It's Happened In Florida, Games Reduced, 25 To 20

Yep, I wrote numerous emails against the fact. Ironically the FHSAA is located in the same office park as my office.

Its to bad.

More time for summer ball.

quote:

Originally posted by 2Bmom:
More time for summer ball.

and more money

I can't seem to figure out why you put a happy face behind your statement 2Bmom did you want it this vote to pass, did you want games to be reduced? I'm just asking. I hope it was a joke.

Because, on a personal level, I like the summer season better. Level of play is higher, games are more fun to watch. I realize it is not like that for everyone, but that is my personal point of view based on our situation. Besides, we can't do anything about it anyway. I'm sure 90% of the feedback the FHSAA got was against the change, but they made it anyway. Doesn't bother me one way or the other.

what was the reason behind it? a 20% reduction in the schedule is very significant.

I think it has to do with money. Is that right, EStone and Rock-N-Fire? Education budgets are getting slashed across the state. The situation really is dire.

And, despite my personal preference for the summer season, now that I think about it, it definitely is a bad thing for Florida.

While I know that the level of play is higher, I'll have to disagree with the games are funner to watch. In my opinion, I have more fun watching games where my son is playing against kids he's grown up with, such as high school. I think that somewhat it's funner for the parents of travel ball cause the parents can "hang out at the hotel pool" and toss some drinks down. I know I do when we travel. Now in no way am I referring this to you. Please don't get that impression. I just think it sucks that high school games are cut back therefore I pay more for the extra games out of town.

Was baseball the only sport that shortened the schedule? It seems ridiculous to play only a 20 game schedule in Florida. Actually I thought 25 was too short.

How much money can this save. The big cost is in fielding a team. (Uniforms, field, coaches, etc.) How much more money can eliminating 5 games save? The way I see it... The per game cost of baseball just went up in Florida. The big costs are still there, they save in what?... a few baseballs, a small amount of travel, umpires?

Sport Old New
*Baseball 25 20
*Girls basketball 25 20
*Boys basketball 25 20
Bowling 18 15
Cheerleading n/a no change
Cross country 13 11
Flag football 12 10
*Football 10 no change
Golf 14 13
Lacrosse 18 15
*Girls s****r 25 20
*Boys s****r 25 20
*Softball 25 20
Swimming & diving 13 11
Tennis 18 15
Track 1A/2A 13 11
Track 3A/4A 13 11
*Girls volleyball 25 20
Boys volleyball 25 20
Water polo 25 20
Girls weightlifting 13 11
Boys weighlifting 13 11
*Wrestling 18 15


Source: FHSAA * - Indicates these sports have preseason classics.

i think they shortened our season.by a few games, but i think it was due to fuel prices. before they came down.

Wow! They took the chainsaw to prep sports.

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:
Wow! They took the chainsaw to prep sports.

Yeah it got pretty ugly. Did you notice that football was the only one not reduced. It's B.S.

I am not sure about Florida, but in California there are all kinds of CIF rules on play and what is considered a "game". Double-headers count as one, sometimes a "tournament" counts as one. It is actually quite confusing. In the end I believe we will actually play 30 games but "officially" it is around 22-25.

This does not change the fact that they are cutting back games by 20% - whatever the rules are.

Well, at least you still have sports in Fl.
As of the middle of March this year, the Mount Diablo Unified School District has dropped ALL after school sports programs for the 2009-2010 school years after this season. The district cut any and all funding from the sports programs and because not all schools have the support of parent donations all schools are required to drop the sports programs.
The district is trying to pass a bond issue in May for more property taxes and say that if the bond passes that it may free up some funds for sports but sports are not mentioned as receiving any of the bond funds in the tax measure.
It doesn't look good for the bond to pass, but even if it does, they still may have no money for sports.

6 High schools, almost 10,000 students, NO sports!

I don't get what the big deal is if the sports programs weren't cut with the economy and all. Don't it beat losing the sports programs? Looks like most sports got their schedule reduced, not just baseball. 20 games isn't the worst thing. That's about average for high schools anyway give or take a couple of games.

The cuts across the board will save money.

I feel badly for the players of every sport that do it because it is an extra curricular activity and they have no plans to play beyond HS. It will be harder for them to make the roster, where in the past they possibly could.

