MLB Draft Combine

I know for the high school players invited it will be more extensive. They are going to keep the HS kids around afterwards and play actual games. From what I understand, it is going to be a pro style workout. BP and position work for position players and bullpens for pitchers. They will also do athletic testing. I imagine it will be the similar stuff they do at the PDP (30 yard run, broad jump, vertical jumps, force plate testing, etc). There is also going to be opportunities for the players to meet with team GM's, scouting directors, etc.

Does your son have an advisor? If so, he could probably help with the decision wither to go or not.

Thank you for that information.  He does have an advisor, and interestingly he is in the "no" camp.  At least this is what our son is telling is.  We obviously need to have some family conversations with our son and the advisor about this to get  some more insight. Our son has had lots of meetings in the fall with scouts, but as things are are getting closer my thought is more of those certainly couldn't hurt, especially with higher-ups. Like with all things I'm sure there are pros and cons, just trying to get as much information as we can.  I can't imagine it hurts you not to go, or does it? These are the things to find out.  The roster from last year is public, and there is a mix of positions, HS and college, ranked and unranked kids.  Not that I'm putting stock into rankings per se, just an observation of past attendees.

I have to imagine every situation is different. I am guessing that with college guys, they probably have a body of work against high level talent where it is not as important to go. Where the high school guys are out to show their skill level is up to par with other prospects.

Good luck in whatever you guys decide. Sounds like you have some exciting times ahead.

I would listen to your son's advisor.

Before the combine when keewartson was drafted, he was invited to a "workout" at  XXMLB team.  I almost had the flights booked, when keewartson said his advisor recommended not to go.  I couldn't understand.

His reasoning:  If he went, he would have to go to all of them, or it could show some sort of favoritism toward the the team (and we couldn't have that, now, could we?! )  He had already turned down another team's invite to a workout.   Maybe the combine avoids this.

Will all the teams be there?  Did he play at a school (or against schools) with lots of exposure?   Is "meeting with a lot of scouts"   7 or 30 teams? 

I never talked to son's advisor before the draft.  But I would have your son get an explanation to why he suggests not to go.

https://community.hsbaseballwe...37#75784881019029237

Thank you for your input...all excellent points and things to find out. Maybe we won't be talking to the advisor, good point, I'm not sure.  But absolutely  our son needs to speak more specifics with his advisor on what the decision is.  I guess it's ultimately their decision, we are new to all of this.  

As far as your questions, it is my understanding all the teams are there in Phoenix for this, but I could be wrong.  He plays in the ACC, so for and against good competition for sure!  As far as the team/scout meetings, they were in the fall and I believe he met with most of the teams, except a few.  

Obviously still have lots of in-season baseball to play and God willing some playoff baseball!  That is our focus.  Certainly can't and won't get ahead of ourselves.  Since the invite came this week, just trying to get some information from anyone that had an experience with this event.

I used to work PDP events as a "scout". I would run all of the players through all of the testing and measurements. Most, if not all, of these players were still in high school. The PDP is almost always high school players who are draft eligible and are potential high draft picks. I would look into getting in to the cape or somewhere with a really good summer league if that is what the advisor is suggesting, especially if your son is not going to be a top 10 round draft pick. Only problem with not going if he is drafted is he loses his leverage. Not to mention MLB teams will pay for your son to finish college at any college of his choice as long as the tuition is not over what it is at his current school and does it within 5 years after his baseball career is over.

Thank you so much for your input! I copied a pretty good explanation of what it sounds like the Combine entails. (really more for myself)

Looks like last year there were 250 guys, half college and half high school.

https://www.mlb.com/news/mlb-d...ine-2023-chase-field

@Coaches Box posted:

Not to mention MLB teams will pay for your son to finish college at any college of his choice as long as the tuition is not over what it is at his current school and does it within 5 years after his baseball career is over.

When did they start allowing players to return to any college for their degree and now allow 5 years after they leave professional ball?

Don't teams award MLB scholarship dollars based on  current school tuition. A player would lose too many credits in the transfer.

A lot of the P5's and others have programs that pay for the player to return to THEIR school to finish their degree. This includes a certain amount of credits plus a stipend for living expenses.

