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I had blogged this on my site: bluecollarbaseball.com but wanted to share here as well



Let’s start with a Righty (you are a runner on first base). When you are younger, most coaches will tell you to watch his legs (feet). That is fine for young players, however as you progress, you really have to watch the pitcher’s whole body. Sure the basic move to first will involve the pitcher moving his feet. But in order to get GREAT jumps, other factors come into play. For example, the first guy to get on base should try to get a big enough lead in order to make the pitcher throw over. This will allow the coaches and players to pick up on his move. Many times a guy will use a slow-footed (B) move, then come back over with his main (A) move (the better one). When you’re on first base, watch how the pitcher delivers the ball to the plate. Some pitchers will have a big space between their legs (like K-Rod) when they set-up, causing them to really have to lift that front leg in order to get any velocity. So when you see this type of guy, as soon as he lifts his front leg, you go. The next type of righty pitcher is called a “Leaner”. This guy usually uses a slide step, but if you watch closely, his body (shoulder) leans towards the plate first. His set up will be very straight up (almost standing directly up- legs very close). So as soon as you see him lean towards home, you’re off to steal second. The last type of righty pitcher uses a “turn” when he throws home. This means in his set position, he is slightly ‘opened’ up on an angle between home and first base. So in order for him to pitch, he must turn his front shoulder back towards home and then deliver. When you see his shoulder turn in, you go. All pitchers have keys and indicators, some just hide it better than others.

Now to the Lefty Pitchers. It can be difficult stealing on a lefty, however, these indicators will help. Firstly, if a guy goes straight up and down with his front leg, you basically have to go on first move. His leg-kick will be high, so as soon as he moves you go. Even if he picks you off, it takes time for the first baseman to throw to second. In regards to a lefty pitchers front leg, if he is a guy who really has to drive towards home plate in order to get more velocity, he will bring his lead foot behind (passed) his back leg. Once he does this, he cannot come over to first. He has to deliver the pitch. This is not very common as you move up in baseball, however guys like Billy Wagner still do it. Another lefty key is his face. Many times you will see pitchers get into the habit of being “opposite”. This means if he looks at you when he goes into his motion, he is going to throw the ball to the batter, and if he is looking at the batter when he lifts his leg, he is going to try to pick you off. This is very common. A pitcher will look at the runner to try to get him thinking, and then deliver the pitch. Watch for this tendency, because it can be very very useful. The last lefty key is complicated. You have to watch his lead foot. This happens when a pitcher goes straight up and down, as well as does not get into any habit of “opposite looking.” If you are very good and can watch his lead foot you will notice that when he lifts his leg, if his cleat is facing toes down (to the ground) he is throwing the ball home. If he lifts his lead leg and you see the bottom of his cleats (where his toe is pointed toward the sky), he is going to pick you off. It is physically impossible to point your toe down and land correctly on a pick off. The same if true when the toe is up and delivering a pitch; it can’t happen. The landing would be too awkward, so the pitcher’s cleat can tell you what he is going to do. If you can master this last one, you will be an extremely good base-stealer (if you have average or good speed).
Kevin www.bluecollarbaseball.com
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quote:
Originally posted by Jimmy03:
quote:
Originally posted by Blue Collar Baseball:
In regards to a lefty pitchers front leg, if he is a guy who really has to drive towards home plate in order to get more velocity, he will bring his lead foot behind (passed) his back leg. Once he does this, he cannot come over to first.


This is not true.


Really? That's how I always understood it. What's the rule?

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Last edited by OnWabana
Kevin,

Not all lefties are like that. Going on the first move the lefty can continue to leg lift and pivot (like a fake pickoff to second)then throw to the second baseman or run at the runner stealing.

Also the foot needs to go past the back plane of the rubber, not just the post leg.

I have a kid who "looks opposite" and we're working on it.

A good lefty will throw in a slide step delivery enough that the runner won't feel good about stealing on first move.

Ddin't know about the cleats thing...but thanks!
One thing I will say as a coach and umpire is that when a lefty lifts his leg he has the intent to either pick or go home. When a runner goes first move and the pitcher was planning to go to the plate it's difficult for to pick without committing a balk. He's mind is just set to go home and it takes a while to register the runner leaving early. Kids can do it, but often they end up stopping in the middle of their motion or stepping to home and throwing to first.
Agreed, it is **** difficult. Then there are the HS umps who figure he's throwing to an unoccupied base rather than making a play just because they're not used to seeing this maneuver from a lefty, only a righty.

Then you always have a problem with younger HS lefties more worried about the runner than the batter, end up walking a bunch.

