Parents & Recruiting

Not yet convinced that this helps your son mature. My son was very mature and I just can't see the benefit of talking to a BB coach.
Maybe it would help the parent get a few more grey hairs. I could see an issue if I had coaches backing away from talking to me but we had great conversations and everything went well. My son like most has dealt with coaches for years and I never get involved. He didn't have to regurgitate what the coach told him and there was never any confusion.

As a coach of a travel team I want our players to talk with us not the parents. If the parents want a private chat that is cool but not to the exclusion of the player.

I have found that the young men who pick up the phone and call or email me are the leaders of the team on the field and in the dugout---coincidental? I think not

I can also tell you that college and coaches this year in speaking at our showcases stressed the point that they are recruiting the boy not the parent and thus want to speak with the boy. Many coaches use the phone conversations as a means of getting an idea as to what sort of boy they are recruiting---they cannot get that from speaking with the parents

DIXBIBLE,

I don't know about anyone else but when my kids wanted or needed something expensive they came to discuss it first with us, as we were paying for it. They just didn't go out and buy it without our permission.

The same goes for the college experience, don't you all sit down and discuss the process with your children, what you might and might not be able to afford, taking into consideration in state out of state, travel expenses, off campus living, etc? I think we prepared son that if he got an offer he would thank the coach and tell him he had to discuss it with his parents first. Let's face it most of your son's have no clue how much it is to go to college. We wanted him to be aware of that. I definetly agree that speaking to the coaches directly about all aspects of the recruiting process is part of the maturing process.
Now I am not saying one should take the BEST offer, but that is where the player and the coach relationship comes in. I want to know that if my son was going to play and attend college somewhere and we were paying lots of money for it, he was going to make the choice on the right fit and for the right reasons, and that may or may not include whether we could afford it or not. But we felt that the discussion was important and that he couldn't be totally oblivious to the financial end.

I know that many of you worry about the conversations that occur between coach and sons on the phone during the recruiting process. If yo uhave to worry about your son saying yes without discussing it first, you haven't done your job in the recruiting process. Understand that coaches do this hundreds of times (speak to players), our sons only a few (speak to coaches). Good coaches know how to talk to the players to make them feel more comfortable, so you all need to let them have those conversations. If they are busy, make sure they take the time to speak to the coach when they do have time, even if for 5-10 minutes a week. It is important for them to get to know each other, better than coach and parent to get to know each other. Many coachs will go out of their way to call parents to introduce themselves, chit chat for a few minutes and then that may be it until the visit, or perhaps no discussion until a visit. Successful recruiting coaches of successful programs usually want to speak to parents to get an idea of where they are coming from, and many a player has not been asked to join the team because of a parent and their attitude. That happens. Never tell a coach how good your son is, he can determine that for himself if he wants to. Let your son decide if these are the people he ants to work with, prepare him for it.
JMO.

Here is a question to parents who have gone through the process - Did any of your son's not really know which schools they were interested in as they entered their jr. year in hs? How did it play out?Any advice is appreciated.

None of my boys had any idea at all---they all played college baseball

463, we approached the recruiting process as a filtering system the process included:

Where in the country he was open to playing.
Were there climate considerations that he does not play well in or did not want to play in?
What type of school he wanted to attend: big school, small school, private school, or public school.
What level of baseball he could play at D1, D2, D3, JC, or NAIA (obviously skill sets will over lap).
Did he care if they had other sports such as football and basketball games to attend for the total college experience?
What type of major he was interested in and if the schools had them. (May never be able to answer that question)
How good was the school academically.
The level of play the baseball program was at.
Did the school have the need for his skill set, how many are there in his same position(s), when they will be graduating or drafted, what types of recruits are they brining in and when, etc?
Are they interested in him?
Is he interested in them?
Who else may be going to the school?
What other offers does he have or expect to get.
What is the best fit?

How did it play out, he wanted to go to a small private school which was by the coast with a beach that they could swim in without wet suits, that had a chance to go to the CWS, going to a school with some of his other buddies, and that he could make a impact as a freshman.

Well I guess getting a College World Series National Championship ring will take the sting out of not meeting any of the other criteria

Good stuff HR - thanks.

