Ivy recruiting requirements

No doubt Fenway will weigh in, but IMHO he should try the ACT. Some kids (like mine) take to it much better than SAT.  I'd also recommend  getting some tutoring for whatever tests he takes. Good luck.

Fourbases,

Welcome and congrats on your first post.  Enjoy your upcoming OVs. 

There are many paths to get recruited and admitted to high academic schools.  If G'town is telling him he has a home "as is" then I'd say your son is in a good spot no matter what happens with the Ivys.  For the Ivys, it is true a lot of this is going to depend on his baseball talent, SAT/ACT scores, and the other Ivy recruits relative to your son’s metrics.  For example....there may be a recruit with a similar skill set and a similar SAT score.  Who will they pick?  You don’t know.

With regards to the Ivys, the best possible position for a recruit to be in is a high talent recruit who doesn’t need the coaches help with Admissions, and is being recruited by multiple Ivy schools.  That would be a high leverage position.  Everything else below that becomes relative to your specific situation.  On this board I’ve met many Ivy player parents who’s sons have scored anywhere between 1800 and 2350.  If your son is a true D1 talent level, catches the coaches eye, and can boost his SAT score somewhat then I think you’ll have some difficult choices to make between some really good schools.  If he isn’t able to improve his scores then I think your son is going to have to rely on the coaches influence and equity to help him through Ivy Admissions.  Coaches only have so much influence and equity every year.  It may become a leap of faith at some point as the Coaches advocate for him to Admissions.  You’ll want to request a Likely Letter from Admissions (through the Coach) to guarantee his admission.  Even more so, a Likely Letter would appropriate if you’re sure Gtown will give your son scholarship dollars and sign an NLI.

I think he should shoot for 2000 for Brown, Cornell, Columbia, Dartmouth, Penn, and 2100 for Harvard, Princeton, and Yale to seal the deal.  There is a little margin of error in that, but that is what I’ve seen the last couple years.

Good luck and let me know if I can help in any way.

Fenway knows the Ivy recruiting as well as anyone. All of the programs are different and have different processes. My son was right in your son's range with GPA and had a 2150 on his SAT which was good enough to get in with athletic support to all of the Ivy's. He was recruited late by Harvard and I think all of their athletically supported spots were taken and they wanted him to get another 50 pts on his SAT at the last minute, which he did not have time to do.

If a school is very interested in your son you can discuss with them what is required and they will help you though the process and give you feedback on what scores your son will need in advance.

Good Luck.  

Thank you guys.

The information, like always, is very helpful...does anybody know if having an interview with the adm office means anything in the recruiting process at this time, even if my son hasn't applied yet?...also, any suggestions on what to wear to OVs? I have read long pants (khakis) also shorts (nice) and polo type shirts, what do you guys think?...and he likes to wear his bb hat, should he not?

Yes, most Ivys do interviews.  Some have alumni interviews across the world and others can provide an on-campus interview.  This makes sense since he'll be on campus. 

IMHO....I would dress business casual (khakis/polo or button down shirt) for the interview and discussions with the coaching staff, and then change into something more comfortable when around the team.  You can always dress down when appropriate.  There are others on this site that would suggest dressing like Larry the Cable Guy.  I'm not in that camp.

My son has hosted a bunch of OVs for recruits.  He's got a pretty thick skin, but two things annoyed him.  First, recruits that just talk about themselves and how wonderful they are in high school.  Know your audience and know your place.....these are fairly accomplished & smart people that are already playing college baseball.  Second, if you decide to drink don't overdo it. I wouldn't drink at all, but I'm a realist.    BTW.....Everything he says and does this weekend will get back to the Coach.  Coaches will ask the current players about the recruits.   I'm not suggesting your son would be one of these kids, but just giving you a heads up from the current players perspective.

Good luck!

Thanks Fenway.

Funny on the Larry the Cable Guy, but it does happen believe or not.Fortunately, my son likes to look good and clean, on the field and off, but being in FL, kids wear a lot of shorts (nice) to their parties and when going out. I am a proponent of long khakis and polo shirt, and like you mentioned, later change if needed and if time permits, however he asked me if nice khakis shorts (not combat ready!) would be ok. I think that he can dress more sporty on Saturday for viewing practice and then coming back home.

As for a talker, I believe that he is pretty quite and lets his doing be on the field not off talking. Also, a good kid with incredible manners and does not like to hang with bad kids or at bad parties.

