Playing time vs playing Varsity

Yes, there's obviously the positive of making the V team vs JV...however, our story from last year...my son was a 9th grader (been on JV since 7th grade)...there was also an 8th grader (man child, held back in elementary school, actually older than my son)...both started the season on JV...my son got pulled up for a spring game and got the start on the mound, and then got pulled up when the JV season was over and got two innings in the playoffs as a 9th grader....

Other kid, stud catcher and will be the #1 V catcher as soon as his brother graduates next year, was pulled up about a week into the season when the backup catcher quit. I think he batted twice during the rest of the season and then otherwise was relegated to catching bullpens...it was, for practical purposes, a wasted season for him in regards to playing time...it didn't really make him better...

So, to end this rambling story...if a player is on the edge...either grade-wise, age-wise, or talent-wise, my vote would be to make the JV and play everyday (and get better), than to make the V and "ride the pine" for the season...just my $.02 worth.

Thanks for the response. I think in my sons case it was grade-wise. Atleast in his school, there is usually 0-2 sophs that make V. That is probably all subject to positions, and who's needed where. He was a JV starter as a Freshman. All will be ok I think, but really not sure how to take what it might mean.

Yep...could simply come down to numbers...we have 2 seniors, 11 juniors, 2 sophomores (my son is one), and 1 freshman on Varsity...however, there are 6 sophomores on the JV...simply wasn't anywhere to put them...not really sure where they will put them next year either!

Sorry, but I don't understand what the issue is here. Varisty primarily consists of Seniors and Juniors with maybe a couple talented sophomores and the rare freshman. Most Sophomores play JV.

By all appearances, the coaching staff believes they have the most talented kids on the varsity squad. So what is your concern?

I don't see what your problem is with my concern? If he's not "talented enough" as you say, so be it. Life will move on, and so will I. What is wrong with discussing it though? You don't have to partipate by the way.

Sorry, just had to say this after re-reading. He is a talented sophomore. You may doubt that if you want, does not matter to me.

quote:

Other kid, stud catcher and will be the #1 V catcher as soon as his brother graduates next year, was pulled up about a week into the season when the backup catcher quit. I think he batted twice during the rest of the season and then otherwise was relegated to catching bullpens...it was, for practical purposes, a wasted season for him in regards to playing time...it didn't really make him better...

Can't really agree with this statement although I will admit there is a chance it could be true. If a coach just pulls a kid up and all he does is catch pens and hardly takes BP then yes it was a wasted season but if the coach runs a good program then he should have gotten better based on the amount of quality reps he got in.

JV is good place to start to learn the game but reps with varsity is where you will get better in a quicker manner. Working with the starter on technique, catching guys who throw it harder, trying to throw out guys who are faster and seeing varsity BP will make him better if two things happen - the coach does it and the kid works at it. If either of them don't do it then yes it was a wasted season.

JV is there for a reason - guys just not ready for varsity or there isn't enough room on varsity for them. From the case you mentioned this catcher moved up because he was the next best choice. His job was back up catcher but it doesn't mean he sits around for 4 months doing nothing.

A good coach will run a practice that is fast paced at about the speed of a JV game. The quality of "competition" in a varsity practice is better than the competition of a JV game.

But like I said - if the coach doesn't run a good practice or the kid gripes, complains and moans about not playing then he won't get better.

I know of a situation where a sophmore who belonged on JV was brought up to varsity based on favoritism. The starter at that position who had hit over .300 as a sophmore the previous year then quit making this kid the starter, even though there was also a senior who "signed" with a D3 on the squad at the position. The kid hit well below the Mendoza line and was a liability defensively due to lack of arm strength despite good technique. More importantly his confidence as a hitter was crushed. He never hit over .200 and was replaced as a starter midway through his senior season. The kid had some talent and one never knows but I believe if he'd been allowed to play JV as a sophmore he'd have ended up being a good HS player as a junior and senior.

BaseballGr8,
It doesn't really matter if they are saying it to encourage the kid to accept his role or because they mean it and there's no way for anyone to know. The key is to make the best of the situation and use the playing time to continue to improve.

I have recently changed my tune on this a little. I used to be a guy that said the kids benefit most from the playing time on JV as opposed to limited PT/maybe a role player type on varsity.