The 1st offer we had was from a JC. The coach traveled witha tournament team and approached my son as he walked off the mound at the end of the game. He told him he liked what he saw and asked where his Dad was. He then left and came over and introduced himself. He handed me his Tamapa Bay scout card and his JC card. He and his assistant asked if they could sit with me for a bit. We talked and spent about an hour going over what he would offer. I even asked if he wanted my son to join us between games and he said no that it wasn't necessary. He knew that ultimately he was talking to the guy who made the final decision. We kept in touch for over a year. he knew a Tampa scout who had seen my son in Long Island and said he could help himwith any pro asperations. I told him I would relay what he said to me.
Others sent BB programs to me through contact info from his coaches. I was pulled into the process by recruiters who called me so it was a natural pogression for me to get deeply involved.
When a coach wanted to talk to our son he said so. It was usually well into the process. I had no problem with what my son would say because he would always defer to me or my wife in matters that affected us. As far as maturity he is very mature and was looking at schools far from home and because of his up bringing and BB experience he was not even the slightest bit nervous mingling with coaches and new teammates. When we dropped him at college 900+ miles from home he couldn't waite to say good bye to us. After a few hours it was like he was with old buddies. After 3 years he calls us regularily at 11:30PM and there is always a buch of guys and girls laughing and having a great time. He has never given us 1 moment of worry and got raves from the international student coordintor.
I don't think my total involvment has left any emotional scares and it certainly got him an excellent scholarship at his 2nd top choice college.
I really think you can over think the process. You know what they say about the best laid plans.

My guess is that most players will accept the 1st offer from any college that they get as long as it is reasonable.

463, Thanks!

Sometimes your dream school does not work out; I need to add one additional point:

Does the financial commitment work for the family in relationship to the school?

quote:

Originally posted by 463:
Here is a question to parents who have gone through the process - Did any of your son's not really know which schools they were interested in as they entered their jr. year in hs? How did it play out?Any advice is appreciated.

There was only one place my son was seriously interested in all of his life until he began to get serious interest and got to know other coaches. At that point we began the same filtering process Homerun04.

BHD,
The coaches spoke with you because they obviously got the signal that you were the guy in charge. In reality, we also had some input in the situation, but only after son spoke with each coach. Everyone does things differently, I just feel that it is important for the player and coach to get to know each other well, not parent and coach. JMO.

TPM I agree with what you are saying but doing it my way does not imply that your son is not mature or that the other way will make your son more mature.
My son is a guy of few words unlike his Dad. He has had an amazing time at college and that didn't depend on BB or the coaches. Last year was a tough time for him in BB but he has had to deal with it.
He actually pays for almost the total cost of his education through scholarships and part time work. This semster is going to be his toughest as he stacked his toughest classes for the fall. He misses so many classes in the spring that he decided to load the fall up. Totally his choice. He just warned us that he may not have time to work as much as the last 3 years. Very mature .

This is a very good subject as my son has entered his senior year with no offers. He has received calls from maybe three coaches, only one was head coach. Of the three only one may still be interested. I have let my son do all the talking, what little he does say as he is one of few words, does not seem to like to chit chat. This a BB player who has done just about everything, Area Code, on down. Last coach e-mailed him as he was not making contact on cell phone. He inquired if he was interested in their program and what other schools were looking at him. He only answered the other schools question. Son's only requirement of any school was D1, good competition and have a stadium.

Would it be prudent to e-mail coach and give him a little insight into son, not about his BB skills, as this coach has seen him in person play?

Many of the sons mentioned in this post have busy academic/work/sports issues. My son has none, doesn't work, has no intention of working, has a full time girlfriend and enjoys his X box time. You see the picture here.

We have a strained relationship, he doesn't take any of my advice, mother is not helping in recruitment, I have done all the legwork. My frustration is his lack of work ethic, he has so much natural talent I hate to see him squander it.