I suggest that the player rely on advice from his advisor. He is the one that would negotiate.

@TPM posted:

When did they start allowing players to return to any college for their degree and now allow 5 years after they leave professional ball?

Don't teams award MLB scholarship dollars based on  current school tuition. A player would lose too many credits in the transfer.

A lot of the P5's and others have programs that pay for the player to return to THEIR school to finish their degree. This includes a certain amount of credits plus a stipend for living expenses.

I suggest that the player rely on advice from his advisor. He is the one that would negotiate.

I have spoken with several draft guys that had to retire or were released and were drafted before they finished college.

They do allow you to go back to any college of your choice as long as it is not more tuition that where you were enrolled at the time of being drafted. If you have not enrolled in a school within 5 years of leaving professional baseball you won't have the ability to receive that tuition due to it expiring.

I haven't officially looked into it...just word of mouth from guys that have experienced it.

@Coaches Box

My son was drafted as a Junior. His ML scholarship was for 1 year at the current tuition year that he was drafted. His advisor told him that it would be in his best interest to return to his ACC school for his degree. He was advised he would lose too many credits transfering. Also of importance to note, his major wasn't offered anymore.

He had 3 years to attend after he left ML baseball. Thats why I am asking you when it changed to 5 years?  If you heard word of mouth, be careful of where you get info.

As an FYI, tuition more than doubled in the time since he left. His school, as do many schools, now provide  assistance to all returning athletes. Best part he didn't have to dip into his savings.

@Coaches Box

@TPM

....and anyone else interested....   https://www.mlb.com/official-i...ip/player-guide-2017

Keewartson was under the most recent Continuing Education Program, which is negotiated and signed at time of contract signing.

Son completed his degree while still playing milb (thanks Covid) so he utilized the program.  Many (most) do not.

Some thoughts:

1)  We paid for the tuition up front and son was reimbursed after submitting a passing grade, per his team rules.  Better have that 4th year tuition money still available upfront.  And like TPM mentioned, costs rise every year, while the CEP amounts stay the same.

2)  His contract stated that he would have 10 years to complete the degree, from (about) the date of the contract (not from when you leave playing ball).  (my thoughts:  if you still playing after 10 years, you are in the MLB so you can pay for college yourself lol)

3)  The tuition and living allowances are considered taxable income to your son.  I did son's taxes so we/he paid quarterly estimated taxes those years he was in school and seeking reimbursement.  (Since we (his parents) were paying for his college education, we absorbed his tax liability.)

4)  The CEP tuition and living allowances listed on this contract were based off of the current year at the time of the draft and at the current school, but does not list a specific college, so I guess you could go to any college to finish.  But like TPM mentioned, you could loose credits if you transferred for one year.  I do know of a player that signed out of high school instead of playing at  UVA (almost unheard of), and when his career was over he was choosing from several Ivy League programs.  One poster on this site son negotiated a year of graduate school.

5)  Keewartson's CEP contract lists a total for tuition and separate total for living expenses.  I understand now that some contracts could list the amounts by semester.  This would have really hurt us because son lived on campus one semester, which was more than half of the total available to him due to the increased cost of college.  To finish up his degree,  he took online classes.

6) Again, if you are a junior out of college getting drafted, don't look at this CEP as all free money (unless you are one of the few states that doesn't tax income).  For some, the 4th year baseball scholarship from the college is the better monetary deal to complete your education.  And again, as TMP mentioned, some larger schools have their own funds to pay for players to come back and finish their degree.  @FL2023 your son's ACC school may have this.  Keewartson's school did not.

Thank you keewart! Dave had 3 years, I am assuming it changed at one point. There was NO doubt he was going back to finish at Clemson. One of the best decision made!

I will definetly read your post later, have to run out before it rains again!

So the combine was new my son's draft year. Per his advisor, he did not go. May or may not have hurt him, who knows. It is definitely something the MLB is pushing more and more. They are trying to create buzz a la NBA/NFL combines but I think it is as much/more about media/visibility as it is about really giving the teams data they did not previously have. Unless your son has something to overcome/an improved tool to showcase, I think his advisor is saying it's not worth the risk of a bad showing/the cost etc.

