Pete Rose In The Hall Of Fame???

IMO He should be banned from the game but enshrined as a hall of famer.

Why banned?... He gambled on baseball while being in a position to impact the game.

Why in Hall of Fame?... He has more hits than anyone else that played the game. Isn't that enough all by itself?

Rose should never get a plaque in the HOF, his numbers are posted there and that is enough for me. I do, however, find it funny all the people who say Rose should be inducted into the Hall Of fame. Rose was a masterful hitter and without a doubt one of the greatest to ever play but, Major League Baseball has a clause about character, which Rose lacks completely. He has been contrite and steadfast with his denials of betting on the game. When he did finally admit he bet on games (albeit half-heartedly), he still has not admitted to betting on games the team he was managing were involved in. MLB has shown him the evidence they have, yet he still denies it.
Hopefully pariahs like Bonds, Rose, McGwire, Clemens and many more unmentioned will never receive a plaque. There "accomplishments" will be marked, but their "bust" will never find a place in the Hall.

Yes he should be in the Hall. I wouldn't even bring up the character clause either. Plenty of players without character. I'm sure many in the hall as well. Press did not report on players then like they do now.

My question is why do guys like Steve Howe get 8 separate lifetime suspensions (for drug use) and continue to be allowed back into the game, but Rose gets one and it is so sacrosanct that it can never be revisited? I would think that setting an example for youth and baseball regarding drug use is at least as important as the gambling issue.

Also, didn't Rose gamble while he was a manager and not a player? Ban him as a manager, but not a player. Either way, he should be in IMHO.

I have been the the Hall. They have a Pete Rose display there with his uni, shoes, bat, helmet, etc... including a life size cardboard cut out of him. They talk about the record as part of the display. Seems a little hypocritical to allow all his stuff into the Hall, but not him.

Pete Rose should absolutely be in the Hall of Fame. Isn't the Hall a way of honoring a player's on-the-field accomplishments? Though I think Rose lacks in the character department, he is without a doubt one of the best to ever play. He didn't do anything illegal to "boost" his performance like the steroid-users of today's game. Everything he did as a player was a reflection of his abilities, not some drug.

quote:

Originally posted by MDdon2011:
Pete Rose should absolutely be in the Hall of Fame. Isn't the Hall a way of honoring a player's on-the-field accomplishments? Though I think Rose lacks in the character department, he is without a doubt one of the best to ever play. He didn't do anything illegal to "boost" his performance like the steroid-users of today's game. Everything he did as a player was a reflection of his abilities, not some drug.

One of the requirements for voting for the Hall Of Fame: Voting shall be based upon the player's record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship, character, and contributions to the team(s) on which the player played.

I'd be willing to bet that the voting committee bases less than 10% of their decision on a players character and integrity.

PG has this correct

i believe his accomplishments are worthy of him voted in.
i also feel he was less than truthful about his gambling, but should have been given a second chance. we would want one, wouldn;t we?

As much as I dislike Rose's arrogance towards the gambling issue, at some point I would like to see him in the HOF. A fitting solution would be after his death.

Shoeless Joe...yes, he should get in also.

Bonds,Clemens and the "better baseball through chemistry" group presents a tougher question. Ultimately, they will probably get in even if most purists disapprove.

There are plenty of HOF memebers who have character issues ---

quote:

Originally posted by MDdon2011:
I'd be willing to bet that the voting committee bases less than 10% of their decision on a players character and integrity.

I'm not sure that I agree with this statement for two reasons.

1. I've heard writers state they won't vote anyone in from the "steroid era." They used the word "anyone" as if they wouldn't even consider individual cases. Guess this is why Ripken and Gwynn weren't 100% votes.

2. Wasn't Jim Rice one that was considered to be left out over the years because he wasn't that friendly to the media?

I'm no expert, but these are the things I thought about when I read that statement.

It's a tough question....Rose was my favorite player growing up.

Early on, I felt like many do. Let his performance on the field be the judge. He paid his debt to society on the tax issues, and the gambling well, lots of people gamble. It is a known addition much like drugs and alcohol. A character flaw yes, but what does it have to do with being the hit king and a world champion?

My problem is he lied, numerous times. His arrogance is legendary. If he would have just come clean from the start, I think he would have been forgiven and may even already been enshrined. But his lyin and denyin always did him in. Additionally, he only seemed to be sorry right around the times he had a book coming out.

As a manager, if he made on-field decisions to appease the leg-breakers then no, he can never go in.

But, if it is all about character and integrity, when is Ty Cobb's plaque coming down?

If it is all about character and integrity, when are Maris and Munson going in?

It's a complicated issue to be sure. My guess is, it won't happen until he is long gone.

