Is the Patriot District the Best???

It has been well documented here that the Patriot District is tops in NOVA, by far according to most, myself included. However, the non-conference opponents are not exactly stellar. Maybe 3 good teams total out of those you show. Only 3-4 of those teams that have winning records I believe.

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Maybe 3 good teams total out of those you show. Only 3-4 of those teams that have winning records I believe.

You might want to check the records of those teams Lake Braddock has played. I don't believe there is one team with a losing record.

Those were the teams I was referring to. LB is that good. They should be beating everyone.

You are really not trying to say the others are playing tough non-conference teams are you?

The point is...top to bottom, what district is better???

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You are really not trying to say the others are playing tough non-conference teams are you?

Nope. Although I have not seen all the disticts, from what I have seen, the Patriot is probably the toughest.

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Originally posted by golfball:

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You are really not trying to say the others are playing tough non-conference teams are you?

Nope. Although I have not seen all the disticts, from what I have seen, the Patriot is probably the toughest.

I agree 100%....certainly in NOVA. Can't speak for the rest of the state.

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Posted April 21, 2011 09:44 AM Hide Post
Those were the teams I was referring to. LB is that good. They should be beating everyone.

You are really not trying to say the others are playing tough non-conference teams are you?

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Maybe 3 good teams total out of those you show. Only 3-4 of those teams that have winning records I believe.

Dblemup, you might want to check your facts before you post in the future. Not only has Lake Braddock played a strong out-of-district schedule, West Springfield has also played and beaten none other than Woodbridge (that would be last year's State runners-up) and Osbourn Park (record 13-0 before yesterday's game and locally ranked). Those were both "away" games, by the way. And I haven't even checked all the other teams that the other Patriot district teams have played on the above list.

Also, I don't see anything posted on this thread that says anything about the quality of the non-conference (district?) teams that other districts in the state are playing.


You might want to check the records of those teams Lake Braddock has played. I don't believe there is one team with a losing record.

I'm reposting because in my haste to get back to work, I placed my response between two previous quotes: Dblemup, you might want to check your facts before you post in the future. Not only has Lake Braddock played a strong out-of-district schedule, West Springfield has also played and beaten none other than Woodbridge (that would be last year's State runners-up) and Osbourn Park (record 13-0 before yesterday's game and locally ranked). Those were both "away" games, by the way. And I haven't even checked all the other teams that the other Patriot district teams have played on the above list.

Also, I don't see anything posted on this thread that says anything about the quality of the non-conference (district?) teams that other districts in the state are playing.

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Originally posted by berryberrygood:
I'm reposting because in my haste to get back to work, I placed my response between two previous quotes: Dblemup, you might want to check your facts before you post in the future. Not only has Lake Braddock played a strong out-of-district schedule, West Springfield has also played and beaten none other than Woodbridge (that would be last year's State runners-up) and Osbourn Park (record 13-0 before yesterday's game and locally ranked). Those were both "away" games, by the way. And I haven't even checked all the other teams that the other Patriot district teams have played on the above list.

Also, I don't see anything posted on this thread that says anything about the quality of the non-conference (district?) teams that other districts in the state are playing.

The OP showed the records of Patriot District teams against out of conference opponents, so there was a comparison done. I merely pointed out that the VAST majority of the Patriot victorys were against less than steller teams at the moment...and I complemented LB about their squad, as I have with Woodson, SC and WS in other threads. You are right about Woodbridge, they were state runner ups LAST YEAR, but 5-4 per their website...in a district that is not that strong top to bottom.

I also gave my opinion about the Patriot District being the class of NOVA.

If you want to think that the games listed above are all quality wins, that is your right. Just as is my right to know that most of them aren't.

As for my research...I don't just look at W-L to make my determinations. I actually go to games and I have seen these teams play and know many of the players and families...and the player's abilities.

Again, these are my opinions based on what I have seen and what I am told by people associated with these programs.

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dblemup
Member

Posted April 21, 2011 08:53 AM Hide Post
It has been well documented here that the Patriot District is tops in NOVA, by far according to most, myself included. However, the non-conference opponents are not exactly stellar. Maybe 3 good teams total out of those you show. Only 3-4 of those teams that have winning records I believe.

Dblemup, you are backtracking and changing course at the same time. I've copied your original post above. The OP said nothing about the quality of opponents, merely stating the record of the top Patriot District teams vs. all non-district opponents thus far. OF COURSE, I do not think that ALL games listed above are "quality wins'" (however you may wish to define that), but your facts were wrong. You said there were "Maybe 3 good teams total out of those you show." Then you backtracked a bit and said "Only 3-4 of these teams have winning records I believe." and "The Lake Braddock opponents are the teams I was referring to."