@PTWood posted:

So the combine was new my son's draft year. Per his advisor, he did not go. May or may not have hurt him, who knows. It is definitely something the MLB is pushing more and more. They are trying to create buzz a la NBA/NFL combines but I think it is as much/more about media/visibility as it is about really giving the teams data they did not previously have. Unless your son has something to overcome/an improved tool to showcase, I think his advisor is saying it's not worth the risk of a bad showing/the cost etc.

If USA Baseball is involved in it, which it is, then media/visibility is definitely a top of the list reason for it.

@PTWood, thank you so much for the input on your experience with this.  Certainly makes sense!

@keewart, thank you for all the information on the continuing education piece.  Very valuable!  I think the biggest concern with completing a degree somewhere other than the original school is the whole transfer credit thing.  I know players on my son's team that have come in and left and all the credits transferring has definitely been an issue.

If my son were to not come back after this year, he has set himself up to not have but a semester left, between coming in with credits, thus starting ahead and continuing to stay ahead.  I also think my son's school, and I'm sure others, has a rule that only so many credits (and sometimes  its the last credits) can be completed at a different institution or even online.

If the time comes, lots to consider....

I think it's all been said - If your son Trusts his advisor, go with his advice. Also, as said earlier your son's advisor/agent can negotiate the funds for return to school at signing. It's my understanding teams will be pretty flexible with what they offer, because so few actually go back to school. My son was reimbursed for off-season classes, but is far from finishing his 4th year.

I know that some will take classes at their former schools during off season and use the living expense grant while they use the facilities to train for free at their old school. Win-win...

@FL2023 -  Good luck to your son this season and in the coming draft, it's an amazing achievement to be considered. The only advice I can offer is to be a sounding board for your son, give your opinion if asked and respect his choices. IMO the last thing any parents should want is to be associated with pushing a career choice/outcome for their kids. I had lots of suggestions in the process, my son pretty much went the opposite way I thought, and I'm so glad he did - it worked out and he owns his path.

@PTWood posted:

So the combine was new my son's draft year. Per his advisor, he did not go. May or may not have hurt him, who knows. It is definitely something the MLB is pushing more and more. They are trying to create buzz a la NBA/NFL combines but I think it is as much/more about media/visibility as it is about really giving the teams data they did not previously have. Unless your son has something to overcome/an improved tool to showcase, I think his advisor is saying it's not worth the risk of a bad showing/the cost etc.

Did your son do the individual team workouts before the draft?

@FL2023 posted:

@ARCEKU21, So our son's HS draft year would have been 2020, the year the world and baseball went to crap. LOL.  He was coming off a very strong junior year, leading his team to a state championship, followed by a very strong fall Jupiter showing.  In any event there was certainly draft chatter and teams to the house, but our son was also pretty vocal about honoring his college commitment.  He's a bright kid and was going to a strong academic program, which sends a message for sure as far as MLB interest.  Who knows what would have happened with a non-canceled senior high school season and a full draft that year, but college (and college baseball for that matter) is the best decision he ever could have made.  And those are his words not ours, although we do agree

Did he get drafted? Went to college? What was the outcome?

Oops sorry if that wasn't clear...He is in college, Was not drafted in the 5 round 2020 draft!

@ARCEKU21 Yes. He did individual and not group. His advisor was involved in which ones depending on who was going to be present

@FL2023

Your son needs to listen to his advisor.  Your son is an adult, but there is no reason why you cannot speak with whoever is advising your son.

Everyone's journey is different but I do know that many advisors do not recommend the event for college players, especially pitchers.

Your son should have had scout day last fall. This usually includes most of the scouts within the programs region and should have been in the stands when he pitches along with the crosschecker if their interest is serious.

Curious if your son was ever asked to upload medical records in the draft portal. . . and if he did it.  Do you think it makes any difference?  Or can you refuse to upload?  Just interested in how impactful those are. . .

@RHP_Parent posted:

Curious if your son was ever asked to upload medical records in the draft portal. . . and if he did it.  Do you think it makes any difference?  Or can you refuse to upload?  Just interested in how impactful those are. . .

Very standard. I think it's a bit of a flag if you don't, but not sure.  