I'll never forget when Me and YounggunMom (lol) first got married and one of our favorite hobbies to do together before rugrat came along was collect baseball cards, get autographs, and go to card shows on the weekends.

As odd as it may be (looking back now) the 2 that we got were:

1 - Mark McGwire (year after his 1985 Team USA debut) on a baseball. Still have his Rookie card whatever that may be worth nowawdays!

2- Pete Rose (on a Wheatie box and baseball) Strange thing about this was while he was signing our items he was watching 3 small tv's on his table that had sports on them and would not look up at us as he signed)

I still thought Pete Rose was Mr. Baseball spite his rudeness and ignorancy.

I guess we could've gone for the trifecta and gotten a Raphael Palmeiro or Jose Conseco autograph, huh? LOL

I think the whole gist of the Rose arguement is not confusing character flaws or integrity issues with what Pete rose did when he violated Baseball's most sacred law--DO NOT EVER GAMBLE ON BASEBALL if you want to be involved in the sport. He was one of my favorite players as a teen but he turned out to be the only guy in the last 80 years who was dumb enough, arrogant enough, and selfish enough to spit in all the fans faces who just ask for one thing from professional baseball games--that they be on the level. Even having said that, I might could forgive him if he had showed one shred of remorse but with him its still always about the money. The Hall doesn't mean enough to him to change the way he lives so why should I care about whether he gets in while he's alive. America loves to tear its heroes down and then build them back up but this guys so selfish and dumb he doesn't realize that he would already be in the Hall if he had just admitted his mistake in the beginning and showed just a tiny bit of true remorse. Pete Rose signed the lifetime ban so until his life is over it ought to stand. And please stop arguing that everyone gambles. Baseball doesn't have rules against betting on horse racing, dog racing, or poker playing. If a player wants to go play blackjack or shoot craps in Vegas baseball says knock youself out. But there is one rule that has been posted in every Major League clubhouse for decades and that is quite simply--Don't bet on baseball or there will be consequences.

Good points Three Bagger.

A lot of this gets back to how people feel about crime and punishment in the USA. Some feel Rose has been punished now move on. PG's solution is to split the baby. The hardline solution was recently espoused by Fay Vincent where he said they are using Rose's case for the deterrent effect. If one of the greatest players who ever played can be banned, then don't ever, ever bet. Just ask Shoeless Joe.

It's not about integrity, character or what he did on the baseball field.

It's about integrity, character AND what he did on the baseball field. He comes up short on 2 out of 3.

Is he the only one? No. Will he be the last one? No. Are there others not in the hall of fame for thier mistakes? Yes. Are there some in the hall of fame despite their mistakes? Yes.

The Hall of Fame should only enshrine the best, the players that represent the best in integrity, character, and also put up great numbers.

That's just my 2 cents,

CWM

Many of Pete's accomplishments are enshrined in the HOF already.

There can be lots of debates about character issues, steroids, drinking, etc.

Forever and a day the NUMBER ONE rule in baseball is you SHALL NOT bet on the game. It is posted in every single clubhouse.

Pete knew the rule, broke the rule, lied about breaking the rule, who still knows what the truth is.

But, if they want to ignore this, their own number one rule then what is the point any more.

I just don't even know where to start.....

Really, has any single player had more impact on baseball as a whole (yes in a negative, but I am talking about the positive)? Simply put, all of us on here, if you could have your kid grow up to be any "type" of ballplayer wouldn't Rose be the one that comes to mind? I watched the Sportscentury on him for about the zillioneth time the other morning and it makes me laugh, but also sad, at the way the game is played today.

Did he mess up? Sure he did. Maybe I am an idiot, but I think cheating on your wife is a lot bigger of an integrity/character flaw than betting on baseball. And probably 90%, including Rose, did this.

Vick got a second chance despite his acts-Stallworth will probably be let back in.

Rose should be in the HOF.

Rose will get into the Hall of Fame. And rightfully so. He set a bunch of records.

But he wont get in until he has passed on.

He directly attacked the integrity of the game.
Just like the Steroid abusing cheaters did.

Getting in trouble off the field wont get you banned. If that was the case - The Hall of Fame would be half empty.

Attacking the integrity of the game - altering outcomes of the game - that will get you banned.

Rose bet on Baseball games - when he was a manager. He even bet on games he was managing. He got caught. Red-handed. He's done until he is buried.

The steroid junkies like Bonds and McGwire and Sosa and the rest of these bums altered the game. They obtained drugs illegally - and used them to alter their performance and the game. They got caught red-handed. They are done - until they are buried.

I am glad that baseball wont budge on Rose. And I hope they dont budge on the steroid junkies. It instills faith in me that some people still care about the game.

I voted yep!

Agree totally with PG!!

No way Rose belongs.