Parent/Coach Conflict

bigcubbiefan posted:

Side note...my college coach didn't utter a cuss word in 4 years...amazing feat considering what he was working with!  Wish I could have followed in those footsteps.  He's also the only coach I've seen get ejected and talk his way back into the game  ( ump thought he heard GD but it was actually dadgummit...his favorite word). 

The most overqualified coach my son ever had was his middle school basketball coach. He was a former ACC, NBA and European player. My son said if a timeout started with, "Gosh darn it guys ..." you better be paying attention. He was pissed."

My two year old daughter cured me of swearing. I slammed my thumb with a hammer. My reaction was, " J**** C*****! F*** it!" What do you think my two year old said for about a month when she got frustrated or upset?

I want to compliment Steve A on taking a fair amount of unwarranted abuse and remaining calm. Nice job - better than I could have done!  As for the term snowflake...  if the shoe fits...

I asked my son what the coach said to him as he left the mound when he came in to close high school games. I told my son not to share it. He could have got the coach fired. It would have been considered grossly aggressive and over the top by some parents.

It didn't bother my son. He thought it was funny in its absurdity. So I didn't give it any thought other than sometimes chuckle about it when he K'ed the last hitter. 

JCG posted:

FWP posted:

Can we please separate language and ridicule?  They are not one and the same!  I am sure we all agree ridiculing a kid just for the sake of debasing him is wrong!  My son would not play for a coach like that.  By the way they can do that without cussing.  And lots of awful human beings make it a point in public to not cuss.  And there are lots of very kind caring coaches who cuss up a storm. The point is language is just language with or without cussing.  So if you are deeply offended by LANGUAGE, not unnecessary ridicule then yes you might be soft!

Exactly.

Which would you want your kid to be hearing?  Which do you think would have the best chance of working?

A) "Bobby, I got to tell you -  right now your approach at the plate f___ing sucks.  You're too f____ing tentative and you're watching too many f____ing good pitches go by. Get f____ing agressive! Trust  your motherf___ing swing and your motherf___ing hands and hit the motherf____ning ball!  That's all you have to do!  You've done it before and I know you can f____ing do it now! Cause I'll tell you right now, we need you to f___ing produce like you can if we're going to win this thing and right now you're producing s___t.  You can f___ing do it!"

B) "Bobby, I'm sorry to say this, but you've let this team down. You've let me down too. Heck you're letting the whole school down right now.  You're barely hitting your weight. Heck you're not even hitting your IQ this month, and that's not saying much.  I don't know what the problem is. Somebody steal your girlfriend? I'm not surprised.  I'd  walk out too if I was her.   If I was your mom and dad I'd probably throw you out of the house, or at least make you sleep in a tent in the back yard.  You better get it together or you'll be at the end of the bench the rest of the way. Or save me the trouble and just quit the team right now, okay? Will you do that for me?  Just give me your jersey now and quit. That would probably be best."

To your point, remove all of the unfinished words in your first coach's speech and you have effective communication without the vulgarity. The second speech is disingenuous.

Steve A. posted:

SanDiegoRealist posted:

Goosegg posted:

Want to get the kids attention? Let another hard working kid get his playing time. The benched kid (after it's explained) - if he wants - will use his logic to figure out how to earn his spot back - it distinguishes us from the mules who need to be whacked with a piece of lumber to perform simple tasks like plowing.

----------------------------------------------------

Exactly, Goosegg!

My son has played for both the cussing coaches and the better communicators. You obviously can't control the coach's personality, but I can tell you my kid enjoys the experience more if he isn't going to practice or a game with the thought in the back of his head that if he makes a mistake he will be ridiculed by his coach. Seen this happen many times, always is cringe-worthy.

