Skip to main content

14 replies

Pitcher - Hook in his motion

S sportsfan5100+ posts
My son, 15 end of March, was told by the trainer we take him to that he has developed a hook in his motion. My understanding of this is that as his arm motion goes back (RH) instead of his hand going directly towards the 2nd base bag, his wrist is slightly bent and his fingers are pointed more towards the position of the 2nd baseman (or further towards 1st) rather than the bag itself.

I've never noticed him doing this before but once it was pointed out to both of us, he did make the correction. My problem is that since that night, I've really watched every pitch he has made and occasionally he will fall back into the same situation.

The trainer made the comment that night that if he is scouting a kid and sees this, his boss has said that he doesn't have to look any further. He basically is saying that they will not recruit a kid that has a pronounced hook.....The kid throws hard now, was clocked last Sept at 85, and still has a lot of growing to do. I know nothing is guaranteed, but at this point we feel he could increase his speed even more and have a chance at playing after HS.

I guess my question is, do most scouts and experts have the same opinion of a pitcher who has a hook? And if so, are there any exercises, routines, etc. that might help him eliminate this problem?

I was looking at another site, InsidePitching.com and noticed a picture of a LHP in an article under "Pitcher Specific vs Movement Specific" who has his wrist bent much like what my son's trainer is telling him NOT to do......

Thanks,
Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

T thepainguy1,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by sportsfan5:
My son, 15 end of March, was told by the trainer we take him to that he has developed a hook in his motion...I guess my question is, do most scouts and experts have the same opinion of a pitcher who has a hook? And if so, are there any exercises, routines, etc. that might help him eliminate this problem?


I would much prefer a guy with no hook over a guy with a hook, because I think a hook does make it harder for a guy to be good (because it implies tension in the wrist and forearm which can create problems).

However, Barry Zito has a huge hook in his wrist and he has been effective.



I guess the bottom line is that it's best to eliminate it if you can, but it isn't universally bad.

In terms of eliminating a hook, the first thing I would do is just try to keep the wrist loose. I also like RHPs to show the ball to 3B relatively sooner in the arm swing, which can help.
Last edited by thepainguy
S sportsfan5100+ posts
thepainguy - I'm assuming you know much more about this than I do.....what exactly about this motion causes stress in the arm? Specifically in the elbow is what I was told?

I've noticed that his hook is much like what your picture of Zito shows. It is low in his back motion but usually when it happens, by the time his arm motion reaches horizontal it's back where I feel it should be. I realize that this motion doesn't affect his FB and was told that it mainly affects secondary pitches. But if it is straightened out early in the motion (before or at the horizontal position) does it still create stress?

I agree that this is something we need to eliminate if at all possible; I'm just trying to get a better understanding of all the variables.

Thanks for you help,
T thepainguy1,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by sportsfan5:
thepainguy - I'm assuming you know much more about this than I do.....what exactly about this motion causes stress in the arm? Specifically in the elbow is what I was told?


I'm not convinced that a hook will necessarily cause elbow problems. I'm more worried about it from the standpoint of control and velocity problems. Tension in the wrist may cause both of those.


quote:
Originally posted by sportsfan5:
But if it is straightened out early in the motion (before or at the horizontal position) does it still create stress?


It's really impossible to say, but I wouldn't be surprised if some residual tension is still there.
deemaxdeemax500+ posts
quote:
My son, 15 end of March, was told by the trainer we take him to that he has developed a hook in his motion. My understanding of this is that as his arm motion goes back (RH) instead of his hand going directly towards the 2nd base bag, his wrist is slightly bent and his fingers are pointed more towards the position of the 2nd baseman (or further towards 1st) rather than the bag itself.




Its highly possible that this trainer knows nothing. It is more dangerous to force yourself out of a position that your body knows then to do what your muscle memory is already used to. I have seen many different arm strokes, and many different armstrokes succeed at a high level. Point being, find someone who will work with his arm stroke rather then change it into something that is more familiar to them (the guru). Sutcliffe hooks it back toward the catcher......extreme end of hooking.
This is NOT a mechanical fault, just his style...
Last edited by deemax
S sportsfan5100+ posts
I have several concerns with this.

1. If what you say is true "it is not a mechanical fault, just his style" then why would our trainer/pro scout make a comment about not being at all interested in a guy with a hook no matter how hard he throws and has been told by his director of scouting to walk away from this style?

