NCAA changes rules for dates for first games for 2007

Pushing back the school season will effect the draft, unless they cut games, like some school presidents want.

This is very interesting. These new provisions will make some dramatic changes in the way most schools schedule practices and games. The way I read the article, though, it would appear it won't affect games until spring 2008 -- the provisions go into affect August 1, 2007.

lhp,

After rereading I caught the Aug of 2007 effective date which means the season of 2008. Good catch.

acually, the first games can't start until the last Friday in Feb...and the season will drop from 56 to 52 games starting in spring '08. Only 132 days in the total season. 52 games can be done without any hassles. Teams already play 4 games a week...times 13 weeks that is an opportunity for the 52 games, so I think the teams can handle that, no problem.

They will finish with a week left in May, and have the conf tournament right on the old schedule and be ready for Regional play the 1st week of June...no change except 4 less games or 1 week of play...GREAT CHANGE....

Unless of course, you are a warm weather coach who builds their win record on cold weather teams that are playing their 1st games continually travelling to the HOME fields of the warm weather schools the entire month of Feb and half of March.

It will even the field and allow the cold teams to play more home games and also save a ton of $$ not having to travel as much and build more revenue from their own home games. Classes will change for the better, with less road time away from classes.

The draft will not be affected at all, cutting 4 games is no big deal, and most schools already house and feed their players in May and the sucessful ones into June.

I think the NCAA and the commision finally did something right.

unless they can legislate sunshine, and support for northern schools, the changes will do very little to equalize anything

hey, the conference schedule remains the same - what they've done is eliminate 2 or 3 weeks
of "warmer" non-conference opportunities for northern schools -

fact is, it's easier for ANY school to schedule non-conference games against others in their area/region. Fan support & gate are always better too - -
SO, who will get squeezed out of early warm opportunities? yep, far away northern teams

tell me about fair in a few yrs when Michigan's spring trip is to Kent State on March 1

sure - some well supported/strong northern baseball schools like OSU will still go south -
but there WILL BE FEWER OPPORTUNITIES for them & others! it's simple math

oh - - did I mention that there will have to be MORE mid-week games? - - no big deal, eh?

oops, the athletes are also "STUDENTS" - - soo, MORE missed classes


who thunk this one out??

oh yea, it was OSU's Todd - I feel better already

The report I read said that the reduction in number of games had not passed. The university presidents have left it open for further consideration. To the best of my knowledge, the regular season still stands at 56 games.

All the NCAA has done is show they are hipocritical, at best. They deny the D1 football playoffs, due to the addtional classes that an athlete would miss. Now, they shrink the schedule, which will lead to more mid-week games, and more missed classes.

Now to make it fair, lets move back the football season, so we can even the playing field. It's unfair that southern schools must play football in 95-deg/100% humidity weather.

The southern schools will always have an edge, due to the pre-college kids ability to play nearly year 'round.

Well, if it made sense, it wouldn't be the NCAA.

Be good,
David

Opinions.

Do Northern teams schedule games down south, west solely for the weather, or to improve their SOS or RPI? The coaches and schools determine the schedules, not the NCAA, correct?

Don't coaches want their teams to face better competition before their conference games? And if they choose a winning school, win or lose, their RPI increases when those teams win. To improve your program, you need to improve upon your competition. Is it all about the weather?

Why are so many conferences becoming out of geographic line? Who determines why schools who are not located within geographic areas to join conferences where there is long travel involved, ex. Boston joining the ACC? It's not just Boston, but affects all teh schools and every sport. The school administrators decide this correct? They certainly didn't stop to think about how this would effect their students. By the way, these schedules hurt every sport, not just baseball. I have heard, don't know if it is true that basketball students suffer more than any other student, especially when they have to board a plane am and be back pm, takes it's toll.
Doesn't this just mean bigger revenues for teh schools and conferences? Not necessarily the NCAA?

As I stated before, I don't understand everything the NCAA does, but are we really blaming the right people?


I don't know the answers, there probably aren't any but was curious for opinions.

While the one team I can think of loves to play the best competition possible, IMHO, it's definitely about the weather.

Last two years their opening series has had weather cancellations so last I heard they were going to try and go further south to open the season.

Let's see, there are those who say the baseball season is too long with 56 games. The NCAA and some coaches are requesting a cutback to 52. However, a team can play 5-10 games
in Hawaii and those do not count against the 56 since playing colleges in Hawaii are
exempted. (FSU played 9 games there last year-64 reg season games).

I wonder, will that exemption now be voided?

Also, isn't the 56 game maximum just that? I don't believe there is a MINIMUM is there?

Last year:Harvard 46, Pittsburg 51, just to name a couple. Teams are allowed to play less
if they so desire-for whatever reason.

