IVY COLLEGES - ATHLETIC ADMITS

Apply through the coach if you want the best results.

Here's one more piece - the colleges do not all look at the SAT scores the same. Some do not consider the newer 3rd section in their calculations - that could account for BillBill's comment on 1250 SAT - which if divided by 2, would be 625 each.

Here is an interesting book.

http://media.www.dailypennsylv...s.Game-2182574.shtml

http://www.thecrimson.com/article.aspx?ref=214987

http://www.thecrimson.com/article.aspx?ref=94042

http://www.collegeotr.com/coll...t_into_college_11345

There is so much info on athletes getting special treatment at top colleges it boggles the mind.

http://www.ivyleaguesports.com...ission-statement.asp

Ok, let's get real. An athlete's daily college schedule may look like this (at least baseball in fall, and football is probably more time consuming):
7:am-8:am, weight room
8:00-1:00 pm, classes (4 or 5 depending upon quarter or semester system)
1:00pm - 5:00pm, practice
6:00pm -8m some nights - classes/discussion sessions
8:00pm-11:00 or midnight, or later, depending upon work load - homework or study hall.
11:00pm or midnight to 6:30 am - sleep
Oh yeah, don't forget they also need time to eat.

You try working on this kind of schedule (oh yeah, and add in the fact that every time they leave a classroom to go to the next one, they probably walk, ride a bike, or have to jog to make it on time) which would not include the amount of physical or mental stamina it would take to make it through EVERY SINGLE DAY.

Oh, yeah, and you try getting all of your classes to fit this tight little window of time. Now, most kids I know of who are going on as freshman this year to play some sport in college are well above average academically. I know some are not, but the great majority are.

You all know this. So why are you so critical?

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/c...-the-special-admits/

It is a tough schedule but hundreds of college guys do it.
The above link is not Ivy but very interesting.

The importance of this discussion is that BB players with reasonable test scores/GPAs have a chance to go to big name colleges if a coach wants them. You do not need top scores if these are colleges you might be interested in. Many will wrongfully assume they don't have a chance.

quote:

Originally posted by BobbleheadDoll:
The importance of this discussion is that BB players with reasonable test scores/GPAs have a chance to go to big name colleges if a coach wants them. You do not need top scores if these are colleges you might be interested in. Many will wrongfully assume they don't have a chance.

I don't have any issue with the idea of dreaming/applying and hoping to go the "big name colleges if a coach wants them."
The problem is the use of football information from 2001/2002 and to equate it with baseball admits in 2010.
I fully believe that every HS senior should have a reach list of schools. They should have a reach academically. They should reach athletically.
But, they also need to be realistic and have solid back ups in each area.
No one should think that football admits at big name colleges equates to baseball and surely should not rely on what I consider outdated information dating from 2001 to 2004.
BHD, I don't have any problem with these views you are providing. I just don't think the articles are worthwhile. To me, they don't prove the point you are advocating.

The athletic admits/special admits apply to all sports. Football is the most prevalent one. BB seems to be not that important but I have posted links that show it exists big time in all sports and in most big name colleges. The Ivy's even set aside a certain amount for every sport. It was so prevalent that the academic staff challenged it a few years ago. It was the subject of a 2 hour documentary that had several Ivy presidents admit it. It actually showed BB segments as part of the documentary..
Did you read all the links ?

http://www.signonsandiego.com/...99-1s10specials.html

Just in case you are wondering, I think these special considerations are fantastic for those who's goals include big name schools.
That's my view the other was fact.

I think the point that I and many others are trying to make is that you are over-reacting to a documentary that attempted to over-sensationalize this issue to begin with (especially with the Ivies).

Every one knows that all colleges will lower their standards for students that have a special talent of any kind. Some more than others. Common knowledge, we get it.

But the more relevant and valuable information on this subject when pertaining to ivies would be recent, first hand information from now, about baseball only. As compared to 3 year old or 5 year old info that may have been handpicked to support a documentary and includes all sports.

I can tell you for sure that it happens at Service Academies in baseball.

A very wise man, who knows my past well, once told me, that I should get on my knees each and everyday and thank God that life ain't fair...which reminds me.

The several articles I have linked to are not hand pick.
When you have presidents of the Ivys admit it it must be real.
Not sure why you guys keep denying these facts.

I have a poster who pm'd me and thanked me for this info.
My son had graduated and so it is for other posters and not for me.

quote:

Every one knows that all colleges will lower their standards for students that have a special talent of any kind. Some more than others. Common knowledge, we get it.

When you have presidents of the Ivys admit it it must be real.
Not sure why you guys keep denying these facts.

quote:

Originally posted by BobbleheadDoll:
The several articles I have linked to are not hand pick.
When you have presidents of the Ivys admit it it must be real.
Not sure why you guys keep denying these facts.

As I stated in my last post, nobody is denying there are special admits.

It is really quite simple. A Student-athlete must put up the academic stats, then get the proper baseball exposure, then the colleges that can admit you will decide if your talent is up to par. If you are showcasing properly and you have the baseball talent, you will know which schools can admit you. They will be the ones recruiting you.

