How many Bases

quote:

Originally posted by mrumpiresir:
R1, outs don't matter. Batter lays down a bunt. F2 fields bunt and overthrows F3. F9 fields overthrow, has possession of the ball, and his momentum carries him completely out of play. At the time the ball was carried out of play, R1 was between second and third base. I ruled 1 base for R1. I'm not sure this was correct.

So,where did you place the runner?

I put him at third. But I'm not sure he shouldn't have been awarded home.

Let's work on this. First, where do you think a base award should be based on? Last legally held base at time of pitch? Time of throw? Time of incident?

Being between bases, or almost to a base is meaning less.

Depending on you answer to the above, you awarded at least two bases and maybe three by placing him at third.

My question is: Is this the same as Catch and Carry where all runners are awarded one base if a ball is unintentionally carried out of play?

When the play happened, my instinct was to award one base because it was pretty much the same thing as a catch and carry. Once F9 gets control of the ball, it is no longer a thrown ball. But in the rule book, catch and carry is only referenced to a caught line drive or fly ball. Never does it address a fielder carrying a thrown ball out of play. So that's why I ruled as I did.

If this is not the case, then I have two bases from the time of th pitch.

What do you think?

quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy03:
Being between bases, or almost to a base is meaning less.

I had to know where the runners were in order to award bases. Since I equated to a catch and carry, they would get one base from the last legally held.

I'll let you two finish this convo before I put my decision in...

Since F9 provided the impetus, although unintentional, for the ball going out of play, award two bases from the time the ball was carried out of play.
Case book 8.8.3 J (a) makes reference to a ball being "kicked" out of play but the application would be the same.

The "catch and carry" ruling applies only to a batted ball.

If you are going to consider this a thrown ball that went out of play then it is 2 bases from TOP since it was the first play by an infielder. That puts BR on 2nd which hardly seems right since he is already past 2nd when the ball goes OOP.

8.3.3J(a) case book play seems a more appropriate ruling since it was F9 action that caused the ball to go OOP. 2 bases from time of incident. Award home.

F9 caused the ball to go out of play in the OP. You have a batted ball being fielded by F2. He throws to F3, first play by an infielder, then it goes down the line. F9 then fields the thrown ball, which takes TOP out of the equation, so now you have to decide TOT or TOI.