Also, I wonder how Pittsburg and Notre Dame(both northern schools we'd have to agree) are
picked first and second preseason Big East Conf. over University of South Florida-a southern school that played 61 regular season games last year.

I think USF should complain about the rankings since they are a southern school they should be ranked #1. Go figure .

Moc1

The Big East Rankings are, I believe, voted by the coaches and it is meant to reflect the talent of the teams.

Being from Florida doesnt guarantee anything.

TR-SO.....You're saying a team from the North could actually be better than a team from the South? Imagine that. I thought it was all about warm weather-not talent, desire, and coaching.

Come to think of it there's a pretty good program in your neck of the woods that seems to do
a pretty good job every year-St. Johns. How about Army and Connecticut?

I wasn't being serious about USF complaining-My point is that good coaches and good programs will find a way to compete year in and year out no matter what "disadvantages" they go up against.

Do schools only have to play regulation conference games? Or is there a # requirement?

No one seems to be answering my questions. Who is making things more difficult, the schools and coaches or the NCAA? No one is concerend that conference teams are becoming so far apart travel is difficult?

Each conference has their own rules about # of conf. games--and in your far flung conferences, travel is a HUGE concern for the "non-revenue" sports. Even in the Big South, we have to travel to Birmingham--a good 9+ hour trip.

TPM, you have to remember what drives the boat--TV! The ACC had to expand to 12 teams in order to have the big payoff with the football championship game, and wanted the Boston TV market. Makes as much sense as Miami did in the Big East (and they remained independent in baseball). What ends up happening, is that there was a trickle down effect. The Big East raided Conf USA, who raided others, who raided...
...Well, you get the picture. Hope this helps some.

JT,
Thanks for answering. Don't get me wrong, I am not the one complaining but everyone else was about 56 game schedule being compacted because practice begins feb 1, missed classes due to compacted game schedules, the NCAA screwing everything up. I think you all blame the NCAA for things that are not within their control, example, schedules and travel.

It's plenty doable beginning 4th week in febuary to get in 56 games. Some ACC schedules used to begin later, but the added teams made them begin earlier. Over spring break schools play back to back games. And schools do not have to play 56 games, they can cut out some non conference games if they have to but they won't if they are not forced to.
Teams that travel south in warmer weather do because they want to, they don't to. This year mine has to travel north and south on planes because he HAS to. But that is just the way it is.

I agree completely with Starzz.

Beginning mid march most schools play a 4-5 week schedule. Most schools end early May, going 2 weeks or more with NO school to contend with (which is a good thing), last May mine played 10 regular games in 14 days after school was over. Then a week at the ACC championship and then another two weeks into regionals ending june 12th a whole month AFTER classes ended. Don't worry about the students are being housed and fed. They are well taken care of. This is what they do folks, and many schools do it very well, without students having to "suffer" because they are missing classes. I am not saying it is easy, but it's done now, our boys can handle it.

JMO.

If the number of games is reduced from 56 - 52, there will be less out of conference games. If you play in a large conference of say 12 teams -now 36 of your 52 games are tied to conference foes. This doesn't leave a lot of opportunities to play schools out of their conference. Many of these games are highly anticipated by the fan base.

Does the NCAA really believe that there is a big difference in temps from the middle of Feb to the end Feb in the north? Also, the RPI of many schools in the north will take a beating since they will not have the opportunity to play some of the stronger teams in the south. Once again, this is an example of the NCAA taking away from baseball - isn't baseball the 3rd highest revenue sport in the post season.

scbaseball says:
"Also, the RPI of many schools in the north will take a beating since they will not have the opportunity to play some of the stronger teams in the south".

Didn't someone state that the NCAA was bowing to pressure from the northern teams?

SC also has a problem with math. In a 12-team league a team would play only 33 games in conference.

quote:

by TPM: Didn't someone state that the NCAA was bowing to pressure from the northern teams?

Ohio State's Bob Todd is the impetus on the Division I Baseball Issues Committee that (finally) proposed the change in schedule last spring.
"I can show you notes that go way back to 1975 and ’76 when I was an assistant at Missouri when we were talking about this," Todd said.

since then he has been "mesmerizing" coaches, fans, AD's and anyone else who would listen with plans that would make northern teams more competitive

but, it does seem plain that the new plan will, decrease "warm open dates" and in turn hurt northern RPI's, increasing the advantage warm weather teams already have for "at large" tourney bids -

so more now than before, if you are "North" win your conference tourney, or forget the NCAA postseason

A point of clarification: In at least two of the Division I conferences that have 12 teams (the Atlantic Coast and Southeastern conferences), the league causes each team to give up one conference series each season (The one given up rotates each year among the teams in the opposite division.) As a result, ACC and SEC teams currently play 30 conference games in their regular season.

