Not All Summer Collegiate progams are equal!

ILUVBB, I sent you a PM.

Excellent list of questions for us inexperienced parents. Could you elaborate on his expeience without offending anyone?????

ILVBB,
Great post, you are right in your assumption and gave good advice to those who will be in the same situation some day. You should ask questions or prepare your son to do the asking. Most college coaches, unless they have a long standing relationship with programs, don't know specifics about each and every program. They send their players off and if they come back happy then they'll send more the following year. That's how it works.
BTW, MLB does not support most summer collegiate leagues, they are not even sanctioned leagues anymore. They dump a ton of money into the Cape (on their own terms) because that is where most of their scouts head for the summer. I found the biggest support given to my player from the Red Sox who hosted the All Stars at a game and provided plaques to them as well. Other than that, you won't find much or see anything MLB (except scouts and crosscheckers, etc.)
There are only a handful of leagues now that actually work very hard during the year to help raise money to support their programs, find host families and provide transportation to and from games. Costs have become extreme.
Summer collegiate ball is a great experience and most players, despite having things go wrong or not run the way we think it should, usually find it a lasting memory. But lately have found more players heading home for the summer and finding local leagues to play in to improve their game.

quote:

Great post, you are right in your assumption and gave good advice to those who will be in the same situation some day. You should ask questions or prepare your son to do the asking.

I have some differing views.
From what we found, most of the people who own or run these teams are doing so because of their joy of baseball, their caring for college players to the extent they overextend themselves trying to provide a place for good college players to compete in wood bat leagues, they work at it 10 months out of the year to support 25 players and 3 coaches for 40-50 games, they are all working full time jobs on their own, and the resources to do all of this comes out of their pockets, with a bit of community support.
If the conditions and questions are to be asked before a parent "commits" or "supports" their son playing summer ball, then that seems to leave 3 possible options:
1.) the player better be so good they will be in the Cape, Northwoods or one of very top teams where tradition, community support and ownership resources are considerable;
2.) The parent has the resources to and starts their own team with the financial backing and baseball ability to answer all the questions positively;
3.) The player will come home for the summer.
One of our son's former summer league teammates and his family is a good example. They own one of the franchises in the Coastal Plain league. Unfortunately, they could not operate it this year due to the financial and personal demands it placed on their resources. From the last conversations, they are hopeful for the future, but efforts to fund, run, and operate such a franchise are more than considerable.
I will never forget our son's experience in Lowell, Massachusetts.
That summer, we had the pleasure to meet and talk numerous times with Harry Ayotte, the GM, and his family.
When you would arrive at games, the daughter would be selling/taking tickets. Mom would be running the concession stand. Another relative was doing the field. Another doing the announcing and game logistics. All of this for a crowd of maybe 200 on a good day.
All they could talk about was how much fun they were having and how they so much looked forward to having "their" boys come to Lowell for the summer...and also, how much they wanted to win.
Nope, I don't agree that we as parents are to be involved in this process to the extent of the questions proposed.
I readily recognize there are variations in the quality of summer leagues and summer league teams. But that is true of college programs, high school programs, little league programs, and, not surprisingly, in Milb.
My view is coaches do their very best to get their players into the best leagues and teams where the player can play and succeed. They do not send them off uncaring. Many of the coaches spend hours on the phone trying to get them placed during the school year. They want their players to play, to experience baseball, to experience different people, different coaches and different parts of the USA.
Some experiences involve learning through sacrifice, by going without, by getting by, and by playing baseball and making friends, and making the best of your situation.
Nope, I am not much in agreement with this thread.

I'm with you infielddad. Even in the Cape League, many of those questions would have an answer that might not be suitable to a parent over-thinking it all.

My son dealt with a number of 'less-than-optimal' things (other than the injury) in the Cape but he also made friends for life with the locals, the coach, the GM and more. He wouldn't trade any of it.

Now he's in the minor leagues and lives in a hotel (rent taken out of his check), walks to games, has no internet and told me last night he eats peanut butter and jelly sandwiches nearly every day to save money. And he's LOVIN' it! Should I call the Padres and interview them about living conditions before he'll report to Spring Training next year?

These kids are young and resilient and if I think about it for about 30 seconds I can remember some of the very best days of my life were at this age when I was eating hot dogs and mac-and-cheese for dinner every night.

God bless the people who own and run these teams. In many ways, one of them saved my son's career. What question could I have possibly asked anyone a priori to ascertain that this man would do everything on God's green earth to take care of him and check in on him ever since? God bless all of 'em!

Lets let our kids grow up a little on their own...whaddya say?

Heck - you got the deluxe version of mac and cheese by adding the hotdogs - that would have been the sunday night special!!! How about those days of noodles with a small can of tomato sauce since ragu was more expensive!!!

Running these college summer teams is a labor of love - and certainly not a profit making venture. I do think the list above is worth thinking about - but that "a wrong answer" is not alone a reason not to do it.