Popuphitter dad,

I can feel your frustration.Your son needs to be the one motivated and if he keeps showing lack of interest the coaches will stop calling.
When we were going through this whole recruiting thing I seemed to do most if not all of the general setting up a bio sheet etc putting stuff together. My son would contact the coaches.My son did not talk much either.
As far as maturity we have noticed a huge amt. when in May when he graduated, we had told him the whole semester that he needed to work. he put it off and we told him no more allowance or fun money from us. Well a few baseball camps for little kids called him and he worked them, he then worked another week long residential camp, he began having to spend all his own money for any entertainment etc.He now works every Saturday filming for pop warner and is making good money. He didnt even blink an eye when he was asked to do it because he knows if he wants money he needs to work in the summer. We dont expect him to work while he is in college and doing baseball, he is gone early for weights and doesnt walk in the door until late. I guess what I am trying to say is if your relationship is strained back off and let it go. If he doesnt get any offers then maybe a JC is in order. At some point they have to step up, the more you and your wife stop doing for him the more he will start doing for himself. Its a hard adjustment esp. for the mohter.
We have never had an issue with work ethic with school or baseball, he is motivated there because baseball is so important to him. We cant push that he does that all on his own.
sometimes the more naturally gifted players (Not necessarily saying this is your son) but a lot of them never had to work so its a new concept to work hard at something. My son has always had to work hard to keep up with the naturally gifted athletes. I am kind of glad now that it was this way. because he fights hard for everything and has made huge strides if not passed up many of the players that were way ahead of him 3- 4 years ago.
Your son will have to step it up when he gets on the collegiate field. Even at a JC there are a lot of good players and some D1 guys that left their schools to go to JCS so it is not a walk inthe park either. It will be up to your son if he really wants this, I know its frustrating,but the more you back off trust me he will start taking ownership. good luck. I pray that you and your wife can get on the same page with all of it. All of your relationships are way more important than the baseball.I wanted my son to attend schools that liked him and he didnt want to go.It became tense around here also last year. I finally stopped talking about it, watched the schools go by the wayside and he is at a JC but it was his choice and hes happy and our house is peaceful and fun again.There is no tension and we have let him make his own decisions as hard as they were. His HS coach told me that This is one of the first and hardest decisions our young people make and encouraged me to be suuportive. He was right. Our relationship is much better as I have let him start growing up.Good luck, I hope it all works out.

If my son was like that I wouldn't do a thing for him. The likely hood of him succeeding at D1 and JC and slim to nil unless he changes.
I would tell him the facts of life and dump the whole thing in his lap. Obviously the coaches have pick up on his attitude.
I have a great relationship with all my kids. My son is as stubborn as can be. I explein thinks to him and don't expect an answer. If I tell him he has mechanic problems he can get irritated but the next time he hits the mound I see him work on what I told him. The last 2 years he has been much more talkative and asks for help. I make sure he understands that I help because he has done all the things I expected of him and more. I have no problem helping someone who helps themselves. Mt wife and I have never spoiled any of our kids.
Recruiting was a team effort and I was in a better position to do the contacting. Trust me if I sensed coaches resenting that I would have stopped. Fact is it was so much fun I wish I had another BB player to do it for.
I got things donr quickly and professionally. We had a lot more to deal with than the US parents and players.

quote:

The likely hood of him succeeding at D1 and JC and slim to nil unless he changes.

I respectfully disagree. Participating in a D1 or JC program may be the very thing that does change him!

That may be true in some cases but he probaly won't get the chance. Why should a coach take a 19yo kid who has shown no work ethic as opposed to a kid who workd his tail off. There has to be some reward for kids who demonstarte hard work and maturity.
There are people who change but a college coach is not there to reform players.

Again the issue will come down to the player. If he gets a chance to play at college anywhere it is hard work. There are a lot of good players that all work hard. He will either step up or he wont last.Any player is in the same boat if they are not use to working hard.

Pop Up Hitter dad, it is never too late, but the path may be harder for some than others. Without grades, coaches will have a hard time getting your son into a four year school, the JC route does not look at grades as much as the 4yr school but the coach still needs to know that your son will be eligible when the time comes, it is up to your son, hopefully with some help from the parents, but it really is up to him.

Obviously your son has skills or he would not have gotten any interest from the beginning nor would he have received the interest from the scouts to invite him to the Area Codes, the scouts do not have the same grade interest, in fact they may have more interest than the schools at this time due to his grades, but he will not have much leverage when talking about draft number or signing bonus unless he is just a must have player.