It is a changing landscape, as the San Diego link suggests, likely in the direction of less special admits or higher standards for special admits. Any information more than a year or two old is becoming obsolete. And guys that are 2011's or 2012's may be up against completely different standards than todays recruits.

quote:

Originally posted by Blprkfrnks:
It is a changing landscape, as the San Diego link suggests, likely in the direction of less special admits or higher standards for special admits.

I seriously doubt the validity of that in sports that are not head count sports. Where baseball players routinely pay 50% of the freight themselves, and in a challenging economic time, commmon sense dictates that there won't be a tightening of academic standards or special admits.

quote:

I seriously doubt the validity of that in sports that are not head count sports. Where baseball players routinely pay 50% of the freight themselves, and in a challenging economic time, commmon sense dictates that there won't be a tightening of academic standards or special admits.

You may be right in terms of specific admits, but I wonder if this economy issue is fully appreciated in baseball.
There is little doubt baseball is being challenged. At least 4 schools dropped baseball altogther. That certainly takes care of some potential special admits.
I read last week that Army cancelled its opening season games at Wake due to the overall conditions in the athletic dep't. CSU Fullerton reportedly, along with a lot of other teams will be bus to nearly all games this year rather than fly for 3-4 series. I think the review said they will fly to one series only, a significant cutback.
I think the point being made is that articles that are 4-5 years old are not relevant to what is happening today and over the next few years.
In contrast to the position you have outlined, which could well be right at some schools, I think I could argue against your point by saying we may see schools drop scholarships if revenue does not increase. Necessarily, that could impact baseball specific admits.
I think the SEC and Big revenue football schools have better protection than most.
Outside of those schools, special admits may be affected if the number of schollies are cut and there is less to go around with a 25% minimum still mandated..

quote:

Originally posted by infielddad:
I think I could argue against your point by saying we may see schools drop scholarships if revenue does not increase. Necessarily, that could impact baseball specific admits.

I understand your point, however there is not direct correlation between special admits and scholarships. The funding for scholarships could decrease while the allowance for special admits go the other direction and increase. My point, was that sports where the students pay 50% or more in costs could very well be attractive to colleges struggling for admissions.

The Army cancellation turned out to be at Title IX issue, as you were correct, there is a lack of funding for womens travel sports. Just as an FYI, sports funding at service academies is 100% private or sports generated revenue. Hence many mens sports are well funded, while womens sports, being fairly young, don't have ex athletes in the over 50 category that is so crucial to fundraising.

How do Ivy League schools compare to the other D1s...are they considered as "mid" or "lower" D1 programs? Like how hard do their recruited pitchers throw on average...

^ From what I've gathered they are typically "lower" D1 programs, but you still have to be pretty good...Probably lots of mid-upper 80s pitchers

Does anyone know where to find an active list of 2010 Ivy commits? I saw on PG's website a few '10s who had already verbally committed.

William and Mary is not an Ivy League school but they probably have a relavant point. Some of the Ivy's seem to have higher standards than the others. I know some would not look at son unless he was in the 1900+ range on the SAT's others wouldn't look at him till he was 2100+. But once they get there, they don't get treated differently in the classroom. Son is working as hard as he can just to keep in step. Big jump up from HS. Good reason everyone wants to hire these kids when they get out. It is hard for anyone to get in to some of the Ivy's even with the athletic ability.

quote:

Originally posted by BobbleheadDoll:
I thought I would post this because of all the mis information about IVY colleges admissions.
They have and still do admit athletes without high Sat's and GPAs.
Goggle the term ATHLETIC ADMITS and you will get some articles on it like William & Mary. They set up a task force in 2005 to get a balance of academic and other students including athletes to obtain a balance in the overall student body.
They reference the well known fact that all the Ivy's do this.

http://www.tribeathletics.com/wmatf.pdf

Son was in the upper 80's lower 90's as a Sr. They get great players that are also very smart and value the education as much as the baseball. One Ivy traditionally gets 2-3 drafted every year. There are many Ivy kids playing in the majors... Chris Young, Chad Olendord, Will Venerable, Mark Delrosa come to mind. (forgive the guess at spellings) If your son has the ability in both areas... be real. His odds are better of getting a great education and contacts at a premier college, but his baseball opportunities do not decrease much, if at all. Good luck!

quote:

Originally posted by Dream1O4:
How do Ivy League schools compare to the other D1s...are they considered as "mid" or "lower" D1 programs? Like how hard do their recruited pitchers throw on average?

Stanford is a great school. Probably higher level athletics than the Ivys. Also probably lower admitance standards than some of the Ivys.
I'm looking at Stanford's academic profile for the class of 2011. Probably a good proxy for the Ivy's. It says that 1% had a high school gpa of between 3.4 and 3.6 and less than 1% had a gpa of less than 3.4 How much lower it doesn't say. 98% of the class was in the top 20% of their high school class, etc. It may be safe to assume that the majority of those that don't meet these minimum standards might be atheletes, but who knows? Maybe one or two of them are great cellists.

I still think it is safe to say that a sports team at any of these ivy or ivy-like institutions would not boast an average gpa of 3.4 and an average sat of 1250.[/QUOTE]

DFWFan, does your son play at an Ivy? Which one?