I agree with infielddad even though my son had a not so great experience. He is probably just as at fault as the team. The team treated him well but mislead him on several issues. As a result he turned down 4 placements last summer but it is his issues and priorities that are the problem.
I think many have unrealistic views of summer collegiate ball. Some love it and others don't. It is not always the teams fault.
I think most people involved do it because they love the game. Some do it better than others.

My point when I started this tread was provide some insight into questions that I learned were important. I for one was a "rookie" when it came to these leagues.

My son had a great experience his first collegiate summer. The team was well run, affordable and he grew from the experience. This year it was far from the same situation.

In that we as parents have little or nothing to do with where our son's will play, I wanted to share what I thought were some questions that should be considered.

Several of my points have real world consequences. Having immediate access to some level of medical care can make a huge difference, some leagues staff games some don't.

I am not faulting the efforts of college coaches. They are doing the best they can to help their kids. I suspect that they don't know the answers to these questions as well and for them to be effective they may want to consider some of what I have outlined.

I agree that kids need to learn to "tough it out" and learn from the experience. However, I also know that one does not get better sitting on the bench. There are trade-offs, my point was know what you are getting into, the pro's and con's, especially since we are the ones that will "pay the bill."

ILVBB seems the question you really want answered is "Is my son going to sit on the bench ?) That a tough one.
The medical insurance is your resposibility. In fact you have to prove your son is covered before he can play. Usually required gy the college he attends.
Teams have a tough time finding host families.

To me many of your questions were unanswerable or irrelevant.

There is a parent here whose son went off to play and players lived on their own. One player (not this parents), perhaps having too much to drink, sliced his hand up (finger maybe) and their son had to accompany him to the hospital. I guess that player was lucky to have this parents son there to care for him. My son asked little from his host family while at the cape, all he needed was a place to lie his head, but I was glad that they supported the curfew and no alcohol policy and took the time to see to whatever he might need (including food after late night games).

It's good to ask questions and find out certain things, if I found out mine was going to have to live on his own with others not familiar to him, no host family, not sure if mine would be going. That's just the way this mom is. Learning from an unfortunate circumstance recently, not everyone has been brought up responsibly like we did with ours. Even being responsible, trouble seems to find son wherever he is. I know they live at college and learn to get around on their own, somehow Clemson, SC is a whole lot differnt than may places out there. Why even in Batavia, NY son managed to find his own transportation by buying a bike which led to a disaster! Now being on crutches and a boot for sprain, his host family made sure he got where he needed to go. I know he would have managed, but it would have been difficult at first, no players really had transportation except those in neighboring states.

The Cape experience really can't be compared. It is a whole different way of life there, they live for summer baseball, the entire community. They will all bend over backwards for players and their families. Just think, if ED didn't have a host family, who would be there to care for him as you would. Not all summer leagues provide this luxury and parents have a right to know that as well as players).

I think the original post is a good one to make parents aware that not all summer teams are created equal, just like IFD has mentioned, travel teams, HS programs and college programs and since JBB mentioned it, not all milb teams as well. Mine didn't have to pay for living expenses, so he ate his paycheck all through last summer and still does.

quote:

My son asked little from his host family while at the cape, all he needed was a place to lie his head, but I was glad that they supported the curfew and no alcohol policy and took the time to see to whatever he might need (including food after late night games).

This might be why we are coming at this from different view points. When our's played in Auburn in the NY/Penn, and in Lowell/Mill City in the NECBL, they did not have host families.
In Auburn, the lived 5 together in a pretty rundown apartment about 3-5 blocks from the stadium. They were, most times, on their own after games and through the day for meals, other than lunch normally provided at the field. They were on their own for getting whatever they might need. Same in Lowell, Mass.
Personally, I think he learned from the experience, which is what college years are about.
Personally, I learned from his experience. I learned he can live autonomously, can rent his own place, can arrange for gas/electricity to be turned on/off and, most importantly for he and his roommates, to rent the 60 inch TV and get a cable account. He and I both learned he can make sure all bills are paid from his vast minor league salary with others in the apartment contributing. He proved and I learned he could live the life of a baseball player with little to not adult supervision. He learned he liked it that way.
Others such as myself will dispute the comment that the Cape experience can't be compared. I know I will based on that City called Newport just down the highway.
But there are players in Newport, just as there are in the Cape who don't have the best experience and/or have bad ones for various reasons.

I know some players who did not like the Cape experience.

I was speaking about having a host family during his summer baseball college years. As far as the comparison for the cape, I was speaking about how the league teams run things compared to other leagues. For example, sons team makes you live with a host family present AND you have to work. That worked for him and us. I was trying to point out that ALL experiences are different and you try to make the best of them. Some people expect that their sons summer experience will all be the same, they are not as pointed out in teh initial post. As a parent putting out expenses (yes it costs money to play summer ball for many), I would want to know who is running the show, and how it's run. If he hadn't inquired as to transportation, son wouldn't have a way to get to work, gym, field, eat, etc. If you don't ask these questions, don't complain later on if you or son are not happy.

I still stand by the fact that ILVBB has brought up some very good points to consider when deciding to go play summer baseball. This has nothing to do with playing time, or managing your affairs after you are working and getting a paycheck, though for some that's a first time experience.