But it goes back to the bottom line, your son needs to figure it out for himself, does he want to put the time into what is in front of him, weather it be school or playing the game. Playing and going to school is challenging in college, but the minor league system is not built for development and the player next to him really is there to take his job, so he will have to motivate himself to keep his “job”.

BTW- if your son is asked the question, do you have interest in his school, it would be advisable to answer the question if you want to keep their interest.

I agree with most stated here, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.
I beleive in helping and supporting through the process but if my son showed no effort, sat around with GF and played Xbox while not trying to improve so that he would get calls and offers, I'd bow out also.
Unfortunetly some kids who think they have natural talent take the layback attitude, I don't have to do anything to get a scholarship because I have talent, and coaches see that right away. No coach wants any player with that attitude. I have seen a coach take a less talented player over a more talented one because of work ethic and desire.
I'd have a little tough love talk with your son, tell him if he wants to go to college and play baseball, these are the things that HE has to do. You won't be there to push him after he leaves. You've done enough. And this is about what he wants, not you.
JMO.

Thank you very much for being honest. You are not alone with what you are dealing with. IMO what you are going to have to do is tell your son to get off his butt and take charge of his situation or continue to do what he is doing and be left with no options in a few months. As long as he believes that you will step up and take care of it for him he will have no incentive to do his part.

I had a very talented player that eventually moved in with me because of a tough family situation. He was the most talented player I have ever coached. But he was lazy. He lived off his talent. He had no work ethic and he just flew by the seat of his pants in everything he did , school work included. When he moved in he took no responsibility for his room or clothes. He stayed up late and played PS-2 and watch videos. Etc etc etc. I stepped in and put his butt to work. He had to clean his room everyday. He had to be in bed by 11pm. He had to work in our yard every weekend. I made him get up early before school and clean his room etc etc.

What I saw was a total transformation in a few weeks. Pretty soon he was doing things on his own without me having to say anything. He started a couple of projects in the yard one included a long ditch that he dug to help with drainage near our driveway. He and my son dug a 300' ditch that was 3 feet wide and 2 feet deep. He went everyday with my son after school and worked out in the off season and learned how to manage his time.

He was drafted by the Rays and was named Appy League pitcher of the week a couple of weeks ago. He is doing great and I am very proud of him. You can learn a work ethic but someone has got lay down some ground rules and kick them in the a** sometimes.

I would give your son some tough love bigtime. Forget the baseball he is going to need to develop a work ethic and drive to win in life. Good luck.

Coach May, I would use your advice if his mother would support me. He goes to her now for all his wants. All that happens to me is if I try to put my foot down is she undermines it or sits by with no comment. You see in her mind I'm a grump, don't praise son enough and say no too much. And we get into a fight about it.

Her way is to give him everything and he gets lazier. I have questioned his commitment to baseball, he comes back with you must be "retarded". Today he played ball, got home and right to the X box live.

I am taking my hands off the wheel as Bobblehead suggested. He will have to learn the hard way. I won't sign him up to retake the SAT, etc. Looks like he better get used to saying "Do you want fries with your order?.

I really enjoy reading what other opinions there are out there. At least I no longer feel alone in this. The folks on this site are great, I really enjoy listening to the current ballplayers who have the motivation to share their experiences and hopes.

PopUpHitter, one thing that you might want to do is take some unoffical visits early, many colleges are just about to start fall workouts and the JC's should be there as well. You can have your son see what college baseball is all about and that might motivate and challenge him into getting it into gear.

As you know, you and your wife need to be on the same page in order to effectively help your son.

Good suggestion Homerun04, better yet have mom go with son to visit, that might change things.

If my son made those comments he's be in big trouble. Even if he was thinking it (which I am sure he might have at times), respect begins at home, he's be in big trouble.

Nothing wrong with the xbox, as long as it goes on after he has taken care of his business, which would be homework and at this time getting letters out to coaches. I'd rather mine be home with xbox than out carousing around.

Your son has time yet, until next summer. Maybe when he hears of others getting opportunities he'll help in the process and so will mom. My husband and I didn't always agree, but it was son who did what he had to do and that's what made the difference and usually does.

Best of luck.