However, I've kind of come around to the idea that maybe it's better for kids to be put in a situation where they aren't the best players on the field and they have to compete their tails off to earn every at bat or every inning. Some kids, if held back on JV, will just coast knowing that their talent will keep them on the field, rather than really seeing the long term approach where working harder now will pay off down the road.

It's the same idea as having kids push themselves in the classroom. A lot of smart freshmen could just take Math 9 and coast to an easy A, or they could take Algebra or Geometry and really push themselves and have to work hard to earn an A or B. Sure, they may take some lumps and struggle, but I think one of the most important "skills" in life is the ability to compete, and I think that's what you're teaching here.

Besides that, around here high school is only 20 games max plus playoffs, so even if a sophomore/freshman doesn't get much PT, they probably still have 50+ games to play throughout the summer/fall, so I really don't think they're going to regress.

Coach May makes some excellent points. The practice time with the varsity (and the speed of the varsity game) will be more valuable but only if the player uses it as a valuable experience. This also underscores the importance of a player playing for a good summer program. The experience of practicing with the Varsity should give the player an advantage when competing for playing time in a summer program compared to a similar player that played JV ball.

BTW, my step-son is a JV Freshman on his team. The speed of the game is different in Varsity ball.

quote:

Originally posted by BaseballGr8:
I know this has been discussed, but can't seem to find any threads. I just wanted to know others thoughts on this. Soph son did not make V team, coach wants him to get playing time on JV. Is this something coaches just tell a kid? (I'm not saying I believe that). Everything was very positive otherwise, tryouts went very well. Just looking for others thoughts/opinions.

If the coach wanted the player on varsity he would be on varsity. The statement means the player might be better than the last one or two old players on the bench (who may be dedicated senior, stuck with the program players) and wouldn't get any playing time if he were on varsity.

quote:

Other kid, stud catcher and will be the #1 V catcher as soon as his brother graduates next year, was pulled up about a week into the season when the backup catcher quit. I think he batted twice during the rest of the season and then otherwise was relegated to catching bullpens...it was, for practical purposes, a wasted season for him in regards to playing time...it didn't really make him better...

I disagree. If a kid is ready to play varsity but there isn't a position for him, the speed of JV ball isn't going to make him a better player. The speed of varsity practice is a better place for him. He's facing better velocity in scrimmages and BP. He's warming up pitchers with varsity movement and stuff. He can get his game reps in summer ball. Plus players can how to carry themselves like a varsity player by being around varsity players.

Every program is different and has different needs. Certainly playing time and team placement is based on ability, but more often based on who is ahead of you at your primary position. Some teams are stacked up with Sr’s and others are younger. It all depends on the number of kids coming through at each grade level and the number of kids above a player in a given program. Our program just moved a very talented Soph down to JV because he was just sitting on the bench behind a group of just as talented Sr’s & Jr’s who had more experience. Wherever you end up, just play hard and enjoy it, it really makes little difference where you play and playing time is much more important in the long run.

Thanks BOF, that is good to hear, especially when one is not sure what exactly to make of it. The coach had very positive things to say to my son, including how well he did at tryouts. I don't want to go into details of all he said but it was good. I honestly don't think he was bs'ing my son because I would see no reason for a coach to do that. He will play varsity, whether he's called up during the season, or it's next year. This is just what it is now.
Thanks everyone for the input.

quote:

Originally posted by scdigger:
...there was also an 8th grader (man child, held back in elementary school, actually older than my son)...

Other kid was pulled up about a week into the season

Does 8th grader playing varsity jeopardize his senior season eligibilty?

My son's coach was hired last year. One of the changes he made was that he has the V & JV practicing together everyday. I like the idea.

This gives him a daily look at a soph or junior on JV who may be developing quickly and allows him move him to V for a game rather seamlessly. It's not such a big deal for the player since he is with the varsity players regularly.

BaseballGr8, as long as your son is doing the best he can and progressing it doesn't really matter where he plays as a sophomore. Good luck.

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Does 8th grader playing varsity jeopardize his senior season eligibilty?[/QUOTE]

Only in certain states. Here in NJ it would jeopardize the senior year, while in NY that is not the case. Occasionally we get NY kids attending Parochial schools just over the boarder in NJ that have trouble with this. Check with the state organization for clarification.

quote:

Originally posted by Vicarious Dad:

quote:

Originally posted by scdigger:
...there was also an 8th grader (man child, held back in elementary school, actually older than my son)...