As a parent I would have no problem being assessed a nominal fee to make up the deficit ----I am with PG---with the Florida weather they could play many more games than they do---right now they are playing the same amount of games as we do here in the Northeast but the PSAL which is not part of the state organization plays close to 50 games in many cases

It is very sad indeed imo. Around here many conferences are going to JV , Varsity DH's to reduce travel cost. The varsity teams ride with the jv to cut the travel in half. I feel this is only the start. The first things to be cut are the things that the suits do not feel are essential. Sports rank very high on that list.

quote:

How much money can this save. The big cost is in fielding a team. (Uniforms, field, coaches, etc.) How much more money can eliminating 5 games save? The way I see it... The per game cost of baseball just went up in Florida. The big costs are still there, they save in what?... a few baseballs, a small amount of travel, umpires?

The high school I am working at currently through school had a game canceled last week. The AD estimates they lost roughly $800-1,000 after adding up the costs of Diamond-Dry, paying the umpires, and lost gate.

quote:

Around here many conferences are going to JV , Varsity DH's to reduce travel cost. The varsity teams ride with the jv to cut the travel in half. I feel this is only the start.

School I'm currently at does this. They play the varsity game and then play as much of a JV game as possible. At some of the schools, they are able to play both games due to having lights and some schools have two fields. Others, they play the varsity game and 2-3 innings JV.

Conference my high school is in plays JV and Varsity baseball and softball on the same day on separate fields. I've seen other conferences who play both baseball and softball varsities at one place and JV baseball and softball at the other.

Illinois can play up to 35 games during the regular season. My high school coach schedules 37-40 games expecting some to get canceled. Also, he has one scheduled every year the week of the regional that they have agreed if either school runs out of games, it gets canceled. Missouri I was told can play 18 games and two tournaments.

Here in NC you can play a max of 24 regular season games. If your conference has a tourney at the end of the year they do not count towards that 24. So if you do have a tourney you will play 25 with the possibility of playing 27. Every team can play 2 pre season scrimmages.

The playoffs are four rounds of one and done and then 2/3 for the east or west title and then 2/3 for the state title. So the max under this situation would be 37 games for the season if you went the distance and played 3 in each series.

Most teams of course just play their 24 game schedule and many of those teams lose a couple due to rain outs etc. I can not imagine working so hard all year to get to the hs season and it being reduced like this. I can see where moves like this will open the door for other options to become more and more attractive to players.

Its really a shame in my opinion.

Also let me add this. We decided a few years ago to come off of welfare from the school system. They gave us an operating budget of 5,800 for the year. This includes uniforms , balls , equipment such as t's ,cage ,nets ,screens ,catchers gear , etc etc. Also coming out of this is umpire fees which are 45 per umpire times 2 per game for a cost of 95 per home game. Turface etc anything for the field also comes out of this. In fact anything and everything we need including paint comes out of this.

For years our players had to buy their own cleats , hats , socks , belts , t shirts , etc etc because after all the expenses there was not enough money left over.

We started a dugout club a few years back and became totally self sufficient. We ask for nothing and we raise everything we need without the players having to buy one item. The only thing that cost the school is lights and fuel for away games. The gate and concession stand more than covers these costs for us.

People are going to have to start doing alot more for themselves or start living with getting alot less. Its a very unfortunate situation with the loss of games. Very sad for the kids.

In Kentucky you are allowed 36 regular season games and each game in a tournament counts as a game so you don't gain anything from it. My old school was very similar to what Coach May put. If we bought anything we raised the money for it. Only thing we didn't pay for was umpire fees but I was constantly reminded that gate money from basketball games was what paid for them although all money raised at the gate from every sport went into one general fund.

Here's the problem with reducing the schedule - too much practice. Don't get me wrong because practice is important but at some point you need to play the game. A lot of states only give a two week preseason and that is not enough time to prepare for a season but the flip side is you only play twice a week. Another problem is you are going to space the games out so far that you aren't going to develop a pitching staff. You get two pretty good pitchers and 2 - 3 guys who can eat innings and that's all you need.

