. It looks like 30 MLB franchises see him as a bad business decision. I think you need to write to all 30 GM's and owners to tell them all what horrible human beings they are.
Personally I don't think too highly of anyone who wants to let a child molester slide because he's a talented athlete. So what if he misses a once in a lifetime opportunity to play in the CWS or maybe play pro ball. He took a way a little girl's once in a lifetime opportunity to have a childhood. It may affect her all her life.
I suggest you visit a women's and/or child moestation crisis center to gain a little more perspective on his heinous crime. Learn what the victims go through. Heimlich is not a victim. You need a little bleepn perspective.
CaCO3Girl posted:RJM posted:(snip)
As for being drafted he has the right. I'm guessing every franchise sees it as a poor business decision. It would be dissing a good portion of the fan base (women especially and parents who would be revolted by him being in the organization). If he's drafted it will probably a desperate franchise looking for talent on the cheap.
(Snip)
In case it hasn't been noticed...I'm a woman and I'm a parent (boy and girl) and I wouldn't be "revolted" to have this kid WHO HAS SERVED HIS TIME join the Atlanta Braves.
Do you claim to speak for all women? There have been articles where women are repulsed by Heimlich and the way MLB sees and markets to women.
RJM posted:CaCO3Girl posted:RJM posted:(snip)
As for being drafted he has the right. I'm guessing every franchise sees it as a poor business decision. It would be dissing a good portion of the fan base (women especially and parents who would be revolted by him being in the organization). If he's drafted it will probably a desperate franchise looking for talent on the cheap.
(Snip)
In case it hasn't been noticed...I'm a woman and I'm a parent (boy and girl) and I wouldn't be "revolted" to have this kid WHO HAS SERVED HIS TIME join the Atlanta Braves.
Do you claim to speak for all women? There have been articles where women are repulsed by Heimlich and the way MLB sees and markets to women.
You made it sound like you were speaking for all women and parents so I just wanted to wave my hand, think of it as the dissenting opinion.
Just an FYI the way MLB markets to me, as a woman, is that they have...wait for it.....teams-that-play-baseball. Yup, the big secret is to find women who actually enjoy watching baseball. We are out here.
Oregon DA - Had this (original) crime occurred in Oregon he would still be in prison.
http://www.oregonlive.com/spor...y_district_atto.html
The DA must be a horrible human being!
RJM posted:Oregon DA - Had this (original) crime occurred in Oregon he would still be in prison.
http://www.oregonlive.com/spor...y_district_atto.html
The DA must be a horrible human being!
I wouldn't doubt he's going to be an unemployed human being. The DA commented on the outcome of a case without knowing the facts of the case, the thing about laws is that the criteria could be different from state to state. Again, I'm not saying this boy didn't do something, but none of us knows what that something is. For a sitting DA to comment on it means to me that he won't be a sitting DA for long.
SomeBaseballDad posted:RJM posted:It came across as a condescending statement in the form of a question. As for playing in the CWS he did the right thing by backing away from the team. It would be nice to think it was his idea. I wouldn't be surprised if he was advised I do so. Otherwise I believe the president of the university would have stepped in and removed him.
As for being drafted he has the right. I'm guessing every franchise sees it as a poor business decision. It would be dissing a good portion of the fan base (women especially and parents who would be revolted by him being in the organization). If he's drafted it will probably a desperate franchise looking for talent on the cheap.
He's not entitled to a good life. No one is. It has to be earned. He doesn't have to play baseball to have a good life. Hopefully there's more to him as a person than just being a baseball player. I believe it would be very difficult to have a quality, peaceful life in the public spotlight. He would be better off fitting anonymously into a community.
If he were to choose pro baseball (assuming an organization would have him) he would have to do something incredible in the community to earn redemption and respect. For it to happen starts with, "I made a huge mistake. I'm incredibly sorry." He may have already said it in court. But for him to play baseball the public has to hear it. Then he has to live it.
Personally, as I said previously the game of baseball is bigger than anyone player. If Heimlich never plays baseball again so be it. There's no guarantee he makes the majors anyway. Any organization who takes him on has to think about how much pain it woud cause victims in their community. Unfortunately in the business it world it will come down to dollars and cents not emotions.