Your facts are wrong, and to make it worse (or to throw in a red herring), you imply that I think that all of "the games listed above are quality wins." -- something that had nothing to do with what I said, and something that only a fool would believe.

Are the majority of the Patriot non-district opponents listed "less than stellar?" Probably, but that is an opinion (and one I happen to agree with), but again that is only an opinion.

Does that mean that a 25-2 record is tarnished by any means? Not in my opinion, but apparently it is in yours.

Is the Patriot district the "class of NOVA," as you say? Again just an opinion. Hard to back up with facts (other than overall records, which you discount). I happen to agree that the Patriot district is, if not the "class" of NOVA, it's at least in the very top tier. I also see a lot of Patriot games, know many players and families, but that doesn't mean that my opinion is any more valuable than yours.

Go ahead and express any opinion you'd like -- that's one thing that this website it all about -- but don't spout off about incorrect facts, and don't write opinions that you say are those of someone else.

OK...Let me add another. West Potomac, currently in 6th place in the Patriot, beats McLean 4-1 today...more details on the Northern VA scores.

Although obviously the other districts in the region (and elsewhere in the state) are competitive, and have fine teams, generally I agree that it would be difficult for Patriot teams to schedule a non-district slate as competitive as what they find in the Patriot district. It is impossible to schedule non-district teams that would all result in "quality wins" with a victory, but it's that much harder to do so when some of the better teams in the region are already in the district.

Beating up teams from Upstate New York who basically just play from April-May, while Virginia players have the luxury of almost playing year round is hardly putting you in the "best" or "class of" category.

The Patriot Division has solid programs, but when was the last time and how frequently are they State champions?

I would guess that the "Class" or "Best" of the Commonwealth would come from the Richmond or Hampton Roads areas.

If you are just staying with the Northern Virginia area, the Battlefield District in the Fredericksburg/Spotsylvania region consistently produces Div I players. Some of which have gone on to pro ball.

As much as I would like to let this matter rest, I must respond to CNY's post. Once again, let's check facts:
Who's beating up on NY team's? I guess you mean Annandale's wins...just a few of those that are liste. The vast majority of the games listed are against other Virginia opponents.

Virginia players playing year-round? Where? None that I know of. Are you thinking maybe of Florida or Arizona or California?

Battlefield District produces a lot of fine players, D1 and otherwise. So do all of the other district mentioned in your post.

And last, in response to your question about the last time the Patriot District (not Division) produced State Champions...let me check...oh yeah, that would be last year, when West Springfield won it. Thanks for asking.

One indicia of best might be the players produced. Commentary has been made in other posts of the D1 and otherwise players produced. Which district has the most alumni who are current MLB players? Minor league players?

Okay, so West Springfield won last year. Mainly on the arm of a very good prospect. Up until last year, the top schools I had always heard about were James River and Menchville. Neither of which are in the Patriot District.

Woodbridge had a great run last year. But again, what did they do before or since?

All I am saying is, before you can call yourself the "class" or "best" you should have a consistent pattern of success to back it up. One championship season does not merit that.

Looking at the original post, in my opinion the only opponents beaten that would be considered top schools are Osbourn Park and Paul VI.

Upton brothers - Hampton Roads?

Mike Cuddyer - Hampton Roads

David Wright - Hampton Roads

Kevin Zimmerman - Hampton Roads

The Verlander brothers - Richmond/Central area?

Cody Wheeler - Spotsylvania

Jarret Parker - Fredericksburg

Justin Moore - Fredericksburg

John Maine - Fredericksburg

I think Wake Forest has two from the same squad at James River.

Again, just an opinion.

Is this a pattern of success?:

Big Leaguers:

Joe Saunders - Patriot District
Chris Speier - Patriot District
Javier Lopez - Patriot District (I know. not anymore)
Sean Camp - Patriot District (same)

Jesse Beal (not a big leaguer but currently in AA I think)

Currently at big time D1 schools:

Bobby Wahl - Patriot District (Ole Miss)
Mike Kent- Patriot District (Clemson)
Shane Halley - Patriot District (UVA)
Charlie Morgan - Patriot District (WF)

Im leaving a TON off the list and I think that there are something like 10 kids in the district who are signed with D1 schools right now.

I agree with CNT that there is great baseball throughout the state but felt it was worth pointing out that in addition to being the best district right now (imo), the Patriot also has plenty to brag about in terms of history.