TPM - Perhaps naively, we didn't really ask any of those things w/ regards to the Cape. Left it up to our son. He had to figure out many of these things on his own...getting to the field, working out, shopping for food, finding the job he wanted, etc... About the only thing anyone set up for him was his host family and even that presented its own set of problems...that he solved on his own.

A little rough at times early on...and perhaps we could've done a little more than a few bucks in his bank account for the transition...but he worked it out and now (I think in part because of previous experiences) this summer he really hasn't asked for anything.

I'm not trying to say I'm a better parent or anything of the sort...just saying these kids are pretty good (like we were) at growing up when they need too and I was very ready to let our son splash in the water a little bit before he could swim. I'd jump in with a life vest in a heartbeat if I felt I needed too. But I really cannot imagine asking most of these questions ahead of time...very few if any in fact.

JMO, nothing more.

When my son played on his first college, summer team, he lived on his own and that was what we as his parents wanted. I know many of his baseball friends have had some great experiences with host families, but we preferred not to take a chance with him living with someone unfamiliar. He had found a part-time job he could work at when the team was home. His boss was super about giving him the time off he needed when the team traveled. Boss knew son was on the team before he hired him. He had a great summer and awesome memories.

Well, I am all for letting my son go on his own and figure things out for himself. He has traveled on his own (without us) since the 8th grade when he was traveling all over the place for basketball. We could not afford to go to every tournament and stay a week with him and many other parents were in the same boat. We kind of took turns on which parents would go.
So, when it came time for him to go to college (only a couple of hours away), he chose to go to a big city that he was not familiar with, and did not know anyone. He had to figure out lots of things for himself last year and he did fine.

However, I think that parents should educate themselves about summer collegiate baseball. I think the original post brings up some good points to consider. I wish I had that list to look at before I sent my son off to summer ball. He is having a good experience overall, but it is different than we were told, and since we are the ones paying for extra expences that we had not planned for, I think we deserve to know the truth about the situation.

We were told he would be with a host family. He is not. We were told he would have a job. He does not. He lives with three other players and they basically fend for themselves which is fine except it is not what we were told. They cook for themselves, no TV, had to get internet (didn't expect to do that - thought host family would have it) installed so they could take their summer school classes. Since they get no meals from the host family, food has been a greater expense than I expected. They do get some meals from the team, and they do have transportation to games and have been treated well by the town they are in.

I was ignorant about it all since it was our first experience. I am not sure I would have much control on where he was going, but I sure could prepare better for it by knowing what the traditions and track record of the league are.


It's not that I wouldn't do it again, it is an adventure that he would not be on without baseball, BUT,I really would have done some research and asked a lot more questions so that we could plan financially

I hear ya JBB, however, we didn't ask the questions, we asked son to ask them.

I am not sure what the bad experience was, couldn't be any worse than an 18 year old slicing up his finger and another 18 year having to be responsible to get him help.

iheartbb, I can tell you that host parents is(are???) anything but an exact process for Summer Wood bat leagues. It is quite imprecise.
If you, or your son had called even 2 weeks before, I would bet the answer would have been yes, there will be a host parent. But many decide not to do it, some who are committed have reasons they cannot do it,and some who expressed interest decline when it gets to June.

See there infielddad, you just educated us all with another tidbit of info.

I did not know that about host families being wishy washy.

PS I know that all host families are not perfect either.
Son's friend that is in same league, different team
is with a host family (the host mom bought
him a p*rn movie for his 18th birthday -he
had only been there a week)

You don't say.
Now we are all learning something we never knew!!!!!!!

A nice thread for those that follow..........



Host families are on the path to MLB and become part of the fabric of a player.

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Just finished a book by baseball player from Harvard called Harvard Boys. The book is a no holds barred look at this young man's first year in spring training, the minor leagues and independent ball...Based on the book, and comparing it to summer ball...

...Two things struck me:

First...The Irony. It may be an overstatement, but from what we have experienced...The dream for many, if not all players/parents is professional baseball. Now while I do not in any way underestimate the difficulties of summer college ball (we have had 5 summers worth of it) the reality of the lower minors makes summer ball with all it's warts look like a holiday at times...and yet parents and players would kill to have that opportunity and those parenst/players would appear to be simply thrilled to be there one step, closer to the show...regardless of the struggles. Interesting how perspectives change.

Second...Be thankful for what you got. Have always claimed that life in college ball is one of lifes greatest opportunities, not only as a peamble to minor league ball but in and of itself. Certainly those in the minors are blessed and having an "enlightening experience", and we will be disappointed as we will not have that opportunity...but I'd caution players and parents....while there are many challenges in college ball, and difficult situations...don't be in too big a rush to move "forward"...College ball is great!

44
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O44 - From my (not necessarily my son's...he's still in the honeymoon phase and I'm quite pleased with that!) point of view...that is truly an insightful post.

A very wise and experienced coach I know has been known to say, "Unless you make it to the show, your college team is the very last 'team' you'll ever play on."