Some people who are posting on here are acting as though a player/parent who prefers their players be communicated in a humane way are soft. Are you fricking kidding me? Why would anyone desire to be in a coaching environment that is anything other than professional? We have left one team in our time playing this great game due to a coach's behavior, and it wasn't even aimed at us. It just crossed a line. Coaches getting kicked out of games for arguing with umps and dropping the f-bomb...stupid. I saw a coach's tirade on the news out here from last summer in a larger tournament in which the coach literally had a melt down on the field against the home plate umpire. This is a guy who has played at a high level and now has a few teams at many ages. Guess what, someone recorded his melt down and sent it to the local news. It was played on the air and it doesn't matter if you were used to salty language or not, it was an embarrassment and doesn't belong on any baseball diamond.

So save the comments about being soft, it's really ridiculous. Expect a little more from the people you are employing to train/mentor your kids.

This is all fine & dandy in a fantasy world where you get to pick & choose your coach, boss, parents. However, in the real world, you probably don't get to fire your HS coach if he calls you a jackass for missing the bunt sign. I suppose you could transfer, quit every job with jerk management & change your name & shun your parents if you hear Dad drop too many F-Bombs. Good luck with that.

I'm not advocating it, but it happens & you as a player & or parent, need to get over it & find a way to move forward. I suppose its more about feeeelings though so we must step in for our little snowflakes & take away the hurt.

I don't need to get over anything, Steve A. I have turned jobs down before because after interviewing I didn't feel I was a good fit with their culture. I had choices. I have never left a job for a reason other than i had another opportunity available that allowed personal/professional growth. Maybe that isn't your situation, but that has been my experience. I put myself into positiv situations that benefit me.

If my kid misses a sign, he will hear it from his coach, no doubt...professionally.

SanDiegoRealist posted:

JCG posted:

FWP posted:

Can we please separate language and ridicule?  They are not one and the same!  I am sure we all agree ridiculing a kid just for the sake of debasing him is wrong!  My son would not play for a coach like that.  By the way they can do that without cussing.  And lots of awful human beings make it a point in public to not cuss.  And there are lots of very kind caring coaches who cuss up a storm. The point is language is just language with or without cussing.  So if you are deeply offended by LANGUAGE, not unnecessary ridicule then yes you might be soft!

Exactly.

Which would you want your kid to be hearing?  Which do you think would have the best chance of working?

A) "Bobby, I got to tell you -  right now your approach at the plate f___ing sucks.  You're too f____ing tentative and you're watching too many f____ing good pitches go by. Get f____ing agressive! Trust  your motherf___ing swing and your motherf___ing hands and hit the motherf____ning ball!  That's all you have to do!  You've done it before and I know you can f____ing do it now! Cause I'll tell you right now, we need you to f___ing produce like you can if we're going to win this thing and right now you're producing s___t.  You can f___ing do it!"

B) "Bobby, I'm sorry to say this, but you've let this team down. You've let me down too. Heck you're letting the whole school down right now.  You're barely hitting your weight. Heck you're not even hitting your IQ this month, and that's not saying much.  I don't know what the problem is. Somebody steal your girlfriend? I'm not surprised.  I'd  walk out too if I was her.   If I was your mom and dad I'd probably throw you out of the house, or at least make you sleep in a tent in the back yard.  You better get it together or you'll be at the end of the bench the rest of the way. Or save me the trouble and just quit the team right now, okay? Will you do that for me?  Just give me your jersey now and quit. That would probably be best."

To your point, remove all of the unfinished words in your first coach's speech and you have effective communication without the vulgarity. The second speech is disingenuous.

Well actually the first speech is my invention. The 2nd is a hearsay paraphrase of what a  friend's son had to listen to this year on one occasion.

JCG posted:

SanDiegoRealist posted:

JCG posted:

FWP posted:

Can we please separate language and ridicule?  They are not one and the same!  I am sure we all agree ridiculing a kid just for the sake of debasing him is wrong!  My son would not play for a coach like that.  By the way they can do that without cussing.  And lots of awful human beings make it a point in public to not cuss.  And there are lots of very kind caring coaches who cuss up a storm. The point is language is just language with or without cussing.  So if you are deeply offended by LANGUAGE, not unnecessary ridicule then yes you might be soft!

Exactly.

