Okay - give me an opinion on this one...

quote:

Originally posted by Michael S. Taylor:
A walk, whether real or not is not a dead ball unless the ball hit the batter. This is a case of an umpire making a mistake and using CSFP to try and fix it and made a second mistake.

quote:

Originally posted by piaa_ump:
Stolen base. Defense asleep. Tragically misinformed umpires.

+1.....

quote:

Our coach argued that the runner should remain on 2nd, because he took the base while the ball was live. Umpires said it was a dead ball situation and he had to return.

quote:

Opinions:
Thanksgiving was great. Hope ya'lls was too.

How old a kids?

Umps need schooling, how old were they?

Throw R1 out next time.

quote:

Originally posted by pioneers3:
What happens if the UMP thought it was 3-1 and said 3-1, but after the pitch, the defensive coach proves it was 2-1, what happens with that?

And don't say that UMP will forget count, as I been involved in games where it has happen.

If I'm the base umpire, then don't ask me for the count.  That's your job.

quote:

Our coach argued that the runner should remain on 2nd, because he took the base while the ball was live. Umpires said it was a dead ball situation and he had to return.

coach was right umpire was wrong Imagine that

USSSA, nuf said.

+3

I agree about the rule, but it is a bad rule that should be changed. Sometimes the correct thing is just plain wrong!

If the runner is thrown out jogging to 2b because the umpire wrongly awarded 1b to the hitter. Then a correction is made, but the runner is out?  Might be right... But it ain't right! what if the hitter rounds 1b and is picked by the catcher. Is he out or allowed to go back and hit? It's one thing if the runner is attempting a stolen base, but another thing if he is just moving up on a walk.

Sometimes common sense is forgotten in the rules. 

BTW last year this happened (wrong count) in the Big Leagues. Wrong count, but no one was thrown out. I can't remember the exact situation, but think it had something to do with a hitter getting 4 strikes or 5 balls. Or might have been a three ball walk. They featured it on Baseball Tonight at the time.

Yes, but then why does the runner stay at 2b? Why is that mistake not corrected?

I believe what dash_riprock meant was that it should be fixed (runner sent back) only if the umpire mistakenly announces ball four.  But if the batter walks to first without the umpire indicating ball four, then it is the defense's responsibility to know the situation and throw the runner out.  In that case, it's the defense's own fault for not paying attention and the stolen base stands.

On a "three-ball walk", it's a live ball situation so R1 can steal or be thrown out.  But the batter has not officially become a batter-runner, so he cannot be thrown out.

Wait, can't we tie this to another post wher the Ump will call 2 strikes on the batter for delay of game and call him out?

Then, depending if there were 2 outs or not it may be an inning ender?...LOL

Because the ball was live and it is a steal.  The mistake was the defenses.  The rules are written in expectation that they are awake.

Jimmy,

I fully understand that! I'm not debating the rules Guess I was under the impression that the umpire awarded a base on balls.  If that is the case that would be the reason for not throwing to 2b.  It's also the only reason the runner went to 2b.  Common sense, rather than the actual rule, it seems like the mistake by the umpire should be corrected to what it was before the mistake. No reason for either team to benefit from the mistake.

Of course, if the batter simply runs to 1b on ball 3 that is different.  However, couldn't that be considered something else all together illegal if done to simply mislead. 

For over 100 years the rulemakers and the rules have required the players to be aware of situations.  This is not going to change.  This is similar to when an umpire fails to call an infield fly in a timely fashion.  If conditions are appropriate the IFR is still in effect.

No.We don't invent rules.

Speaking as an accomplished poster of Asinine Reply's Bolstered with Logical Fallacies and Self-Accredited Expertise Designed to Make one Seem Superior and Unusually Well-Informed, I hereby award this post 3.5 Wraggies...congratulations.

Thank you for taking the time to consider this simple, factual and non biased explanation for such an honor.