Wow.
If I had to decide who was the "better person" based on what I've read about this kid and what you've posted here you might not like my answer.
I feel that if you look back at all the atrocities committed against/by mankind, feeding christens to the lions, gladiators, the French and beheadings, Salem and the witch hunts, gas chambers and concentration camps, there was always people like you screaming for blood. Just so sure of thier own holiness and the sins of others....
...or maybe its about knowing a victim or two of a similar crime and understanding the lifetime impact of it. Or about having run across a perpetrator of such a crime and understanding that it likely never stops....
Frankly, the "wow" is on you for making the comparisons that you did. You show little to no understanding.
I kind of think that this topic should have been closed from the get go, before it got too complicated. The article is correct, this really isn't about baseball, and this site is about just that, baseball.
We all can agree that this is a very unfortunate situation, sad for everyone. I hope that the victim has received proper counseling, as well as Heimlich. It's really hard to wrap your head around this type of crime. Unfortunately this is only one of hundreds and hundreds of sexual assaults upon a child. Statistics shows that most perpetrators of this crimes were victims themselves and both do go on to live productive lives. Some don't.
People are so upset that the school has not come out with a statement. My understanding is that every one has been asked not to discuss until after the championship. ESPN announcers have been told to not discuss. I think that this is a very wise strategy, because this time of year it's all about college baseball, that's it. That's why I feel this topic should be closed.
What I am trying to figure out, is why this story came out when it did. Was the purpose intended to ruin the players chances of being drafted, or bring negative distraction to the #1 team in the country?
TPM posted:
What I am trying to figure out, is why this story came out when it did. Was the purpose intended to ruin the players chances of being drafted, or bring negative distraction to the #1 team in the country?
In an accompanying article, the newspaper presented its rationale on the timing.
What TPM said, this whole story is sad and nobody wins in the end. Lives ruined or made severely complicated.
TPM posted:I kind of think that this topic should have been closed from the get go, before it got too complicated. The article is correct, this really isn't about baseball, and this site is about just that, baseball.
We all can agree that this is a very unfortunate situation, sad for everyone. I hope that the victim has received proper counseling, as well as Heimlich. It's really hard to wrap your head around this type of crime. Unfortunately this is only one of hundreds and hundreds of sexual assaults upon a child. Statistics shows that most perpetrators of this crimes were victims themselves and both do go on to live productive lives. Some don't.
People are so upset that the school has not come out with a statement. My understanding is that every one has been asked not to discuss until after the championship. ESPN announcers have been told to not discuss. I think that this is a very wise strategy, because this time of year it's all about college baseball, that's it. That's why I feel this topic should be closed.
What I am trying to figure out, is why this story came out when it did. Was the purpose intended to ruin the players chances of being drafted, or bring negative distraction to the #1 team in the country?
I always appreciate TPM's posts and usually agree with her, but on the subject of whether this topic is appropriate for HSBBW, I respectfully disagree. It touches on the importance and implications of character at the high school level for future baseball opportunities and success, on whether and how colleges vet their players in terms of their prior actions, and - we will find out by the end of day - what the tolerance level for this behavior is at the professional level. My understanding of this site is that is it about all things high school baseball - the good, the bad, and the ugly. This one happens to fall into the realm of the (very) ugly. We shouldn't shy away from discussing something just because it is difficult and disturbing. IMHO, the HSBBW administrators did the right (and brave) thing by leaving this topic active. If another member disagrees or is offended by the discussion, they are free, as with any thread, to ignore it. As for the political correctness of discussing individual players, I believe we are well within safe territory once they are being discussed on ESPN.com, SI.com, and MLB.com.
TPM isn't the only one to think this thread has run its course. Several members have expressed the same view privately, and I agree.
The news, which has the potential to affect the CWS, has been digested. People have had a chance to express their reactions and views. The discussion is now becoming repetitive and personal--and further and further away from baseball.
It's time to close this one down. Those who want to continue discussing it are free to move their discussion to a private dialogue.