2. His velocity & body style will get him a lot of looks and interest, but if this hook is as bad as our trainer has said, he might not get the second look.

3. I don't want him to continue doing something that might cause an injury or inability to develop a strong 2nd & 3rd pitch down the road.

4. Do all scouts view this the same way or are the scouts in his organization just too hung up on this for some reason?

Deemax - I truly believe that this guy does know what he is talking about and the higher ups in the organization he works for have made a point of telling him to staying away from pitchers with this quirk in their motion......right or wrong, it is their stance.

Again, I am no expert (just a parent) and that’s why I am asking these questions. Like some of you have pointed out, there are currently and have been in the past some very successful pro’s who have had this same flaw/style in their motion. Do I just let it be or do I make a point of constantly reminding him to try to eliminate it? And if I do emphasize changing his motion, am I going to cause him to change something else that might hurt him in the long run.........pitchers are a real pain in the A$$ sometimes.
deemaxdeemax500+ posts
quote:
1. If what you say is true "it is not a mechanical fault, just his style" then why would our trainer/pro scout make a comment about not being at all interested in a guy with a hook no matter how hard he throws and has been told by his director of scouting to walk away from this style?

2. His velocity & body style will get him a lot of looks and interest, but if this hook is as bad as our trainer has said, he might not get the second look.

3. I don't want him to continue doing something that might cause an injury or inability to develop a strong 2nd & 3rd pitch down the road.

4. Do all scouts view this the same way or are the scouts in his organization just too hung up on this for some reason?


1. If what the trainer is saying is true then how can he account for all the success pitchers have had that use this style, not right or wrong, just style. Is it safe to say your trainer wounld'nt be at all interested in Zito or Sutcliffe.

2. If your son can pitch, he will get a lot of second looks. If a scout leaves a game just because he sees a pitchers wrist hook, then he is a poor scout...

3. If your trainer can name someone who has expierienced any type of arm pain from hooking I would love to hear about them. Zito is a good reference to this because he has never missed a start.

4. Absolutly not. Each organization will have something different they like to hang their hat on, but they definetly vary from club to club.

If you need more proof of pitchers that hook that have had great careers, let me now. Im sure there are a million photos out there. Good luck sportfan5 to you and your kid....
T thepainguy1,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by sportsfan5:
1. If what you say is true "it is not a mechanical fault, just his style" then why would our trainer/pro scout make a comment about not being at all interested in a guy with a hook no matter how hard he throws and has been told by his director of scouting to walk away from this style?


Some scouts have very strong preferences and opinions, not all of which are based in fact.


quote:
Originally posted by sportsfan5:
2. His velocity & body style will get him a lot of looks and interest, but if this hook is as bad as our trainer has said, he might not get the second look.


He will if he's effective.

I don't know many guys who would rule a guy out just because of a hook.


quote:
Originally posted by sportsfan5:
3. I don't want him to continue doing something that might cause an injury or inability to develop a strong 2nd & 3rd pitch down the road.


I would try to get rid of, or reduce, it. However, it's not as bad as something like a really bad head jerk (and hints of control problems).


quote:
Originally posted by sportsfan5:
4. Do all scouts view this the same way or are the scouts in his organization just too hung up on this for some reason?


No.

This guy probably had an experience with a guy (or two) who had a bad hook and never made it. I'm not convinced the that two are related (but would still try to get rid of it).
Last edited by thepainguy
T TonickMember
The reason they say it would take away from velocity is because his forearm is flexed. Tell your son to loosen or relax from his elbow down. The more relaxed you are the harder you will be able to throw. Would a scout cross him off the list for a minor mechanical flaw? I seriously doubt it. If a kid can play and throw the ball with results that meet thier standards they will take him, even if they will have to make adjustments later.

Add Reply

Post
High Level Throwing

Driveline Baseball

Membership Required

We're sorry. You must be signed in to continue. Sign In or Register
×
Are you sure you want to remove from your Block List?
×
Loading...
×
When you block a person, they can no longer invite you to a private message or post to your profile wall. Replies and comments they make will be collapsed/hidden by default. Finally, you'll never receive email notifications about content they create or likes they designate for your content.
Note: if you proceed, you will no longer be following .
×
Advanced Search
Advanced Search
Link copied to your clipboard.
×