No Bullpen yet

Unless I am missing something, abso-friggin-lutely!  BucsFanSon (and many, many others I know) has been throwing bullies for a month indoors, and we still have some snow.  Especially in SoCal (if that is where you are), it makes no sense at all.  Even at unofficial, offseason workouts pre-tryouts, Ps at sons HS throw light bullies (start with just FBs, then throw some changes the next week, etc.).  I guess it depends on how far away first games are, but we are a few weeks away, whereas I would assume you guys could start ASAP.

Originally Posted by LAball:

The team as practiced for 1 week including weekends. Hitting, fielding, and plays. But no bullpen yet. Should bullpen be happening?

Are you saying your son hasn’t had a pen yet, or the team hasn’t?

The reason I ask is, when my son was still pitching, he was always the last pitcher to start throwing pens in the spring because the coaches knew he was taking lessons all through the winter and was more ready to pitch than anyone. Because of that they spent more time on those who needed it the most. The program I work with now does pretty much the same thing, where the majority of work goes to those who haven’t been working much, if at all.

Son has been having bullpens a couple of times a week since early January, and tryouts aren't until next week.

That sounds reasonable.

No bullies for the team yet.

The team has only been practicing for a week.  My bet is that the coaches are trying to make sure the kids arms are in shape before putting them on the hill.  I'm sure there is a lot of throwing and long tossing going on.  The last thing you want is a kid whose arm is not in shape trying to burn a fast ball to impress the coaches before he is ready.  I would be patient and let the coaches handle it.  Depending on when your season starts - and I would guess it will be a little bit since you've only been practicing a week - there should be plenty of time for mound work.

Well at least you know its not just your kid.

Was there an off season program, for those who did not play basketball?  Many differing opinions as it relates to time off, long toss, bullpens (flat ground & mound), etc., but as close as you are likely to the season starting, with the exception of a basketball player who was doing no type of throwing during off season, then bullpens IMO should have already started.  Pitching from a mound is very different than any other throwing motion, and unless practiced from a mound, is difficult at best.  Just my opinion, however except for periods of rest, bullpens are always being thrown, whether in season, or off season.

It does seem different to not have started throwing pens yet but lot of things to consider here before passing judgment.  

How long is your preseason?  If it's two or three weeks then this is not good.  Anything longer than this I can see it working.

When I was in Kentucky we had about six weeks before we played.  Our first week we didn't touch a mound.  Lots of long tossing and getting work at other positions before needing to throw a real pen.

Second week kept the long tossing up but now we are throwing limited pens.  They would do a 30 - 40 pitch session every other day.  Focused on mechanics in drill work before getting on.  We would do this while catchers would work on their drills.  I wouldn't say "throw 80%" or anything like that but it was definitely not 100% max effort.  Near the end of the week we would start mixing in change ups.

Third week still long tossing but little more involved with the bullpens.  Now we would go about 45 - 55 pitches with more change ups.  The last 10 - 12 would be thrown at game effort.  Still had drill work for mechanics with catchers doing their work.

Fourth week do a little less long toss but we will do it all season just not as intense.  Now we are up to about 60 - 70 pitches every two days with change ups and last 15 - 17 game effort.  Older guys we may start having them throw curves but it will depend on where they are.  If they're not ready then they don't throw them.  Mechanic drills still.

Fifth week same with long toss and now we were (hopefully) on the field.  If we were on the field then they would start in the bullpen and throw about 50 - 60 pitches then come out to the game mound and face a batter for live situation for about 10 - 15 pitches.  We tell our hitters to be aggressive so usually see two hitters before shut down - sometimes three.  Still try to do this every two days but it depends on how they feel.  If they don't feel like it then they don't do it and we give them an extra day of rest.