There are a ton of problems with education and I'm not going to go into all of them because I would be typing until Friday but the one I will discuss here is the money. How can we expect these kids to get a quality education when we can't pay for it and the teachers aren't getting paid enough? If you look at how the money is spread out at a school it doesn't get spread evenly. I would say around 70% of the money is spent on special needs kids / programs. I'm not saying they shouldn't get the money they do but why can't we spend more money on the kids who on the other end of in the middle?

Those two groups are getting short changed in their education but they make up the majority of the school population. The school district I'm teaching in now is stressing how we have to compete globally against the Chinese. Well it's not going to work because the Chinese do not do what we do. The lower end kids in China don't get an education. They go straight to work or left to fend for themselves. In American we try to give every kid an education even if they don't want it. So while China sends out kids who do better in school it's because they didn't have to sit in a classroom with the kids who want to cause trouble.

I'm not saying we need to forget our lower end kids but we need to do more for our higher / middle end kids.

Sorry for the rant - my 5th period is a struggle to teach.

On the florida situation...

Of the 15 FHSAA board members the vote was 8-7.

First, I agree with PGStaff ...in my mind all you have to do is set a minimum number of games (20?) to qualify for the post-season. Any games a school wants to play beyond 20 is up to them. Howver, I'm sure this was ruled-out for fear of giving a team able to play more games an "experience" advantage.

Now then, for our school...we recieve/take no money for baseball from the school district. Because of that, everything is funded supported by the booster club/parents. Subsequently, the players fees are a bit steep..BUT each kid/family can raise their fees dollar for dollar. Such that, if a plyer/family gets two field signs and a foursome for the golf tourny their fees we're taken care of.

It is a funding issue for the smaller, rural schools who do use district funding. My suggestion beyond the minimum game idea was to let each school sort it out. By that I mean this... today in a lot of HS programs kids (in Fla) kids get designer uni;s if not two, cleats ...hotel rooms for overnight back -to-back games...meals etc. etc. I suggested we go back to more local schedules, let kids wear t-shirt jerseys, cut the meal, play some games on Saturday (cuts out lights)etc. etc. Cutting some perks or extravagances wont diminish the level of baseball.

My other argument against it, is that travel/showcase ball will move-in...and you'll have what you are having in California. Now, I am not against travel/showcase ball, my guy plays it. In fact, he has never had more fun, and improved as much as last summer playing around the SE and being around older, future pro/college players as he did last summer. I'm for travel/showcase ball...admittedly, I like it better (for us). However, nothing can replace playing in font your peers, teachers, friends for you school and so on. The kids will even tell you that. Secondly, travel/showcase ball isn't for everyone...and in the end this policy depletes opportunities. Lastly, it decreases the amount of baseball I get to watch.

One last thing... many schools still pay the school district to bus the kids to games. Our school does not. 4-6 parents volunteer for each away game and drive them.

Why not reduce the number of dates you can play, rather than the number of games? At least that would allow teams to schedule some doubleheaders to get some extra games in without requiring extra travel. I guess that's not an option with some of the other sports, but baseball is perfectly suited for doubleheaders. Sure, in high school, it would be two five inning games, which isn't a lot different from one seven inning game, but it would at least be an option even if only for non district games.

Doubleheaders would be a good idea for any school anywhere. Expand the number of games without the travel, although you still gotta pay the umpires. You figure most schools carry 15-18 players plus a traveling JV squad they can pluck players from so running out of players isn't a problem in HS baseball if multiple doubleheaders need to be played.

They cut freshman and JV team schedules 40% also.

Hey Estone28, by the article at Orlando Sentinel the vote was 9-6. Not that it really matters.

http://orlandosentinel.com/spo...2809,0,4479623.story

The issue is fuel costs. Cutting down on the number of games across the board saves the counties money and is a two year plan only, unless the economic landscape gets better.
This morning I heard that adding tournaments (all sports) during holiday periods is being addressed. The issue is liability, and since most drive themselves or driven by parents usually occurs during these times, they may allow.

I am with PG on this one. 25 games is short. 20 games is getting down to why bother area.

You bother for the kids who cannt afford club or travel. Those kids are going to be extincted from sport.

I think cutting that schedule down to 20 games hurts the middle class(and lower)kid the most.

All the kids with means will play plenty of club and travel.

Each sport should have been considered individually for cuts. Across the board stuff is lazy.