Which would you want your kid to be hearing?  Which do you think would have the best chance of working?

A) "Bobby, I got to tell you -  right now your approach at the plate f___ing sucks.  You're too f____ing tentative and you're watching too many f____ing good pitches go by. Get f____ing agressive! Trust  your motherf___ing swing and your motherf___ing hands and hit the motherf____ning ball!  That's all you have to do!  You've done it before and I know you can f____ing do it now! Cause I'll tell you right now, we need you to f___ing produce like you can if we're going to win this thing and right now you're producing s___t.  You can f___ing do it!"

B) "Bobby, I'm sorry to say this, but you've let this team down. You've let me down too. Heck you're letting the whole school down right now.  You're barely hitting your weight. Heck you're not even hitting your IQ this month, and that's not saying much.  I don't know what the problem is. Somebody steal your girlfriend? I'm not surprised.  I'd  walk out too if I was her.   If I was your mom and dad I'd probably throw you out of the house, or at least make you sleep in a tent in the back yard.  You better get it together or you'll be at the end of the bench the rest of the way. Or save me the trouble and just quit the team right now, okay? Will you do that for me?  Just give me your jersey now and quit. That would probably be best."

To your point, remove all of the unfinished words in your first coach's speech and you have effective communication without the vulgarity. The second speech is disingenuous.

Well actually the first speech is my invention. The 2nd is a hearsay paraphrase of what a  friend's son had to listen to this year on one occasion.

Ouch - not so funny when it's real...

JCG posted:

SanDiegoRealist posted:

JCG posted:

FWP posted:

Can we please separate language and ridicule?  They are not one and the same!  I am sure we all agree ridiculing a kid just for the sake of debasing him is wrong!  My son would not play for a coach like that.  By the way they can do that without cussing.  And lots of awful human beings make it a point in public to not cuss.  And there are lots of very kind caring coaches who cuss up a storm. The point is language is just language with or without cussing.  So if you are deeply offended by LANGUAGE, not unnecessary ridicule then yes you might be soft!

Exactly.

Which would you want your kid to be hearing?  Which do you think would have the best chance of working?

A) "Bobby, I got to tell you -  right now your approach at the plate f___ing sucks.  You're too f____ing tentative and you're watching too many f____ing good pitches go by. Get f____ing agressive! Trust  your motherf___ing swing and your motherf___ing hands and hit the motherf____ning ball!  That's all you have to do!  You've done it before and I know you can f____ing do it now! Cause I'll tell you right now, we need you to f___ing produce like you can if we're going to win this thing and right now you're producing s___t.  You can f___ing do it!"

B) "Bobby, I'm sorry to say this, but you've let this team down. You've let me down too. Heck you're letting the whole school down right now.  You're barely hitting your weight. Heck you're not even hitting your IQ this month, and that's not saying much.  I don't know what the problem is. Somebody steal your girlfriend? I'm not surprised.  I'd  walk out too if I was her.   If I was your mom and dad I'd probably throw you out of the house, or at least make you sleep in a tent in the back yard.  You better get it together or you'll be at the end of the bench the rest of the way. Or save me the trouble and just quit the team right now, okay? Will you do that for me?  Just give me your jersey now and quit. That would probably be best."

To your point, remove all of the unfinished words in your first coach's speech and you have effective communication without the vulgarity. The second speech is disingenuous.

Well actually the first speech is my invention. The 2nd is a hearsay paraphrase of what a  friend's son had to listen to this year on one occasion.

Gosh, would have never figured that out! 

Not a prude, spent too long in the military and spewed too many expletives myself to say I am offended at all by cussing. But as Sluggerdad and others (even RJM - gasp) have said, there is a time and place. Usually the workplace (for a coach that is game or practice) isn't the right place, unless you're a plumber or a porn star then you can chalk it up to professional jargon!

SanDiegoRealist posted:

. But as Sluggerdad and others (even RJM - gasp) have said, there is a time and place. Usually the workplace (for a coach that is game or practice) isn't the right place, unless you're a plumber or a porn star then you can chalk it up to professional jargon!

ha ha!