Homerun, very good idea to visit the JCs, I will suggest it to him. Over here there are some good programs not too far from home to check out. Over here they are called Community Colleges, I hope these are the same as JCs?

TPM, lack of respect from son is very evident even in front of others in the family. I really am at a loss as to how I lost it with him. I have always been there for my kids, don't smoke or drink and have been holding up my end of the marriage. Fortunately I have daughters too and they are more respectful. I really appreciate all your advice, we do have some time left to go.

Yeah, JC-JUCO-Community College, all the same for 2 year schools, but also visit some 4 year schools to help set goals for the future.

Make appointments with the coaches and let them know you are coming and would like to talk to them about their program and the what the college has to offer.

They are the same.

Good Luck!

Pop up hitter my son sign with a juco 1/15 of his senior year. But then was offered by 4 d-1 schools and did not sign till july 24th of his senior year. Might point is it is never too late I would visit juco,s for sure show him how hard those boy,s work.

Most teenage boys show little respect. You have to set some rules and learn to not over react. Talk with your son and explain what he has to do to get to college. Even JC coaches do not want a kid they see as a potential problem. They can be like a cancer on a ball club.
Coach May had some great comments and it is really team work that a parent and player must develop to get to college. Talent alone will not get it done in most cases. There are thousands of BB players trying to do what he seems to think is his birth right.
I agree the Xbox is not a problem as long as your son gets his business taken care of. Do not complain about the Xbox but show an interest in it. I used to watch my son and his fiends play it on the big screen and we had a blast. I feel Xbox and other games are great for coordination and timing. I have bought several system for my son and daughters and they really enjoy it. Games make a nice gift on special occasions. If you call my son at college you can usually hear the guys and GF playing games in the background.
The Xbox could be a good way to get to know your son. I would talk to your wife and try to stay non confrontatioanl. I like the idea of getting her involved so she can see the magnitide of the challenge of getting your son to the college level. Its not just about talent.

Folks, I really like the idea of mom going on these visits, now all I've got to do is make it seem like her idea. Maybe I can get son to suggest it.

X-box is no big deal now, like a poster said "at least I know where they are". Great thought, and with x box live they can play each other without driving over!

Things are going much better now that I've let go.

I will let you all know what happens.

Popup

quote:

Things are going much better now that I've let go.

Pop Up Hitter dad,

I'm really glad to hear that! You have received some very good advice in this thread, which also applies to many of the HS Baseball Web parents. Think of it...most of us are here on this site, in these forums, because we want to help our sons realize their dreams. Getting to "the next level" can be a difficult path, and we want to help them avoid mistakes. But sometimes we make mistakes by trying too hard to help.

When I was reading about the difficulty you have had with your son showing disrespect, to be honest I was thankful that neither of my sons (now 20 and 22) have ever spoken disrespectfully to me or their dad. However, I admit that I have been a fairly "involved" parent in the past 5 years or so, as each of them reached that age where some of the decisions they made would have a longer term impact. And I know that occasionally I have been "over-involved". And that has caused some irritation or resistance by my sons, each of them (though it has seemed to last only for short periods of time). Though they have not spoken to me unkindly, I know that at least a few times, each of them has wished I would quit asking them questions and giving them advice...and maybe hoped I would leave the room...and that I would perhaps take a month-long cruise to Alaska with no cell phone. The times when I recognized them feeling that way, and decided to back off and let them find their own answers (even if they stumbled), backing off for a week or two always seemed to help - no matter how hard it was to keep from bringing up whatever topic had caused the tension, whether that was baseball or academics. They are both very independent now, and I don't find myself seeing a need, or an opportunity, to give much advice.

Best wishes to you and your son. It sounds like you will work things out just fine.

Julie

I got a kick out of Julie's post, I can definetly relate as I am sure that we all can.
Sometimes as good meaning parents we need to step back and take a look at the situation, sometimes it's not our kids being lazy, but not meeting expectations that we want, even maybe more than they do.

If my son ever talked to me like you describe he would have had a problem playing ball or simply walking --- I think you get my drift---if a boy does not respect his own father how does he talk to other authority figures in his life like coaches, teachers, police etc.

quote:

I really enjoy reading what other opinions there are out there. At least I no longer feel alone in this.

