MIT and baseball

Heard the same thing regarding Caltech...  I think there's a member on here whose kid was accepted at Caltech - hopefully he'll chime in....

2019 was accepted at Caltech and will be a Frosh this coming Fall. He was recruited at Caltech and talked with Coach Carroll at MIT in Summer Headfirst (CA) and Brown camp. Coming off injury/surgery his velo wasn't there for MIT to have serious interest, but Caltech was interested and kept in touch through last Fall. What I know is that both schools offer Early Action - so no commitment needed on the student's part until May 1st. Having said that, I can tell you that the 1st conversation with coaches at both schools started with him telling them about his SAT's, GPA and courseload. Once established that he could get in on pure academics, they moved into a baseball conversation. Both said they don't do a pre-read, but since it's Early Action, not Early Decision, you can apply to both and wait it out to see how it all shakes out. 

My son applied to both EA, and was deferred at MIT and accepted EA at Caltech. If he got into MIT and decided to go there, he was planning to walk-on. He didn't end up getting into MIT, but by then had pretty much decided he wanted Caltech anyway. Caltech coach advocated for him both with Admissions and with Financial Aid office. While there's no recruited athlete "discount" at Caltech, they are looking to improve all sports and of course are looking for a well rounded student body. He didn't have all the extracurriculars many others at that level had because of baseball training/playing, so I believe being able to play made a difference in him getting accepted.

Good luck to your son Chico!

Congrats to your son 2019&21 -- getting into Caltech takes serious talent.  

Your message is very helpful, but one thing I'm not sure I follow:  Unless the application deadline for EA at MIT and Caltech is super early, how could an applicant apply ED and EA?  You could submit both applications; but since ED is binding, the only way to take advantage of EA would be if the ED school turned you down, right?  

I'd love to have my son consider MIT.  (We're on the east coast, so Caltech probably isn't an option.)  But I don't know how I could advise him to turn down an almost-guaranteed ED spot at a different, also very good school in order to take his chances at MIT.  Am I missing something?

2019&21 Dad posted:

2019 was accepted at Caltech and will be a Frosh this coming Fall. He was recruited at Caltech and talked with Coach Carroll at MIT in Summer Headfirst (CA) and Brown camp. Coming off injury/surgery his velo wasn't there for MIT to have serious interest, but Caltech was interested and kept in touch through last Fall. What I know is that both schools offer Early Action - so no commitment needed on the student's part until May 1st. Having said that, I can tell you that the 1st conversation with coaches at both schools started with him telling them about his SAT's, GPA and courseload. Once established that he could get in on pure academics, they moved into a baseball conversation. Both said they don't do a pre-read, but since it's Early Action, not Early Decision, you can apply to both and wait it out to see how it all shakes out. 

My son applied to both EA, and was deferred at MIT and accepted EA at Caltech. If he got into MIT and decided to go there, he was planning to walk-on. He didn't end up getting into MIT, but by then had pretty much decided he wanted Caltech anyway. Caltech coach advocated for him both with Admissions and with Financial Aid office. While there's no recruited athlete "discount" at Caltech, they are looking to improve all sports and of course are looking for a well rounded student body. He didn't have all the extracurriculars many others at that level had because of baseball training/playing, so I believe being able to play made a difference in him getting accepted.

Good luck to your son Chico!

Was hoping you’d jump in!  Solid info

2019&21 Dad, was your 2019 son a pitcher? If so, can you give any advice on what FB velocities the Caltech coach wants to see vs the MIT coach (assuming control is good and kid has good secondary/offspeed).

Also, did either Caltech or MIT coach explicitly say what SAT/ACT scores and GPA they expect for a baseball candidate? I assume they want 800/36 math score or very close to it, but what about the verbal scores? Thanks!

Chico Escuela posted:

Congrats to your son 2019&21 -- getting into Caltech takes serious talent.  

Your message is very helpful, but one thing I'm not sure I follow:  Unless the application deadline for EA at MIT and Caltech is super early, how could an applicant apply ED and EA?  You could submit both applications; but since ED is binding, the only way to take advantage of EA would be if the ED school turned you down, right?  

I'd love to have my son consider MIT.  (We're on the east coast, so Caltech probably isn't an option.)  But I don't know how I could advise him to turn down an almost-guaranteed ED spot at a different, also very good school in order to take his chances at MIT.  Am I missing something?

It can be confusing I know. The thing to know is that there is no ED at either Caltech or MIT, only EA. The difference being that EA is much more flexible - no commitment to attend if accepted, and you are allowed to apply to any other school you want. So you have until May 1st to decide if you are accepted EA at either one. EA decisions come out in mid-December for both. That said, you are right, if you apply ED to another school then you would not be able to apply EA to other schools. Those 2 were my son's top choices, so he was comfortable with that approach. 

In 2009ish, at the MIT HC invite, we visited MIT. (HC eventually moved to Stephens Tech - a great D3 school for those looking at financial areas.)

First, the entire family loved MIT.

Second, the players didn't get any admissions boost. Coach submits his "list" but it's just informative to admissions. 

Third, S said the players were calculating parabolas on HR balls - during the game. Smart guys all!

Fourth, our issues were just like normal families: "can you get me in if I match the middle of the incoming class." We were explicitly told "no, there are no guarantees express or implied." Some of the horror stories were about recruits who turned down big time D1 offers (e.g., Arizona), only to be rejected. After really pressing, I became convinced that there was no way to manipulate MITs admission system.

So, while S loved the coach, school, baseball players and area, the uncertainty made us pass.

My experience is dated, but haven't learned any new facts since 2009ish.

