Question about High School Rankings

In our area a couple of the area newspapers will rank schools. Like college football rankings they have preseason rankings and then have weekly rankings through the season.

Basically it is one man's opinion and doesn't really matter much.

ESPNRise , Easton , Maxpreps , Perfect Game , you name it , they all have rankings . But like I always say , rankings are like @@@holes , everybody has one . LOL !!!

As the guys above said they don't really matter. The rankings in KY are done by the coaches association and that's not a good way to do it. Head coaches are so busy they don't have time to research who is good or bad unless they play them. Plus how can you know how good a team is when they are 300 miles away?

One year we started out 10 - 0 and got up to 17th in the entire state. We lost our next two games and moved up to 15th. Rankings really don't matter.

Your coach is probably just using them as motivation or to let everyone know where you are in terms of where the other teams are.

That's funny, Tom. I agree. MaxPreps has us ranked 10th in FL Division 2. We are cruising in our district right now, but once we get out into the big bad world, it's going to be a whole new ball game.

The only rankings that matter are the index calculations used to determine district and state tournament seedings. These indexes are a calculation of winning and strength of schedule. Not all states use these indexes. Some do their seeding in a meeting with politics.

I don't like national rankings in high school sports. There's no way for them to be legit. The best way to the top is running up the score. Look up Yated High School basketball in Houston for an example.

I understand those who complain about rankings. I hate being involved in rankings myself, especially player rankings.

Some say (even here) that no one pays attention to the player rankings… If that were true I wouldn't hate doing them so much because they wouldn't matter. Some really have no idea how many decision makers follow those rankings to help identify players. They have no idea how much impact the rankings can have.

Those that are ranked highly do know because they see what happens as soon as they are ranked. We once saw an unknown (nationally) player from Kansas and ranked him in the top 50 in the country… Immediately we received many calls asking for more information about the player. There were 12 Scouting Directors and about 45 total scouts at his next game. He ended up being drafted in the second round. Agents/advisors must understand because we get lots of calls from them telling us why their client should be ranked higher. Why would they waste their time if nobody cared?

Many of the top colleges refer to the rankings regarding their recruits on their websites. Does anyone think they only look at the rankings "after" they recruit the player? Most of the top college coaches can tell you where the players they’re interested in are ranked by PG. It’s very obvious that they closely follow the underclass rankings as well. Whether one thinks early commitments are good or bad, it is obvious they have coincided with more identification and rankings of the top underclassmen.

I don’t think those who are ranked highly are the ones saying the rankings don’t mean anything.

Personally I think team rankings are more of a “fun” thing, that simply create interest. I don’t feel that team rankings have any serious importance regarding extreme accuracy. They don't have anywhere near the impact of player rankings.

So why do we do them?

Part of our mission statement is to “promote” the game of baseball at every level.

Rankings create lots of interest. High school baseball and summer baseball is covered more now than ever before. Never before have so many players been identified and recognized or teams mentioned nationally at nearly every amateur level.

This year we (PG) became the official ranking system for Junior College baseball. The goal is to promote JC baseball. JC baseball, NAIA, DII, DIII, all need more promotion. When DI baseball started to receive more national publicity, it greatly increased the popularity of DI baseball.

So while we strive to be as accurate as possible at something that is nearly impossible, that probably isn’t what is most important. Evaluating players is much easier than grading or ranking a high school team. High school baseball needs all the publicity it can get. Amateur baseball needs all the publicity it can get. Nothing we know of creates more interest and discussion than ranking players and teams.

Regarding preseason rankings, it’s pretty much a big guessing game. However, it is very obvious that it helps promote amateur baseball. The real thing happens on the field, but drawing attention to the game is a very good thing IMO. Even if it angers a few people who look at things more personally, it helps promote the game of baseball like never before.

Also, some rankings, actually most rankings, might be one man opinions. However, there are some 50 PG scouts who help compile our individual player rankings. However, the high school team rankings are pretty much a one man operation, but he isn't just pulling names out of a hat.

Are High School Team Rankings truly ever accurate? NO!

Do High School Team Rankings create interest? Absolutely!

quote:

I don’t think those who are ranked highly are the ones saying the rankings don’t mean anything.

PG, you know I'm a big supporter of what you guys do. 2B has been to several PG events, and will go to several more. But it is highly unlikely that he will ever be in your top player rankings. I'm sure those rankings mean something to those on the top rungs of the ladder, but to us, they are completely irrelevant, and I am still certain 2B will find a place to play at the next level. The coach that gets him will have done so because he saw him play (probably at a PG event), not because he's ranked 5999th. Or whatever.

But back to HS team rankings, yes, they are fun! One of our parents is sending out regular updates on our standings in the state on both MaxPrep and PrepZone.

