Trust me, I live in Florida, throw 84-86 and am a 2010LHP I'm 6'1", 200. I have no offers. My grades are avg, have never been asked about them, My era is like 00.5 but all I hear is I don't throw hard enough!!! I throw 84-86
Plus I have a Grade A curve, Grade B change and Grade B slider!!
My son was 6'3 165lbs and he had several offers and invites to tryouts. Some of them were top should including Miami U. We never attended any showcases except 1 put ob by his team.
Yes my son was always told to increase his velocity, maybe show cases would have got him even more interest and some high profile schools interest but that was never our goal. He just wanted to pitch against them. If your desire is to play pro they draft from all divisions.
You really have to be careful about what you wish for. Playing for a team you can't get playing time is tough in more ways than one.
Interesting article on academic achievers.
http://www.newsweek.com/id/211432
Yes my son was always told to increase his velocity, maybe show cases would have got him even more interest and some high profile schools interest but that was never our goal. He just wanted to pitch against them. If your desire is to play pro they draft from all divisions.
You really have to be careful about what you wish for. Playing for a team you can't get playing time is tough in more ways than one.
Interesting article on academic achievers.
http://www.newsweek.com/id/211432
The sad part is I play for one of the top Programs in the US- All American Prospects. I'm one of, if not their #1 pitcher. I don't know what else I can do to get noticed. Any advise would be appreciated!
quote:Originally posted by TPM:
From a D1 standpoint, what I have seen, no top tier baseball program recruits LHP with less velocity than 90+, you will find a few LHP lower, but in most cases, they never become starters, and just used in situational matchups (lefty/lefty).
Wow, the Florida schools must be tough! I see a fair amount of PAC-10 games, and there are quite a few pitchers, including right handers, who pitch in the high 80s. Watch the NCAA regionals and WS games, and take note of the radar readings; you'll see lots of pitchers who don't reach 90+. Yet nearly all of those pitchers are recruited.
Something to bear in mind--with high end colleges wrapping up their recruiting much earlier, schools do have to give more thought to projection than they used to. For a 2010, it will be 18 months before he can pitch in a real game, and a skinny tall kid who is throwing, say, 87-88 will get recruited, even if he is right handed (but has movement, command, etc.)
Having said all that, there are way more pitchers who can throw at 85 than at 90. A good pitcher who can hit 90 is very much in demand. The same level of skill, but at 85, is not a rare commodity. The steep slope of the number of pitchers versus velocity means that it is important to know whether 87 means "all time fastest pitch" or "sits at 87".
In any case, 82 mph, even for a 2010 lefthander, is on the slow side. I'd think that the only D1 schools that would be interested would be Ivys. A school like Stanford, which ranks among the top in admission standards, would not, I believe, have any interest.
3FingeredGlove, was that a typo? I am a 2011 LHP (rising junior). I understand that Stanford is out of my reach as well; I do love the school though and if for any reason college baseball doesn't work out, I'll probably apply early to Stanford solely as a student.
Back to my question about academic index, exactly how much does it affect how strong of a pitcher I need to be at the Ivy League schools, considering that my academic index will likely be near-perfect (high 230s), putting me in the higher echelon to the recruiting process as it once was at Ivies?
Another thing: I do not mind if I get stuck in a relieving role, nor do I even mind if I have to ride the bench my freshman year. I love baseball but it's a step I'm willing to take if it means getting into a dream program.
Back to my question about academic index, exactly how much does it affect how strong of a pitcher I need to be at the Ivy League schools, considering that my academic index will likely be near-perfect (high 230s), putting me in the higher echelon to the recruiting process as it once was at Ivies?
Another thing: I do not mind if I get stuck in a relieving role, nor do I even mind if I have to ride the bench my freshman year. I love baseball but it's a step I'm willing to take if it means getting into a dream program.
No, it wasn't a typo, but it wasn't very well explained either. In your first post, you asked a question under the assumption that you wouldn't gain any velocity over the next year. So you'd still be at 82 next year. I transformed that into how it would look this year if you were a 2010. Very poorly stated on my part.
On the other hand your goal of gaining 4-5 mph over the next year would put you into a good position, I suppose, for Ivy League schools.