I have to pipe in hear. CNY2010, we are talking about districts and then we are talking about teams this year.

So, take all your individual player and past year comments and start another topic. You mention one player here and one team there.I could go back and look and say, Joe Saunders, West Springfield Little League and High School, but really blossomed later on and pitches in pro ball. And there are others from the Patriot District.

Again, overall from top to bottom, the Patriot District seems to be tops this year. This could all change on one weekend during regionals.

So, sit back, hope that happens and then have your fun.

Settle down Dad's....

It's just an opinion.

Maryann or Ginger?

Another "only an opinion" after stating stats and figures that don't really speak to the original topic.

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Originally posted by vabaseballfan:
Is this a pattern of success?:

Big Leaguers:

Joe Saunders - Patriot District
Chris Speier - Patriot District
Javier Lopez - Patriot District (I know. not anymore)
Sean Camp - Patriot District (same)

Jesse Beal (not a big leaguer but currently in AA I think)

Currently at big time D1 schools:

Bobby Wahl - Patriot District (Ole Miss)
Mike Kent- Patriot District (Clemson)
Shane Halley - Patriot District (UVA)
Charlie Morgan - Patriot District (WF)

Im leaving a TON off the list and I think that there are something like 10 kids in the district who are signed with D1 schools right now.

I agree with CNT that there is great baseball throughout the state but felt it was worth pointing out that in addition to being the best district right now (imo), the Patriot also has plenty to brag about in terms of history.

Not to argue, just to add.

Mike Bianucci - AA Rangers (Frisco) Franchise HR leader 2 years straight (according to web)...5 HRs in 13 games so far this year - Patriot (Woodson)

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Originally posted by novabball:
Another "only an opinion" after stating stats and figures that don't really speak to the original topic.

Opinions make this board and often deviate from the OP...no big deal...no need for ill feelings just because a post doesn't agree with another post.

I like reading other thoughts and opinions.

Maryann or Ginger?


I'm not sure, I liked them both.

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Originally posted by golfball:
Maryann or Ginger?


I'm not sure, I liked them both.

Ginger wouldn't give you the time of day...better go with MA

I haven't done a tally but I don't think there's going to be any district in VA that's sent more players to Division I in the last 3-4 years than the Dominion. James River, Cosby, Manchester, Midlothian, Clover Hill, L.C. Bird and Monacan. And that includes 3 of the last 5 state champions.

Someday I hope AA Powhatan moves up to AAA and joins the Dominion. They have a good group in collegiate ball as well and more on the way there soon.

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Originally posted by Midlo Dad:
I haven't done a tally but I don't think there's going to be any district in VA that's sent more players to Division I in the last 3-4 years than the Dominion. James River, Cosby, Manchester, Midlothian, Clover Hill, L.C. Bird and Monacan. And that includes 3 of the last 5 state champions.

Someday I hope AA Powhatan moves up to AAA and joins the Dominion. They have a good group in collegiate ball as well and more on the way there soon.

Just asking--

What prevents Powhatan from joining Dominion?

Years ago, schools in VA could petion to play up to larger division. Is that still allowed? Is Powhatan close to size yet to have to move up? They'd have to compete in all sports--been a football AA power. But are other sports (including girl's sports) ready?

I don't know all there is to know about Powhatan, but I'm pretty sure they'd do just fine in AAA level in baseball and football.

It's just a matter of when the school wants it, I guess. I think if they reach a certain size, they have to. They don't have to yet, but I think they could if they wanted to. It's a shame because I think we're at a point where the kids who grow up in Powhatan would see themselves more in rivalry with the neighboring Chesterfield schools than with the easy pickin's they are having in their current AA district.

The move would have to save them a fortune on bus costs, that's for sure.

I have heard from Powhatan folks they would very much like to play AAA Baseball. The official reason the dont is the Administration does not feel all of the sports are ready to compete at that level.
I have heard unofficial reason is the football program likes things the way they are.

The travel is murder for them - they do not play hardly any team within a hour from them. Even worse now that the new high school is even further east on 60.

One thing that's changing is just the demographics of Powhatan. More and more their population is like the adjoining area of northern Chesterfield, an upscale suburb of Richmond, not a rural area trying to stay insulated from suburban sprawl. Having them in the Central Region would be no different than having Hanover or Atlee, or Dinwiddie or Prince George.

Most of the land in Powhatan may still be rural, but most of the population is suburban, and they are going to see themselves as more a part of the Richmond area than a part of the pastoral countryside. When you work in Richmond, you would rather see a game in northern Chesterfield than in, say, Brunswick County.