Nope, you are definitely not alone and I thank you for your honesty as I am sure there are many who read on the HSBBW who have the same issues and are looking for advice/ideas as well. Perhaps your post and the advice you receieve will help others as they read along.

In my eyes, it really has to be 100% the player's dream when it comes to going to the next level.

Doesnt matter how talented or much natural ability one has, they have to want it like no other because they will have to back up that want with dedication/time/effort that one can't " fake ".

Sometimes I feel its more of the parent's role to educate the kids about the consequences of their decisons and then they need to stand back & let the kids figure out which way they want to go.

As sad and hard as it would be to watch talent go wasted, sometimes that is reality. Sometimes one has to loose something in order to realize how much they wanted it. Hard lesson to learn, a hard one to come back from, and even harder on the parent watching it happen.

I wish you all the best!
Many times all a kid needs is a little boost and encouragement, but again,..bottom line,..it has to be their dream.
Glad to have you on board the HSBBW!
I second the vote to take mom along on the JUCO/college visits!

I would just like to remind the parents on this board about all the helpful info that is located on the main website. I used a lot of the questions that I found here. I made 2 lists - 1 for son and 1 for the parents. Coaches commented all the time how well prepared he was. He made copies of the list for every school he was interested in. Sometimes added certain questions for a particular school, for example he might have been concerned with indoor practice facilities depending on where school was located, etc.

Anyway, it was easy then to go back and look at notes and see what he liked or disliked about each school.

Parent list was saved for official visit or in-home visit.

In determining how much to help son and whose dream it is, I would look at his actions on the field in both practice and games.

At home, I wouldn't call my son a go-getter. Like most senior boys, he developed a little attitude and liked to sleep too much, but I still helped him a lot. Now, he fielded and made the phone calls with coaches and made the final decisions, but I helped with the research and the profile and the letters etc. I think with a lot of it he was uncertain what to do and a little scared. But on the field there was not a kid on his team that worked harder (for that his team voted him as captain and team MVP). He always wanted to hit one more time, throw a little more etc. He was the one motivating the others to meet him to hit or to stay a little longer etc. He had a great year and many told us through high school that he had the talent to go to the next level. He was trying to play well and finish school strong - I had the time to help. And even though he wanted to play college ball and had the talent, I am not sure he would have gotten it done without help (he is playing at a mid-level DI). No matter how your son acts at home (not to say those issues don't need to be dealt with) if he is a hard worker on the field and has talent, I would say help him. He will grow up one day and thank you and besides it gets him out of the house .

My son has thanked me several times and credits me with the amount of scholarship he received.
It is so important to help and I was asked to do it.
My son also is a sleeper. I don't get on his case if he is doing the things he has to do. I never had to ask him to do his home wrk or lectute him on what he had to do. If his marks slipped a bit I didn't get on his case because I knew he would do what he had to do.

TRhit,

I can relate to your statement, my dad in the old days would woop me big time if I talked to him that way. My son is too big and his momma would stand between us, and we don't want to go to jail.

I read an article about a process that colleges use to bypass the usual admission process for kids with weak scores and GPA. I believe its used more for football recruits, its call "special admission". Has anyone heard of this in college baseball? As you know Pop up's son is below the normal D1 admission threshold, was wondering if this could happen to him.

My son attended a Junior Day at a D1 school with an average SAT score of 1150-1200 for incoming freshmen. During the Q&A time, a parent asked about the average SAT score for baseball players. The recruiting coordinator said it's around 1000, with many players scoring in the 900's. Obviously, the players' test scores/GPA have to be high enough to be certified by the NCAA, but this school definitely has some flexibility with its admissions standards and I would imagine others do too.

Parents should be involved in the recruiting process but they also need to know when to pull back. Some parents want to be everything like write letters and emails when the kid should do it with the help of the parents.

Can you believe it, Pop up's son got an official visit invite to a JC out of state. I'm new at this whole process, how does one get reimbursed for travel expenses and how many parents do they allow?

There are even two local kids who used to play on my sons LL team way back that are going there now so I have two local sources to give us perspective. The only drawback is school is too far to watch his games.

Is it better to go and watch a practice or a game?