Regarding very high academic status: that's great, but I believe that once a player exceeds the threshold for inclusion in a particular academic rating, anything extra really doesn't do the athletic program much good. So I doubt that it is valued.
On the other hand your goal of gaining 4-5 mph over the next year would put you into a good position, I suppose, for Ivy League schools.
Regarding very high academic status: that's great, but I believe that once a player exceeds the threshold for inclusion in a particular academic rating, anything extra really doesn't do the athletic program much good. So I doubt that it is valued.
quote:Regarding very high academic status: that's great, but I believe that once a player exceeds the threshold for inclusion in a particular academic rating, anything extra really doesn't do the athletic program much good. So I doubt that it is valued.
So being a high "band 4" athlete wouldn't necessarily mitigate the athletic standards I have to fulfill compared with a "band 2 or 3" athlete? I take it the academic index is no longer quite as relevant for Ivy League schools as it used to be? Thanks for your response.
I don't know how valuable Band 4 is versus a Band 3 athlete. All I meant is that a player who barely meets Band 4 counts just the same as one who at the top of the band.
quote:I don't know how valuable Band 4 is versus a Band 3 athlete. All I meant is that a player who barely meets Band 4 counts just the same as one who at the top of the band.
Oh, I see. So a LHP with a mid-high 80s fastball would normally be considered fulfilling the band 4-caliber athlete then?
I think the root of your questions are: Will your grades get you on the baseball team?
This summer we have talked to many of the ivies, and basically they are saying that they can recruit enough academically qualified kids that they don't need to lower their standards for baseball skills much at all. If a kid isn't getting D1 interest from other colleges, the ivies probably won't be interested either.
The academic index bands are seldom an issue with baseball. Football (with its large roster size) may use the high academic recruits to even things out, but baseball doesn't really have to. Also, the ivies carry a smaller roster, so they like versatile players, and players that can contribute immediately.
This stuff changes every year, so even examples of things that happened 2-4 years ago, can be outdated. If anything, the trend is that there are more high school players that get good enough grades to get into an ivie, so it is the baseball skills that are getting kids recruited.
This summer we have talked to many of the ivies, and basically they are saying that they can recruit enough academically qualified kids that they don't need to lower their standards for baseball skills much at all. If a kid isn't getting D1 interest from other colleges, the ivies probably won't be interested either.
The academic index bands are seldom an issue with baseball. Football (with its large roster size) may use the high academic recruits to even things out, but baseball doesn't really have to. Also, the ivies carry a smaller roster, so they like versatile players, and players that can contribute immediately.
This stuff changes every year, so even examples of things that happened 2-4 years ago, can be outdated. If anything, the trend is that there are more high school players that get good enough grades to get into an ivie, so it is the baseball skills that are getting kids recruited.
http://www.amazon.com/Playing-...dp/0972202668#reader
With all the tools you have today I can't understand why this belief has legs.
Goggle the term "Athletic Admits " its real and exists in every Ivy. PBS dad a 2 hour documentary where several IVY presidents admitted it and said their goal was to have a well rounded student body not just academic grinders. That included athletes and below standard academic students.
With all the tools you have today I can't understand why this belief has legs.
Goggle the term "Athletic Admits " its real and exists in every Ivy. PBS dad a 2 hour documentary where several IVY presidents admitted it and said their goal was to have a well rounded student body not just academic grinders. That included athletes and below standard academic students.
quote:
The academic index bands are seldom an issue with baseball. Football (with its large roster size) may use the high academic recruits to even things out, but baseball doesn't really have to. Also, the ivies carry a smaller roster, so they like versatile players, and players that can contribute immediately.
You're right, this is essentially what I was looking for. Thanks!
quote:
Goggle the term "Athletic Admits " its real and exists in every Ivy. PBS dad a 2 hour documentary where several IVY presidents admitted it and said their goal was to have a well rounded student body not just academic grinders. That included athletes and below standard academic students.
Of course I understand that they can lower academic standards; I just wasn't sure how relevant the academic index/academic bands are to baseball recruiting.
Anyhow, I suppose the only real question I have is if a mid-80s LHP with certain characteristics (fastball movement, deceptive motion, strong curve/decent change) and strong grades/scores (3.95 UW, 2350+ SAT, 800/800/790 SAT subject test scores) is a strong candidate for Ivy League baseball (I'm just throwing the academic info just to give a better idea of where I am as a student) or if I need to improve from an athletic standpoint.