@RHP_Parent posted:

Curious if your son was ever asked to upload medical records in the draft portal. . . and if he did it.  Do you think it makes any difference?  Or can you refuse to upload?  Just interested in how impactful those are. . .

My son was asked to do this. Knowing what the prognosis was on his ailment, his advisor said nothing to worry about. He told us there was no obligation to do so. But we went ahead and did it to be transparent. A couple of quick questions from the scouts came out of it and nothing has been said of it since.

We did not upload but provided when teams specifically asked.

Son got the invite to the combine. Mostly as a LHP, but a few of the teams have asked him to hit while he is there. So his advisor told him bullpens only, no pitching in games for the HS kids. But okay to play OF and hit in the game.

My Son was also a 2020 kid- nothing big coming out of HS so he took the JUCO route, (best decision EVER). Here we are 3 yrs later (blink of an eye fast) and he just finished up his JUCO career playing the best ball he's ever played. Committed to a D1 school now for next yr. He's now been contacted by several pro teams each asking his number to forego school next yr. My son is wanting to take any number offered him, his "advisor" who we just found out about, about a week ago and who absolutely impressed me with his professionalism is advising that we need to convince our son to go back to school to get 1 yr of D1 under him and put numbers close to what he did in JUCO to up his stock.  All this is hard to fathom for us, as this was a kid who was overlooked coming out of HS because he was told he was to small -- poor grades and was tagged as  "lazy" in weight room.  Since HS he's grown another inch &1/2 & has gotten in the weight room religiously putting on about 20lbs of good weight, went from running a 6.8/60 to a 6.37/60 and more importantly his GPA is now a 3.88.  Needless to say we are now huge JUCO advocates and excited for his future and to see what it holds for him.

@Atlwins posted:

My Son was also a 2020 kid- nothing big coming out of HS so he took the JUCO route, (best decision EVER). Here we are 3 yrs later (blink of an eye fast) and he just finished up his JUCO career playing the best ball he's ever played. Committed to a D1 school now for next yr. He's now been contacted by several pro teams each asking his number to forego school next yr. My son is wanting to take any number offered him, his "advisor" who we just found out about, about a week ago and who absolutely impressed me with his professionalism is advising that we need to convince our son to go back to school to get 1 yr of D1 under him and put numbers close to what he did in JUCO to up his stock.  All this is hard to fathom for us, as this was a kid who was overlooked coming out of HS because he was told he was to small -- poor grades and was tagged as  "lazy" in weight room.  Since HS he's grown another inch &1/2 & has gotten in the weight room religiously putting on about 20lbs of good weight, went from running a 6.8/60 to a 6.37/60 and more importantly his GPA is now a 3.88.  Needless to say we are now huge JUCO advocates and excited for his future and to see what it holds for him.

My son has a similar JuCo story, not recruited out of HS, drafted after two years of JuCo and chose a year at Arkansas instead of pro ball. A year of outstanding performance at P5 D1moved him from the 18th round to the 3'rd round. It can happen, but I have no idea how typical that path is...

It has to be the mindset of every drafted player that they will make it to the MLB, but the fact is the larger the signing bonus the better chance they have. Out of college it takes an average of 4 years in the minors for the ones that make it to the MLB. Optimally the signing bonus needs to be enough that the drafting organization will be invested in the ballplayers success and be able to supplement the 4+ years of low income minor league earnings (after taxes and agents fees figure on about 50% of the signing bonus).

Boston's pitch for the $160K signing bonus he turned down to go to Arkansas was that he'd get to the MLB a year earlier and his earnings would be greater than any increase in signing bonus he might get by waiting. I thought the logic was sound, but my son didn't think the bonus was a big enough investment by the team to help him reach his dream. In hindsight, he was absolutely right to choose Arkansas but that's not to say that choice would be right for everyone.

From a parents viewpoint, I'm really glad he chose his own path because I'm not associated with his successes or failures - he owns his entire story and I wouldn't want it any other way.

Congrats on your sons opportunity play beyond college, it's amazing achievement.

Has anyone had a son that got injured during their expected draft year? Trying to weigh the pros/cons of rehab and going back to school to improve draft position, vs taking a lower level deal and rehabbing with a pro team. My son has two years of eligibility left. He was invited to the combine and his advisor is encouraging him to attend.