Zoom 2020 posted:

2019&21 Dad, was your 2019 son a pitcher? If so, can you give any advice on what FB velocities the Caltech coach wants to see vs the MIT coach (assuming control is good and kid has good secondary/offspeed).

Also, did either Caltech or MIT coach explicitly say what SAT/ACT scores and GPA they expect for a baseball candidate? I assume they want 800/36 math score or very close to it, but what about the verbal scores? Thanks!

Yes, my son was/is a pitcher. I don't know specifically what velocity each might have as a "floor", but I do know it's lower at Caltech since it's a much smaller school and they are not quite as choosy as MIT with that smaller recruitment pool. Neither school said what academic scores they'd expect - it would be the same scores as for the non-athlete candidate. They put just as much emphasis on verbal as math. Son didn't take the ACT and only took the SAT once and scored near 1600, I wouldn't expect to get into either one with an SAT below 1500 - probably should be 1540 or above. As for grades, GPA should be 4.0 or very close and transcript should show a record of very challenging AP coursework. Caltech was also interested in him showing any STEM interest/work outside school. He did some Physics research with a professor at a local state school, which was noted as a point of interest by Admissions. 

Our experience was similar to 2019/21's, as far as info is concerned.  Both coaches interested in my 2019, but a B+ in Alg2/Trig honors cooled off MIT and and a 650 in Physics SAT 2, cooled off Cal Tech. The 33 ACT was fine, according to the coaches, but MIT needed at least an A- and Cal Tech wanted a 700+.  These were both after exchanges with the coaches.  Not sure it ever got to a typical pre-read stage with admissions.  From what others have written that stage doesn't seem to exist.   It sounds like my guy was dinged early by the coaches because of scores/grades that were clearly shortfalls. 

Congrats on the Cal Tech admit!

smokeminside posted:

Our experience was similar to 2019/21's, as far as info is concerned.  Both coaches interested in my 2019, but a B+ in Alg2/Trig honors cooled off MIT and and a 650 in Physics SAT 2, cooled off Cal Tech. The 33 ACT was fine, but MIT needed at least an A- and Cal Tech wanted a 700+.  These were both pre-read situations, so I'm not sure if that matches others' experiences.

Forgot about the subject tests. Both schools require a Math and a Science SAT subject test. Son's were both 800, and from what I've seen and heard, most kids accepted are right around there. 

Thanks, regarding FB Velus, does 81-83 for Caltech and 84-86 mph for MIT seem like reasonable floors? Obviously, the higher the better for either.

Smoke, was your son’s B+ in his Junior year, meaning he didn’t have an A in Calculus to offset that? Seems kinda harsh to rule out a kid with one B+ if higher level math courses were A’s and he had stellar standardized test and subject test scores in math and science.

Zoom 2020 posted:

Thanks, regarding FB Velus, does 81-83 for Caltech and 84-86 mph for MIT seem like reasonable floors? Obviously, the higher the better for either.

Having seen both play  I would say maybe a bit lower on both as a floor. The big difference is that MIT has quite a few good arms.  Caltech has  good arms at the top, but gets thin in a hurry after that.

BTW if you have a second and want to look at a roster that is not filled with kinesiology majors (not that there is anything wrong with that) take a look at the Caltech roster sometime.  Along with the usual items, each player has a "research and STEM" section, listing all kinds of amazing things.

Players were calculating parabolas on HR balls - during the game. Smart guys all!

MIT athletes can also be normal, well adjusted crazy kids. I was chatting with some MIT parents at their regional this year. One had a video of some players at the mall riding these ...

(not actual video) https://youtu.be/qVGltDIQ3gk

Man, those girls must be savants. So young and in MIT already!

Zoom 2020 posted:

Smoke, was your son’s B+ in his Junior year, meaning he didn’t have an A in Calculus to offset that? Seems kinda harsh to rule out a kid with one B+ if higher level math courses were A’s and he had stellar standardized test and subject test scores in math and science.

Yes it was second semester jr. year, after an A first semester.  I actually think it was just an ez way for them to say no quickly. He bit off more than he could chew Jr. Year, taking both AP Physics 1 and 2.  Spent all his time trying to nail that and his math grade suffered.  Ended up getting As in AP Calc.  But  he will admit the other kids at his school that are going to MIT are stronger students than he is.  He tried to get in their study groups and partner with them in labs because he knew he'd learn more.  His native intelligence might not have been where they needed it to be but at least he was street smart enough to tag along with kids who he could learn from!

It is a big risk, but one my son would take again if he had to do it over again.  Going into his senior year, I cannot imagine a better situation for him academically and athletically.  

Congrats to your son 2019&21 -- getting into Caltech takes serious talent.  

Your message is very helpful, but one thing I'm not sure I follow:  Unless the application deadline for EA at MIT and Caltech is super early, how could an applicant apply ED and EA?  You could submit both applications; but since ED is binding, the only way to take advantage of EA would be if the ED school turned you down, right?  

I'd love to have my son consider MIT.  (We're on the east coast, so Caltech probably isn't an option.)  But I don't know how I could advise him to turn down an almost-guaranteed ED spot at a different, also very good school in order to take his chances at MIT.  Am I missing something?

*****

I know a 2019 in another "sport" (sailing) without strong coach pull who applied ED Brown and EA MIT. All admissions are a gamble at schools of this level and "almost-guaranteed" is still not 100%. The family chose to go with the two applications, both with "support" from the coach. The kid ended up getting into both and had to turn down MIT because Brown was binding. I don't think the MIT coach was very happy...but college acceptances at that level are hard to come by and the family chose not to put all their eggs in one basket.

It's a really tough call...