Any player in Florida who is serious plays a lot more baseball than what is offered in HS. It will only hurt those who play it for the enjoyment of being part of a team, not necessarily to get a scholarship and there are many who use HS sports for that reason alone, everywhere.

My son played two summers with a 58-68 game schedule back in HS, that's even more than he played in a regular college season (not including post game). Players had chances to raise money if they couldn't afford it.



Perhaps scouts won't be too happy, HS baseball is a good time to finish up with evaluations before the draft.

quote:

Each sport should have been considered individually for cuts. Across the board stuff is lazy.

If it were done that way, what determines which sport should be cut?

Does Fla. charge admission to all their sporting events? Football tends to be the only sport that actually generates any money thru ticket sales. Baseball generates nothing except for maybe the conference and state finals. (at least in our area).
Maybe you cut a freshman or jv team if not enough potential athletes can fill a roster, but all things being equal, if the athletic dept as a whole has to absorb cuts, it's better to chop off a piece from everybody than to try and decides what getsd the axe or a big hit.

The entire process of this vote was one big example of POSTURING.

This saves no significant money and was nothing more than a move to say they tried something.

Not mentioned here is the even larger cuts to the JV programs... in baseball the JV schedule was reduced to 15 games from 25. That really effects your developing players and/or those that may not play travel.

Previously when the BOZOS at FHSAA reduced the games from 30 to 25, they said that was temporary cut as well.

At Districts yesterday I had to listen over and over again in between innings to non stop advertising for the FHSAA sponsors (Dodge, US Marines, Nike, Allstate & Gatorade). All of these sponsors and none of that money goes back to the School Districts to support a 25 or 30 game schedule?

FHSAA represents greed and red tape at its finest!

Many many kids will not play past hs. In fact the vast majority will not. All of them will never get the opportunity to play for their school , home town , community once it ends. Playing in the summer or fall for other teams is not the issue here. Its about someone taking away from what I believe is the best time in a baseball players life and thats the high school baseball experience. It is just not right.

quote:

Does Fla. charge admission to all their sporting events? Football tends to be the only sport that actually generates any money thru ticket sales. Baseball generates nothing except for maybe the conference and state finals. (at least in our area).

Regular season games are five or six bucks. The FHSAA has a price schedule above that for the post-season gate, which they keep 100%.

quote:

Originally posted by Coach May:
Many many kids will not play past hs. In fact the vast majority will not. All of them will never get the opportunity to play for their school , home town , community once it ends. Playing in the summer or fall for other teams is not the issue here. Its about someone taking away from what I believe is the best time in a baseball players life and thats the high school baseball experience. It is just not right.

It's a slippery slope when you cancel 40% of freshman and JV games. You see how easy it would be for them to cancel everything but football and hoops.

quote:

However, nothing can replace playing in font your peers, teachers, friends for you school and so on.

You're right Estone. Now that we are in the midst of Districts (and headed to the championship game tomorrow), we are having a blast. Still looking forward to summer, though.

It won't save any money for us, either. Player fees pay gas, umpires, security, everything for the baseball program. Maybe they'll reduce the coach's stipend by the same percentage? But that's so small I can't imagine that it will make a difference in the state budget.

Football is usually a moneymaker, so I guess that's why they didn't cut it.

In our District in FL every school charges a $5 gate. I have never been to a game where i saw less than enough people to cover Umps, Baseball, lights and likely travel for the next rd game.

Not all HS sports collect fees. Those that do, the money goes into a general fund for each school to be used at the AD's decretion. Football can in some schools cover more than half of the money collected, other schools basketball. I amnot sure if schools get district play off money.
My understanding is that the consideration was cutting some sports such as golf, tennis, wrestling,rugby, hockey etc.

I agree with Coach May, for most, playing sports in HS is as far as many will get. I think that they choose a way that was fair for all.
As I posted above, in case you noticed, the cuts were because of high fuel costs. Some of the bigger counties may have been able to afford them, but generally Florida is a rural state with many counties having only one or two HS, where as the more populated ones may have more than 20.

The alternative may have been to raise county taxes, the sales tax or impose state income tax. Bad idea for now, people can't even afford to remain in their homes, let alone their county taxes, unemployment is horrific and our best resource, tourism, is null.
As far as baseball, again, most serious players here in FL don't depend on just HS ball to get you to the next level.