Inexcusable!

It's maddening to watch some of the players on the pro level, be they major or minor leaguers. Their seeming apathy and complacency is appalling.

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Maybe they haven't quite projected fully! Give 'em a break!

The only time I've ever enjoyed this is once Barry Bonds hit a monster shot to center field. He stood in the box and watched as it...


...bounced off the fence.

He had to run hard to beat out the SINGLE.

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He didn't hit the ball HGH enough to clear the fence!

Too many of them are overpaid. No one should make the kind of money they make and the stardum treatment they get. Honestly to me bring up a bunch of hungry young guys and put them out there. theyre more fun to watch. Guys like Pedroia, and as soon as their heads are too big go to the next group . Not all the MLB guys are like that but too many are.
I like guys like chipper jones who actually was willing to give some of his money back so the braves could get more players. Hes a loyal player. Craig biggio with the same team. team guys that arent just about the money and how great they think they are. If I was the manager and bonds did that , watched a ball to the wall and barely got a single, I would fine him. every time they didnt hustle i would fine them. I have no patience watching these prima donnas act like they think we owe them something. without the fans where would they all be.

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Here is another take rather than simply lazy/ spoiled/overpaid...

Last year was talking to a former winning world series manager ...he said that every year the organization sent him better athletes...

...but worse baseball players. Guys who could run and jump, but didn't fully understand the game.

I call it "Sparqball". Not looking for baseball players...but rather guys who fit certain physical athletic perfomance profiles. To an extent his has always gone on (see "the look") but with more and broader "Combine" testing it will only get worse.

44
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observer44

I totally agree----we see kids who are great athletes who come to us but when it comes to baseball acumen they are severely lacking---in the game of baseball athleticism can only take you so far

ob and TR,

This had nothing to do with athleticism or baseball knowledge. It simply had to do with hustling or not.
They did not and it is "inexcusable". Could of very well cost them the game.

As a coach, manager, owner or fan, this should not be tolerated!

I agree with you that's-a-balk. Unfortunately it will most likely be tolerated.

I think we need a sparq plug for this sparqball...that would stop it!

thats-a-balk,

I agree with you, it is inexcusable.

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You know...I disagree...I am convinced that there is a connection...

In the end it is not only a player issue, but an organizational issue. It comes down in part to priorities of the people in a capacity of decision making, and the team culture they create. If the culture that you create as a manager or an organization proves repeatedly to its players through raises and discipline and promotions, that it values raw physical (sparq) skills over hustle or baseball knowledge or details....then the attitudes of the players and their performance will certainly reflect that. If details and hustle and baseball smarts are valued, and rewarded, and promoted as much as Sparq skills, their performance will reflect that.

Basic organizational theory 1A will tell you that employees are products of their environment. Why? Because as long as you work for an organization and you choose to get ahead in that organization you are forced to take on the culture it values. If players get dinged, big time for such transgressions they’d learn. If, on the other hand you are in the majors and you got there without being required to do those things because you had a trump card (Sparq score talent) then you are a product of the organization...and it’s values.

It has been my observation coaching that players will often rely on their strengths and ignore their weaknesses as long as they are allowed. Failure, competition, managers, team culture, role models, press (embarrassment) are all methods by which players are forced to, or decide to take on their weaknesses and the details. If you make it clear to them that their raw physical skills are more important than the details, then “you reap what you sow”. I blame it as much on the organizations and their failure to value such things as I do players who won’t do them. It’s too easy and very simplistic to blame the players because they make too much money

The larger issue is that it is as much now about entertainment and filling the seats, as it is baseball. To a great extent it had become an entertainment business not a sport. Hustle and details appeal to the purist, of whom there are limited numbers. Everyone understands a 450 foot home run.

44
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ob,

I guess that begs the simple question-
Do the players run the oranizations, or do the organizations run the players. I think we all know the answer to that!

So far there has never been a player, not one, drafted because of their Sparq score. In fact, the highest Sparq scores we have seen do not belong to the early draft picks.

I don't understand how or why people think Sparq scores have anything what-so-ever to do with who is playing professional baseball. If anything the results of the draft, so far, prove the complete opposite!

MLB scouts still grade on Fielding ability, Arm, Power, speed and hitting ability as well as other things. Not on Sparq scores.

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quote:

Originally posted by observer44:
Hustle and details appeal to the purist, of whom there are limited numbers.

Purist® Hatbox® toilet by Kohler©




With its clean minimalist design, the Purist© Hatbox© toilet opens the door to a new era of possibilities for making design statements in your home. It's so pure and...uh...hatbox like you won't want to despoil it's artful elegance...and believe me it won't let you. It has features that will mete out punishment to your more delicate regions if you try. It will have you hustling for sure...to get as far away from it as possible!

There is a reason why it is equipped with a state-of-the-art programmable memory designed to customize the letting go experience of up to 16 different users. It will remember you...and everything about you that it finds particularly useful and effective. It remembers all of the details. Is it any wonder why these are the toilets installed at the detention camp at Guantanamo Bay?

After just one round with the Purist© Hatbox© toilet you will take all of your business down to the old American Standard© next to the laundry room in the basement...it isn't glamorous and it's always a bit musty down there, but you won't have to worry about missing any of your parts after using it.

The Purist© Hatbox© toilet incorporates innovative tankless Power Lite® technology providing exceptional flushing performance...isn't that the painful truth!

A Comfort Height™ bowl and Quiet-Close™ toilet seat ensure a tolerable level of noise that will not arouse suspicion.

* 24-5/8"L x 16-1/2"W x 16-5/8"H...and weighs a ton.
* Complements other Purist© fixtures and devices.
* 12" rough-in and rough-up.
* Electronic soft-touch actuation...don't be deceived.
* Elongated bowl for elongated results.
* NOTE: Requires 120V, 15A, 60 Hz electrical receptacle.
* NOTE: Protection by a Class A GFCI will take all of the fun out of it.