SanDiegoRealist posted:

JCG posted:

SanDiegoRealist posted:

JCG posted:

FWP posted:

Can we please separate language and ridicule?  They are not one and the same!  I am sure we all agree ridiculing a kid just for the sake of debasing him is wrong!  My son would not play for a coach like that.  By the way they can do that without cussing.  And lots of awful human beings make it a point in public to not cuss.  And there are lots of very kind caring coaches who cuss up a storm. The point is language is just language with or without cussing.  So if you are deeply offended by LANGUAGE, not unnecessary ridicule then yes you might be soft!

Exactly.

Which would you want your kid to be hearing?  Which do you think would have the best chance of working?

A) "Bobby, I got to tell you -  right now your approach at the plate f___ing sucks.  You're too f____ing tentative and you're watching too many f____ing good pitches go by. Get f____ing agressive! Trust  your motherf___ing swing and your motherf___ing hands and hit the motherf____ning ball!  That's all you have to do!  You've done it before and I know you can f____ing do it now! Cause I'll tell you right now, we need you to f___ing produce like you can if we're going to win this thing and right now you're producing s___t.  You can f___ing do it!"

B) "Bobby, I'm sorry to say this, but you've let this team down. You've let me down too. Heck you're letting the whole school down right now.  You're barely hitting your weight. Heck you're not even hitting your IQ this month, and that's not saying much.  I don't know what the problem is. Somebody steal your girlfriend? I'm not surprised.  I'd  walk out too if I was her.   If I was your mom and dad I'd probably throw you out of the house, or at least make you sleep in a tent in the back yard.  You better get it together or you'll be at the end of the bench the rest of the way. Or save me the trouble and just quit the team right now, okay? Will you do that for me?  Just give me your jersey now and quit. That would probably be best."

To your point, remove all of the unfinished words in your first coach's speech and you have effective communication without the vulgarity. The second speech is disingenuous.

Well actually the first speech is my invention. The 2nd is a hearsay paraphrase of what a  friend's son had to listen to this year on one occasion.

Gosh, would have never figured that out! 

Not a prude, spent too long in the military and spewed too many expletives myself to say I am offended at all by cussing. But as Sluggerdad and others (even RJM - gasp) have said, there is a time and place. Usually the workplace (for a coach that is game or practice) isn't the right place, unless you're a plumber or a porn star then you can chalk it up to professional jargon!

The baseball field is a male environment which I would consider a blue collar profession.  It's physical labor.  Any blue collar male dominated environment is going to be loaded with colorful language.  The idea that the workplace isn't the right place is completely dependent on the job.  What is mom going to say when her 18yr old son comes home from his summer framing job and tells her how the foreman told him he better get his arse in gear or don't bother showing up the next day?  

RJM posted:

I asked my son what the coach said to him as he left the mound when he came in to close high school games. I told my son not to share it. He could have got the coach fired. It would have been considered grossly aggressive and over the top by some parents.

It didn't bother my son. He thought it was funny in its absurdity. So I didn't give it any thought other than sometimes chuckle about it when he K'ed the last hitter. 

We always asked son to rate coaches during a season. Who do you like best, why, what does he or she do for you? Worst rating was a LL coach — why? "Mom, he acts like he likes me better than his own kid." Most devastating was a middle school basketball coach — "he's a really nice guy. I never know if I'm doing good or bad because he's so nice about it all." Best was a loud, profane female basketball coach  — "oh yea, I always know EXACTLY what she wants from me, and she mostly wants me to be better"

coach2709 posted:

Did I miss something in the article about cussing?  Since we are saying that coaches got in trouble it had to be from cussing then I guess it had to be in there but I guess I overlooked it.

I must have missed it as well.  I was once told that sarcasm was much sharper than a knife in the minds of young players.  It cuts deeper and wound heals slower.  So, don't use it.  IMO, that was great advice that I think of all of the time.  This might have been any number of things and, again, as some others have pointed out, the actually allegation isn't clear.