I'm not a big fan of the common logic that says "well you never know what may happen next year. If they want him this year, take the deal even if it's not what you anticipated." But maybe I need a reality check.

I guess the question is always this: where will he improve the most?  Does his college have the facilities for him to do the rehab?  Will they help him?  The worst case is one in which he will be cut or end up with very limited playing time on his college team because of his injury.  Do you have a good sense of what will happen there?

No personal experience, but my observation is that MLB teams seem to have a lot more patience for higher draft picks to develop than they do for lower picks. As an extreme example there's Mark Appel who was still getting a look 10 years after being drafted. While on the other extreme, every year there are guys drafted late who never get past the complex league and are out of pro ball in a year. Of course better players tend to be drafted higher so that's what you'd expect, but there are very few Mike Piazzas getting drafted late and making the show.

Please consider taking a Pre-Law class. Critical in dealing with advisors, pro teams, sponsors.
Bob

What round is he projected to be drafted? Will he receive slot money? Is it enough money to be worth signing? How much will remaining in college improve his draft position if he gets healthy? How will remaining in college harm his draft position if his health doesn’t improve by next years draft?

I'd look at it this way. Figure 5 years to get to the MLB, He will need at least $20K per year after taxes above and beyond the pay in the minors to train and eat properly (and likely some help from you). $20K times 5 is $100K, so he'll need a signing bonus of $200K pre taxes and agent fees to make that happen.  

If he doesn't get to the MLB, and his signing bonus was $200K he will have no savings but he can utilize the MLB college reimbursement program. Going back to school later is not always easy, especially if he's got a significant other by then (often happens). If the current projection is less than $200K then it might be a better to stay in school, check off another year towards a diploma and try to increase his draft stock.

My son at that age was not into academics, and I was in favor of his taking his first offer after his first year at JuCo. He wasn't and next year he was worth $130K more. He turned that down too and in the 3rd year he was worth $670K more. He made the MLB in his 5th year through rule 5, so he was very fortunate. It's beyond cool to get drafted, but if his draft stock is not going up by playing more in school, what are the odds he will be more successful in minors?

There's no right or wrong answer when you're talking about your kids dreams. I would only say help him be as informed as possible and let him own the decision.

It's hard to be specific and keep anonymity, but if I could use an analogy, the difference in draft slot would be similar to getting an A+ in a class vs a nice solid B. My son has worked for the A+, so he feels very deflated after all the years of hard work to get to this point.

He's very young so age is not an issue. And he has two years of eligibility left so that's not a factor. His coach would love to have him back and he's in a position where he could advocate for the type of role he wants.

He just doesn't feel ready to make the switch to pro. He also doesn't feel like he's gotten closure on college. He never got it on high school because he was a 2020 Covid kid who lost his senior season.

We are paying for private rehab and not counting on the school for that. If he rehabs at the pro level, it could be lonely but it would be very high quality.

@2020two-way-parent posted:

It's hard to be specific and keep anonymity, but if I could use an analogy, the difference in draft slot would be similar to getting an A+ in a class vs a nice solid B. My son has worked for the A+, so he feels very deflated after all the years of hard work to get to this point.

He's very young so age is not an issue. And he has two years of eligibility left so that's not a factor. His coach would love to have him back and he's in a position where he could advocate for the type of role he wants.

He just doesn't feel ready to make the switch to pro. He also doesn't feel like he's gotten closure on college. He never got it on high school because he was a 2020 Covid kid who lost his senior season.

We are paying for private rehab and not counting on the school for that. If he rehabs at the pro level, it could be lonely but it would be very high quality.

Using your analogy, getting started with a solid B, utilizing pro facilities and tech for rehabilitation might not be a bad idea. Especially if a solid B is enough of an investment that the team will give him every opportunity to succeed.

In hindsight for my son, I'm so glad he made the choices. I wouldn't have wanted to push a choice that didn't work out.  

I think you answered your own question.

"He just doesn't feel ready to make the switch to pro."

Like anything in life - if you are not 100% commited, success becomes that much more difficult - both physically and mentally.