List price: $3198.80 and up...and that my dear 44 is why there are a limited number of Purists©!



BTW 44...good post...makes sense to me. Helps to explain some of these bone-headed plays...that are inexcusable.


Sorry for the interruption...I'm flush out of things to say...it's inexcusable...carry on.





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PG,

Taking it literally...I agree completely....Sparq testing is not the end all and do all and never will be. I did not mean in any way to imply so...

...but IMO the rise and usage of Sparq type scores is symptomatic of a larger change in culture. And any change in culture has ramifications for an organization, it's employees and it's product.

44
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quote:

Originally posted by fanofgame:
Too many of them are overpaid. No one should make the kind of money they make and the stardum treatment they get. Honestly to me bring up a bunch of hungry young guys and put them out there. theyre more fun to watch. Guys like Pedroia, and as soon as their heads are too big go to the next group . Not all the MLB guys are like that but too many are.
I like guys like chipper jones who actually was willing to give some of his money back so the braves could get more players. Hes a loyal player. Craig biggio with the same team. team guys that arent just about the money and how great they think they are. If I was the manager and bonds did that , watched a ball to the wall and barely got a single, I would fine him. every time they didnt hustle i would fine them. I have no patience watching these prima donnas act like they think we owe them something. without the fans where would they all be.

But they are stars, they are among the very FEW elite athlete/entertainers in the business.
They like movie stars, entertain and make $$$$$ for the orgainzation. The value of the player is not always about winning games but also about putting butts in the seats, marketing etc.

Players are about as loyal as teams they work for.

The value of the player is how he plays the game. I am the consumer and I dont have to pay for overpriced tickets to watch players who dont hustle and play the game with 100%. To me they may be an elite group, but they also have a role as role models to our youth.
The movie stars , thats a entirely difffernt post all together. Dont want to waste space on the condition of a lot of those peopes morals.
Your right its a business just like the movie business. But for me and it will never change, i grew up going to games with my dad, i watched willie mays play for the giants,and many other great players. To me I am a baseball fan, they are not elite to me,they are athletes that are paid to play a game that so many of us love.Too bad its only a business to many. to me its sill a game and i want to see 100% every game I watch.

quote:

Originally posted by observer44:
.

Here is another take rather than simply lazy/ spoiled/overpaid...

Last year was talking to a former winning world series manager ...he said that every year the organization sent him better athletes...

...but worse baseball players. Guys who could run and jump, but didn't fully understand the game.

I call it "Sparqball". Not looking for baseball players...but rather guys who fit certain physical athletic perfomance profiles. To an extent his has always gone on (see "the look") but with more and broader "Combine" testing it will only get worse.

44
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It is working itself well into the college ranks also. My sons team has a couple of fairly thin but "fast" kids on the team and the coach loves them. Unfortunately they are fundamentally weak baserunners, cann't hit with power, and cann't read the pitcher when on base but they get a lot of playing time because of POTENTIAL. It just kind of grates on a fan when a fly ball is hit to the outfield and a kid just takes off running wildly and doesn't watch the play and prepare to tag up, thus turning a sac fly into a double play OR gets thrown out stealing on a fastball count with a short lead.

I once had a pro scout tell me that the two (2) most overated things in baseball were speed. Speed running and speed (pitchers MPH) pitching. But he went on to say the front office loves it because they both can be measured and compared to other players.

quote:

Originally posted by thats-a-balk!:
Watching the Rangers/Blue jays game yesterday there were two plays that were totally inexcusable.
The first was when Ian Kinsler was on first base with two out and Michael Young hit a fly ball to right field. Ian Just jogging around the bases failed to score when the left fielder dropped the ball.

Second, Hank Blaylock hits a shot to right field and it one hops the right field fence. Replay shows Hank jogging out of the batters box and ends up with a single.

Taught from T-Ball to hustle out ever ball.
By the way, Texas lost 5-4 in 10.

No big deal, that's just Ian being Ian and Hank being Hank. How about we give the same man love for them as Manny gets for his "style of play".

For the record, I searched as many media outlets as I could and could not find one comment anywhere about either of those two plays in recaps of the game. So I went to MLB.com and watched the game from their archives to see for myself.

I agree that Blalock didn't run hard out of the box but I would like to know how you are so sure Kinsler was jogging. The only replays that were shown were of Rios's error. When the camera cut to Kinsler he was halfway down the line towards home before stopping and going back to third. The announcers made no mention of Kinsler not hustling.

The fly ball that Rios dropped was a short fly down the right field line that he angled in and towards the line on. Kinsler would have had his back to the play and been depending on his 3rd base coach on that play.

Kinsler had a good game that day. He singled in a run. He singled, stole second and advanced home on a fly ball and ground out. He made a beautiful diving stop to start a double play. He is a hustling, s****** type player all the way.

Thats-a-balk, are you positive he was jogging? Did you see it?

quote:

To me I am a baseball fan, they are not elite to me,they are athletes that are paid to play a game that so many of us love.Too bad its only a business to many. to me its sill a game and i want to see 100% every game I watch.

To me, professional baseball (or professional anything) is not what I love. Baseball at the professional level and football and basketball both at the college level and the professional level have become entertainment. It's all about the almighty dollar.

High school sports is the absolute best in all aspects IMO. Players are there because they want to be there and many are playing a game they love.


This "going through the motions" stuff is already in the high schools and it's sad. It's disappointing. There's a reason that I as an offensive linemen beat our running backs in sprints consistently.

I believe it's 'Doughnutman' (sorry if I'm off slightly on the name) that puts it best... "HUSTLE never has a bad day"