Sixth week we usually had 1 or 2 scrimmages with another team or intersquad games.  Now we would divy up the work to where my guys who will get the majority of innings would get most of the work against another team.  My secondary pitchers would get some innings against the other teams but mostly do intersquad.  Then I would have my better JV pitchers with us just in case we needed to eat some innings.  For example my guy's not feeling it and getting hammered.  We pull him and the next guy steps up.  Well that means the other team is going to be short an inning so we let our JV guy throw against their last guy.

First two weeks of the season we limit their number of pitches to about 60 - 70 and then usually turn them loose after that.

The thing is you need to trust your guys and they need to trust you.  If we have their limit at 60 - 70 but they feel like garbage or tight or maybe a dead arm they can shut down at 30 or whatever.  There's no real reason why they need to push through this when not ready.

So a really long story to put two cents worth in - yes it's possible to go the first week without throwing a bullpen.  But you need the preseason time to build them up.

Coach2709,

That type of schedule would be a dream.... Jr.'s team had 1 1/2 weeks to perform tryouts, cuts, set JV & Varsity, and then started live scrimmages against other teams...most HS in our region are similar.  I have always said, pitchers need to rely on themselves to have a 12 month program that ramps up to BEFORE high school season starts.  You can still play other sports, but you can't stop training to be a pitcher if you are serious about your craft.  If you are waiting for your HS coach to do it for you, you may wind up disappointed....plus many HS coaches can't do it due to restrictions, or things out of their control.

This topic highlights some of the challenges HS coaches face in mapping out their progression of practices.  What Coach laid out is a great.  There is a difference between throwing flat ground and off a mound.  There should be a gradual progression as he described.  However, many programs don't have the luxury of six weeks of practice with the team before games start and I'm guessing that is the case with the school of the OP. 

We have many winter sports kids (including some we rely on to pitch) who can't get to our practices until within a week of game 1.  Some throw a lot prior to showing up and some don't.  So, there are several different timelines in place to safely work kids up to bullpens.  It wasn't that many years ago that we were limited to a 2-3 week window of practice before games started - impossible to conduct a safe progressive program for pitchers.  Throwing them on a mound right out of the gate is not good if these kids haven't been throwing prior.  Now that we start non-winter sports kids much earlier, we definitely don't conduct bullpens the first few weeks.  Is it possible that the coach at the OP school is stuck between a rock and a hard spot?  Limited to a few weeks or so between first practice and games, wanting to protect arms but needing to get them on the mound sooner than later?

Obviously, pitchers should come in to Spring practice with their arms already in decent shape and that can be a requirement at bigger schools but not always the reality at smaller ones. 

PS - I see I was typing my post as BFS posted... much of the same message.

+1.

HS tryouts just started yesterday.  First scrimmage is 3/11 with the season starting 3/18.  Not much time to get cuts done - usually a week to complete tryouts.  Then it's bringing the pitchers up to speed while figuring out who's going to play where and who starts.  6 weeks is a luxury teams around here simply don't have.

Well in a state association's infinite wisdom KY has lowered the practice time down to about 4 weeks I believe.  It wouldn't take much of an adjustment to what we did to help them get prepared but whenever you cut time on preparing pitchers it makes you wonder when they say "we are in it for the best interest of the kids".  In NC we have two weeks from tryouts to first game - that makes no sense because you HAVE to prepare before the pre-season starts.  I'm not a head coach down here but if I was I would type up that schedule and give to them with a start date.  Then hope they do it on their own and assess where they are when they show up.  

The only good thing is you will find out who really wants to play or not 

I hope that "12 month program" still includes a solid 3-4 months without throwing a ball!

Bulldog19:  respectfully, no My statement of 12 month program, does not include 3-4 months of not throwing a ball.  Before you respond, understand that although I know you can point to "studies" done that show evidence of reduced incidence of injury, I just posted in a different thread a contrarian point of view that suggest that the increase in injuries is due to lack of throwing, and lack of training the arm for the work load, i.e. Lack of throwing.  I am not saying that one should not take any time off, in certain cases that amount of time off may be a good thing, however for most less would be better.

Just so I am clear, I distinguish between throwing a ball, and pitching.