He will dress differently on OV depending on what he is doing. For campus tour and meeting with adm then pants collared shirt are appropriate, the rest of the time he will be with players and team so shorts/casual shirt work just fine. He will likely sit in on some classes so dress like a college student.....well like some of them. No hat when with admissions and meeting coaches. with the team then wear one if he wants. 

A humble but confident player is ideal. Ask lots of relevant questions of players on the team, don't be shy they will be more than happy to explain the inner workings of the team and coaches.  

Interviews are great and should be done if possible. Do one at a school that might not be your highest priority first so he has some practice. We also role played with my son and had him ask us questions so he got comfortable with his delivery. He will resist it at first, but thank you afterwards.

Good luck, exciting times!

Fenway - one issue here with the poster that you might not have considered is the Official Visit.  If the player is truly on an Ivy Official Visit then there has been a pre-read of the student by admissions before the funding.  Someone thinks the kid has a shot to get in.  The SAT is low, so the situation is a little puzzling to me.

Understood.  However, recruit could be at the top of several lists (stud) and coaches are trying to go all in towards a committment.  It could be a case of the coach trying to make something happen on the backend and hope the recruit can help his case with improved SATs.  There are many, many scenarios.  It is difficult to know based on the posts.

Thanks lefty.

He is on an official visit to the schools with schedules, etc.

They did say that his transcripts have been taken to admin and came back very favorable, for whatever that could mean. He has taken a lot of AP and Honors courses and his weighted GPA is 4.9 (3.93 unweighted). He also scored as a JR a 6.0 perfect score in the FCAT Writing, which only three student in the previous three years had score in the state of Florida. He even got a letter and certificate from the Governor (of course, the standard type with his name on it). He is a smart kid, but he told me that he could not finish about 20% of the questions. He is very cautious and very precise when attacking any problem. I just hope that all that is going on does not freak him out during the next test, you know how kids can get. He was told that if he scores 1950 he would be in. Gtown even told him that admissions already said to the coach that he would be accepted right now.

One thing that he has going for him is that he is not a bad player and would be an impact player, and according to scouts that he most likely will be drafted, albeit later rounds because of his desire to go to school, his grades, and the schools he wants to play ball.

FourBases, this is a bit off topic but have him take the practice tests for time over and over. Once he does this he will nail the test. (at least that is what my son said was the best prep for him)

FourBases - just my $.02 in that I spend a lot of time on an Ivy campus, and son had a nice non Ivy career with +Ivy academic numbers.  Your son may be such a high quality player that the fit might be better at Northwestern, UVA, Rice, or Wake.  On my Ivy campus I see a lot of kids from those schools turning up for graduate school and they are every bit as smart, or smarter, than the kids with Ivy undergraduate degrees.  Agree with Fenway that the coach may be really reaching for that SAT to get your son to the Ivy index, whereas Northwestern and Rice play some really good baseball, educate kids at least as well as any of the Ivy's, and don't have to deal with the Ivy index.  Someone had to pre-read your son to get the funding, thats good, but that SAT bar may be high at this late date and there are some very good schools in this country.

Four bases. If you want, PM me and we can dialogue about the pro v. Ivy League baseball issue. I was where you were once and presently experiencing life - as a parent - post college.

Worth mentioning again, has he taken the ACT?  The SAT is an odd test.  My son took the PSAT, three practice tests, an SAT prep class, and two official SAT's.  He scored 10 points LOWER on the second real one.  At this late date, it might be worthwhile to take an ACT asap, and if he scores high on that, you're done.  If not, a tutor for either test might help.

Great point, but why not add Vanderbilt and of course Stanford to that list, and what the heck, CAL and UCLA as well.

Of course.  I was just throwing out names to get the OP to start thinking about that option.  That kid has Vandy academic numbers - Does he have Vandy baseball ability?…who knows. But…IMHO its seems D1 academic non Ivy is the way to go, given what we know now about the kids numbers, the draft, and all that.

Unless I'm mis-reading the original post, the kid is a 2015.  The schools you listed are almost certainly done with their 2015 recruiting class. 

Thanks for all suggestions.

He really likes Ivys. Even told the Duke coach that when they were talking to him. His thinking is this...if he continues to get bigger and stronger (even though he squats 405) and keeps polishing his game, he would like to play summer ball at the Cape, if not after freshman year then after sophomore. It is understood that the Ivy level is not the same as SEC or ACC or many of the other conferences, but if you play at Ivy and can play at the Cape and succeed, it is even better because as you know, you are playing with the best and you will be found. This is actually something that his summer ball coach told him, and he is a scout for a MLB team.