You always need to improve regardless of your ability. But a lhp that can pitch and throws in the mid 80's can pitch at any level. Get out there and compete against the best you can compete against and see how you perform. And the interest you get and who you get it from will tell you what those that matter really think. Good Luck
I agree. Once you show that you can stay eligible academically and hopefully max the academic contribution to the scholarship equation coaches are happy. Now all you have to do is show you can pitch at the high level.
quote:Originally posted by 3FingeredGlove:quote:Originally posted by TPM:
From a D1 standpoint, what I have seen, no top tier baseball program recruits LHP with less velocity than 90+, you will find a few LHP lower, but in most cases, they never become starters, and just used in situational matchups (lefty/lefty).
Wow, the Florida schools must be tough! I see a fair amount of PAC-10 games, and there are quite a few pitchers, including right handers, who pitch in the high 80s. Watch the NCAA regionals and WS games, and take note of the radar readings; you'll see lots of pitchers who don't reach 90+. Yet nearly all of those pitchers are recruited.
Something to bear in mind--with high end colleges wrapping up their recruiting much earlier, schools do have to give more thought to projection than they used to. For a 2010, it will be 18 months before he can pitch in a real game, and a skinny tall kid who is throwing, say, 87-88 will get recruited, even if he is right handed (but has movement, command, etc.)
Having said all that, there are way more pitchers who can throw at 85 than at 90. A good pitcher who can hit 90 is very much in demand. The same level of skill, but at 85, is not a rare commodity. The steep slope of the number of pitchers versus velocity means that it is important to know whether 87 means "all time fastest pitch" or "sits at 87".
In any case, 82 mph, even for a 2010 lefthander, is on the slow side. I'd think that the only D1 schools that would be interested would be Ivys. A school like Stanford, which ranks among the top in admission standards, would not, I believe, have any interest.
Sorry, I must have been sleeping.
Let me repeat, most top tier baseball programs I have seen, LHP are recruited in very high 80's, usually becoming 90+ guys (projectible) after a few years. A lot depends on the program and their goals for pitching.
I didn't mean just here in FL.
But FWIW, the top programs in FL, UM, FSU and UF do not sign pitchers unless they are top velo guys. The may recruit them but they don't sign them unless the need an extra arm with hopes his velo will improve.
Play 9,
The All American Prospects, are they a very good team? Top tier? If so you may be better served by playing for a program that is not geared toward seeding the Top Tier D-1 programs and MLB.
If you were to find a team that plays a similar schedule that was not so rich in pitching, you might find out that you are a starter and get the innings in so that you are seen by a wider array of recruiters.
Play 9 you have a PM.
You should really have no problem playing for a mid level to lower level D-1 or any number of Florida JUCO's.
I would get a video together and circulate it. If you have control you should be able to find a home at the next level.
The All American Prospects, are they a very good team? Top tier? If so you may be better served by playing for a program that is not geared toward seeding the Top Tier D-1 programs and MLB.
If you were to find a team that plays a similar schedule that was not so rich in pitching, you might find out that you are a starter and get the innings in so that you are seen by a wider array of recruiters.
Play 9 you have a PM.
You should really have no problem playing for a mid level to lower level D-1 or any number of Florida JUCO's.
I would get a video together and circulate it. If you have control you should be able to find a home at the next level.
quote:Originally posted by BobbleheadDoll:
My son's college was playing Florida state a few years ago, The one LHP on FS was throwing 78 and they referred to him as a very successful pitcher. FS was ranked #1 that year.
Also there are lots of great relievers in college ball and not all want to be a starter.
Regardless of your velocity let the coaches tell you and do not rely on other people. Lots of D1 pitchers including RHPs do not throw 90+.
You want to tell me who that was? We played many (close to a dozen)games against FSU and never ONCE did we see a pitcher throwing 78. MM would never use a pitcher throwing 78 unless he had to.
Perhaps that was a weekday game and coach threw someone to save an arm?
I don't believe you !
Does RJ Swindle play MLB ? He throws 80 MPH.
Does RJ Swindle play MLB ? He throws 80 MPH.