National high school rankings are like BCS. Have a playoff, and we'll see who the best team really is.
Otherwise, it's just fluff.

I love when the out-gunned Florida, or California hs football team dis-mantles it's USA Today No.3-ranked crosstown rival.

2Bmom,

Sorry... It is really hard to explain things at times.

We receive calls every day about how wrong the rankings are. Of course, these calls and emails are almost always coming from parents who feel their son has been slighted, thus the rankings are a joke! These contacts really increase right after the lists have been updated. We actually check out each situation closely because we don't want to miss someone if at all possible.

Anyway, the point I was making was that those players ranked are not the ones complaining, not that all the unranked complain. I fully understand that we can't always be 100% accurate and there are many very good players in our database who will have outstanding careers without ever being ranked. The vast majority of players we see never enter the national rankings. Some have become outstanding college and/or professional players.

I sincerely hope that your son is one of them with or without being ranked by PG. That would make me very happy.

I think "fun" is the right word to use when it comes to team rankings. Some might argue the choice of that word.

PGStaff


Player rankings to me are totally different than the team rankings---with the players, they for the most part have all been evaluated.

With regard to teams I like the term "fun" as well----it is nearly impossible to truly rate HS teams if they have not been seen, even if they have not played each other. What makes me laugh is you can take three polls and they each will have a different Top 50 with some teams in the top 25 in one poll and not even in the top 50 in the other two. Until such time as they have a HS tournament the question of team ranking is moot but they do create attention and discussion

quote:

they do create attention and discussion

TR,
The rankings might be very important to the team that is ranked. Nice honor you might say!

However, to me, you have mentioned the most important thing.

quote:

I sincerely hope that your son is one of them with or without being ranked by PG. That would make me very happy.

That is a very nice thing to write, PG. And the best thing is that I know you mean it, not just for my son, but for all the others.

By the way, 2B is the greatest baseball player in the United States of America and should be ranked number one! Of course, no one else seems to share this opinion except me and his grandparents...

Maxpreps does an RPI type ranking. It doesn't mean much early in the season but is probably the most accurate HS ranking by the end of the season. Of course "most accurate" doesn't necessarily mean accurate. They throw a playoff factor in there that probably tends to over emphasize the playoffs.

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:

quote:

they do create attention and discussion

TR,
The rankings might be very important to the team that is ranked. Nice honor you might say!

However, to me, you have mentioned the most important thing.

I agree with PG & TR, it definitely creates some discussion. But how can we honestly compare programs from one side of the states to the other? D1 committments? Won/Loss records? A HS team in one state with a modest 13-9 record, may crush a team in another state with a 21-1 record. National HS Rankings are Fun, and yes it's a nice honor, but it really doesn't mean anything without a Playoff system, and that is not likely to ever happen.

Wow - that's a lot of information! Thanks everyone!!

Another phrase I hear a lot about High School pre-season is "They have 4 returning starters - 2 are seniors" etc. So, I can understand the projections based on that because there are the previous stats of at least 4 players to consider.

We have 5 Freshmen on our team this year who have been very successful in select ball over the years. Between them they have won various state championships, world series, and many qualifiers while on different teams. IMO, in order to "rank" a young team like ours, the person doing the ranking would have to know all of that data. Odds are that's not the case - I mean, why would anyone know or even care to look?

But if I understand what ya'll are saying, now that they've hit HS ball, if they continue those type of successes, our HS team ranking should go up based on record and opinion.

BTW, do you think it is possible to have VERY talented individuals with previous successes form a HS team and that team NOT do well?

quote:

We have 5 Freshmen on our team this year who have been very successful in select ball over the years. Between them they have won various state championships, world series, and many qualifiers while on different teams. IMO, in order to "rank" a young team like ours, the person doing the ranking would have to know all of that data.

Unless those freshman had those accomplishments in 18U ball they would be classified as inexperienced question marks. It's a huge jump from 14U ball to high school varsity. High school is 18/19U ball. Our high school has had one freshman start opening day on varsity in it's history.

quote:

Originally posted by RJM:

quote:

We have 5 Freshmen on our team this year who have been very successful in select ball over the years. Between them they have won various state championships, world series, and many qualifiers while on different teams. IMO, in order to "rank" a young team like ours, the person doing the ranking would have to know all of that data.

Unless those freshman had those accomplishments in 18U ball they would be classified as inexperienced question marks. It's a huge jump from 14U ball to high school varsity. High school is 18/19U ball. Our high school has had one freshman start opening day on varsity in it's history.

That makes sense. Coach is trying to play a couple of Freshmen on varsity this year - their inexperience against older players is evident.