JT - you are right, sorry about the math - I really do understand basic math, just made an error.

I need to add that fewer out of conference games will also affect many southern schools RPI's as well (mid majors in particular), so I don't want to unfairly single out only northern schools.

You bring up the Big South - if not for the out of conference schedule that Coastal and Winthrop played last year (and had some very good wins), only one team out of the Big South makes it to the NCAA Regionals last year even though both were obviously deserving.

I'm not sure where all this goes however a few points as I see it;
The starting date has effected all the other major collegiate sports, baseball was the only one without one.

Is this move strictly about weather, no. How about leveling the field with games played/days. MLB has a start date and an end date, you play 162 games in X days and yes there are north and south teams. Is it level now that school S students miss as many classes as school N.

The 56 game schedule does have teams that play less if you look at their record. Teams in the NE for years will play 5 or 6 games in the fall that count against the 56 thus you see them play only 48 - 50 games.

This fall schedule would have very adverse effects on some schools because of the NCAA rule of being at 11.7 by the 3rd competition. For those NE schools playing in the fall would not have the tryout opportunities of other programs.

If Ohio State can play their 56 game schedule in the allotted days why would anyone else have a problem especially with less rainouts or better draining/drying conditions.

Only the reduction of games that was voted down and resubmitted would really have an adverse effect on who gets to play who out of conference.

quote:

by scbb: I need to add that fewer out of conference games will also affect many southern schools RPI's as well (mid majors in particular), so I don't want to unfairly single out only northern schools.

would not "warm" schools be getting more of the available non-conference opportunities vs each other because of scheduling convenience?? (and- more strong RPI teams are located "warm" - cold teams NEEDED to go south early, for RPI - however, now fewer opportunities will exist)

quote:

by CMerc: Is this move strictly about weather, no. How about leveling the field . . . . Is it level now that school S students miss as many classes as school N.

"now that school S (warm) students miss as many classes as school N (cold)"


I guess that clears it up -

they will help(?) college baseball by screwing the schools who are more able to "respect"
the STUDENT part of "student athlete" by making their players MISS more class time!

SC--you are dead on. Even the bottom feeders in the Big South tend to get quality wins every year. Makes it a fine baseball league. Losing a number of games would hurt in that respect.

Why do we keep talking about losing games?? Did that part of the proposal not get voted down? If the Northern schools still make the February and March trips the opportunities will still be there. This really effects the teams that I see start their games Jan 23 according to ncaa-baseball.com.

Looking at it now....we may all be missing the point. It could be an East vs West issue

Big West Conference
1/27/2006
Cal State Northridge
at Arizona State




1/27/2006
Fresno State
at Cal Poly




Pac 10 Conference
1/27/2006
Cal State Northridge
at Arizona State




Southwestern Athletic Conference
1/27/2006
Texas College
at Prairie View A&M




Western Athletic Conference
1/27/2006
Fresno State
at Cal Poly

Coach Merc,
Maybe you are on to something because my son's school in the "south" begins the same time as many northern schools.
Official practice has not begun as yet, I think another week.

quote:

by Coach Merc: why do we keep talking about losing games?? Did that part of the proposal not get voted down?

you are correct still 56 games - for now

but, their concerns seem logical -
that because the rule "compresses" the actual playing days in front end of the season (before conference play) - that scheduling & money will benefit scheduling teams with shorter travel distance

comments -

"the proposal, with a few exceptions, has not been embraced by southern coaches. These coaches dislike the March 1 start date and the compressed season. Primary concerns are a crowded midweek schedule, problems with makeup games, more missed class time for students."


"It will definitely increases our operating costs, especially at season end, in housing & allowance, and frankly, it's of more benefit for our program to play a home & home series with nearby (southern) opponents than to pay distant opponents a guarantee. That's something we'll have to take a close look at"


"Big 10 Commissioner Jim Delany wanted the season pushed back two weeks with a common start date of March 1. If he didn't get his way with the NCAA, he and his northern counterparts threatened to start their own playoff and even create a separate national champion."


THE IRONY


"The Big Ten may be able to foot the future bill associated with major programs.
however, in reality, what they are actually aiming for is to become one of the hefty gorillas they are currently baiting. They want the bigger slice of the postseason pizza. Delany is one of the biggest proponents of college football BCS $ystem, yet he and the Big Ten finds they are on the outside looking in at the candy dish on the diamond."


COMING SOON - the NEXT logical step (if there is such a thing with NCAA)

the NCAA cares about the kids,
they are missing too much class,
WE MUST PLAY FEWER GAMES