As a comparison, the HS where he plays right now is not very good at baseball, well I mean as good as some schools we have here, but last year they were district runner up and lost in the regional playoff against the 2nd ranked HS team in the country at the time, whose pitcher had not lost a game in 25 appearances. My son went two for three against him, stole a base, and score a run...we lost 2-1 in nine innings.

Even our HS not being that bb great, we had not only scouts, but also cross-checker came to see him. So I believe that he should go where he will be happy and if his baseball is good then he can play college summer ball...He just has to get that score higher and hopefully can do that by being able to finish the test. The suggestion from BOF will be helpful, about the practice tests.

The weather may dictate what he wears.  I went to grad school at one of the Ivy's you mentioned for the OVs and the low this weekend will be 43 degrees.

FWIW, keewartson wore his hat to his visits.  He can always take it off during an interview with the admin office or when dining.

FourBases,

A couple thoughts.....

Please let us know how the official visit goes.  Unfortunetly, your son only has 48 hours on campus to get information and a "vibe".  Whoever your son gets matched up with as a host, try to get as much info as possible about your son's major, baseball team, and social life.

I would follow up with goosegg on his offer to help you.  Feel free to PM me as well if you need to get into specific private matters.  Goosegg's son's recruiting path was very different from my son's, and the guy knows his stuff.  Getting many different perspectives and opinions could help you with your effort.    

I agree with 9and7Dad that 2015 athletic recruits are done for top tier academic D1s schools like Vandy, UVA, Duke, and others.  So, that ship has sailed.

Lastly, I think your son should go into this weekend prepared to respond to an Ivy coach who may be offering a slot on the team.  My sense of things is your son may be a recruit the Coach has already convinced Admissions or is going to have to convince Admissions.  Just because a pre-read comes back "thumbs up" or an OV is offered, it is still not a 100% guarantee of an offer or admission to the school.  You've got to go through the Ivy gauntlet one step at a time.  Trust me, I've heard of many "squirrely" stuff that has happened to folks in this process.  So, the Coach may have stuck his neck out a little bit to get your son based on contingencies (ie..retake SAT).  The Coach will most likely want an answer soon.  I'm not saying you should say "yes" or "no" to the offer which may include those contingencies.  I'm saying don't be surprised with an offer and you may want to rehearse a response with your son.  

Good luck.

FourBases - My hope is that you have a backup plan.  The odds of reaching for an extra 150 SAT points on a third try are relatively long and well documented.  It is common for the coach to present that contingency at the OV.  We don't know about your financial situation, but a PG year is something to research should your son come up short (however, it is more common for the PG year to overcome poor grades rather than poor test scores).  Maybe I missed something but I didn't see you present a plan B should the SAT bar be set too high.  Coaches use a lot of leverage when they need a particular player and/or are rebuilding.  But the Ivy index is a hard number.  

A PG year is a great option if that makes sense financially.  My son is doing one right now but it has nothing at all to do with poor grades or with improving them.  With the OP's son's grades as posted, he wouldn't need to improve grades but it would give him another year to go through the recruiting cycle if some doors have closed for this year as it is so late in the process.  I would tend to agree with you Lefty, 150 points is a lot to put on unless there has been some tutoring, etc.

I want to echo leftyshortstop on having a backup plan.  

My son was never recruited by an Ivy, but was recruited by, and and is at, a high academic D1 that is considered one of the "public ivys" and had a pre-read very early in the process.  This past summer, I noticed on the PG website that a player was added to his recruiting class sometime after the OV last fall (all the recruits and parents had come as a group for the OV one weekend).  Well, this player wound up at another D1 due to lower than acceptable SAT scores (so the players have heard).  

Moral:  this family most likely had a backup plan and the player landed on his feet (at a less academic school), so you want to keep communication open and not burn any bridges with other schools.   It may be a scramble at the last hour (thus the suggestion of a PG year or possibly JUCO).

Good luck this weekend!

Echo JCG and others , my son took the SAT twice mid 1800's both times. He took the ACT once and equivalent was 200 pts higher.In fact both of my kids scored 200pts higher on ACT. Yes, get a back up plan, but take the ACT as well.Good luck