Other kid was pulled up about a week into the season

Does 8th grader playing varsity jeopardize his senior season eligibilty?

If you're wondering what the PA rule is, 1A classification programs can use middle school players without them running out of high school eligibility.

Non PIAA private schools can do what they want. Sean Coyle (Germantown Academy/UNC recruit) started on varsity as an 8th grader. I remember the uproar from upperclassmen parents like it was yesterday.

That kid better find out. It would be a shame if those two ABs cost the kid a whole year.

Between the coach and AD I'm sure they know whether they can do it or not. I realize it's not a given as to whether they know but I'm saying the odds are pretty good that they know if it hurts a player's eligibility.

But I've been wrong before.

BaseballGr8-
Does your son's high school program play in the summer and/or fall? And if so, was he invited to play with the Varsity for these games? Coaches want to see the kids in game situations. Are there other Frosh or Soph players up on varsity right now? Like other's have said, every school is different, and it depends on the talent level of the team. Roster size? Position needs? Coaches philosophy on underclassmen, etc...Good Luck to your son, tell him to Tear it Up on JV!

bsbl247 my son did participate in the fall program, in 9th & 10th. Only 1 soph made the Varsity team and is a pitcher. All is going to be fine, that I have no doubt. The coaches know him, and he knows what roll he will play for the team this year, and the following years.
I am looking forward for the season to start so I can be out there watching him and the team. I love baseball and especially watching HS baseball. I appreciate so many taking the time to answer my post. This website is awesome and I'm so glad to be a part of it. Thanks everyone!

Freshmen and sophomores shouldn't worry about being last cuts from varsity. They're on the radar screen. Their future is bright. My son felt badly for one of his friends. The friend will be one of two juniors on JV. All the kids he came through baseball with since LL and are still playing baseball are on varsity. There are four of them who have been close friends since LL. Three are on varsity

quote:

Originally posted by Strike 3:
Sorry, but I don't understand what the issue is here. Varisty primarily consists of Seniors and Juniors with maybe a couple talented sophomores and the rare freshman. Most Sophomores play JV.

By all appearances, the coaching staff believes they have the most talented kids on the varsity squad. So what is your concern?

I totally agree. My son didn't even make varsity until midway thru his junior year and by his senior year, he was an everyday player and one of the top run producers on the team and wound up batting 3rd on varsity. During his years, the varsity typically had 9-10 seniors on it and the jv teams carried 7-9 juniors. There was no room for juniors to play let alone sophomores. Freshman were in jr high so they had their own freshman team.

Of course after he graduated, over his last two years, 23 seniors graduated and 6 players quit going into their senior years. The following year, varsity was wide open for incoming sophs and jrs and there was one, maybe two seniors.

A lot of it is timing and even if you're a good player who got a late shot at varsity, there's no reason they couldn't play college ball if they wanted it that bad.

My son waited a long time and paid his dues and when he earned his starting spot on varsity, he made an immediate impact, especially with the bat and never at any time was overmatched or in over his head at the varsity level. Then there were sophomores who were handed the job and weren't ready for it and didn't put it together until senior year.

I don't get it when parents get upset or concerned that their freshman or sophomore don't make varsity. As the previous poster stated, varsity is typically juniors and seniors and sub-varsity for frosh and sophs. especially in large schoools where some teams count heavily on seniors because of experience.

There's nothing wrong with getting playing time on JV and polishing up the skills there. If a player is typically playing every inning down on JV, it's very likely that player will be a varsity starter and full time player in his junior or senior year.

It's the players who sit on the JV bench and can't crack a jv lineup that may not see much varsity action should they make it to their senior year and in some cases if they're juniors, they could get cut loose.

BBGr8: in my case every year or so is a different mish-mash of kids. This year I have 8 seniors, and they are all legit varsity players; not over the top outstanding but legit. I also have 6 legit juniors...The last two years I have only had 1 senior on the field most of the time.. So for the 2 or 3 real good sophs I have they are starting out on JV but I have told them there is no ceiling on them... sophomore year is very often one of great improvement...
I just say enjoy those games, no matter which field you are on (we all practice together, due to our facility and time factors)