But a well schooled and practiced lefty who is confident is pretty much unstealable given even a reasonable catcher.

Throw in the typical 2 man HS crew and shading the 45 degree rule with a follow thru walk towards first and any HS lefty can have a wonderful time while really ticking off the opposition's 1st base coach.Smile
quote:
Originally posted by OnWabana:
quote:
Originally posted by Jimmy03:
quote:
Originally posted by Blue Collar Baseball:
In regards to a lefty pitchers front leg, if he is a guy who really has to drive towards home plate in order to get more velocity, he will bring his lead foot behind (passed) his back leg. Once he does this, he cannot come over to first.


This is not true.


Really? That's how I always understood it. What's the rule?

-------------------


OBR 8.05 (a) (comment): If a lefthanded or righthanded pitcher swings his free foot past the back edge of the pitcher's rubber, he is required to pitch to the batter except to throw to second base on a pick off play.

The MLB and MiLB interpretation is that the entire foot must break the plane of the back edge of the rubber for this to be called.
Last edited by Jimmy03
And it is rarely called. Dont base your decision as a base runner on this. First of all you have waited too long if your waiting to see this in order to go. And your also hoping if he does throw over it is called.

If your going on first move then your going on first move. If your not going then there is no rush to get your secondary anyway. Just wait to see him go home and then extend on your secondary lead.

Rushing to get a secondary is pointless anyway. You can get all you want to get once you know he is not throwing over. Runners get picked because they are trying to get their secondary before they know for sure the pitcher is going to the plate. They are moving away from where they need to get back to when the pitcher throws over. Just sit and wait until you know they are going to the dish and then get your secondary lead.

If your stealing then get your reads and go. Its all about getting a good jump off your reads. Getting too much of a primary and being afraid your going to get picked will not allow you to get a good jump. Get a comfortable primary and then get your reads.

Its a lot like the kid that comes way down the line at 3b and then is breaking back before he ever sees the catcher catch the baseball. He breaks back out of fear they are going to throw behind him and now can not advance because by the time he breaks back , realizes he could have gone he cant advance.

On your primary lead you should be cleating with the lead foot as the ball is entering the hitting zone. This allows you to cleat with the lead foot keeping your hips squared to home plate. Cleat , read and react. How many times have we seen the runner breaking back to first base as the ball squirts away? Now they are not in a posistion to take the bag. Or they are breaking back to first base as the ground ball is hit in the five hole and they are forced at 2nd base? Or they get their hips turned towards second base , drift and get hosed before they can get back to first by the catcher?

Knowing how to take a primary lead , secondary lead , how to get a good jump to steal a bag , how to actually run the bases my be the most uncoached , poorly coached part of the game of baseball.
well guys I mean the coach I was taught this buy, besides coach blankmeyer at St. Johns, was Coach Hill at Kansas State. They were ranked second in the country in steals with 149 last year and attribute much of their stolen base success to reading a pitcher. When I am talking about a guy who "breaks the plane," I mean a guy who rears back and fires by quickly lifting the leg back and drving towards home. In response to the first move comment, sure its great if the guy hads a consistent motion of straiht up and down, however if he does slide step, the runner should be smart enough to not go. I mean Kansas state uses these guys, as to where I got 'em, so try it. This was a very basic post, because there are many more topics at first base such as the jab step back, the fake steal (secondary). Im glad the post generated soem great responses.. Thank you fellas
quote:
Originally posted by Jimmy03:
quote:
Originally posted by OnWabana:
quote:
Originally posted by Jimmy03:
quote:
Originally posted by Blue Collar Baseball:
In regards to a lefty pitchers front leg, if he is a guy who really has to drive towards home plate in order to get more velocity, he will bring his lead foot behind (passed) his back leg. Once he does this, he cannot come over to first.


This is not true.


Really? That's how I always understood it. What's the rule?

-------------------


OBR 8.05 (a) (comment): If a lefthanded or righthanded pitcher swings his free foot past the back edge of the pitcher's rubber, he is required to pitch to the batter except to throw to second base on a pick off play.

The MLB and MiLB interpretation is that the entire foot must break the plane of the back edge of the rubber for this to be called.


Wow, thanks. I had no idea! I thought you could not cross your back leg. That's what I was taught even in college!

Why is this mostly uncalled?

----------------
quote:
Originally posted by OnWabana:
quote:
Originally posted by Jimmy03:
quote:
Originally posted by OnWabana:
quote:
Originally posted by Jimmy03:
quote:
Originally posted by Blue Collar Baseball:
In regards to a lefty pitchers front leg, if he is a guy who really has to drive towards home plate in order to get more velocity, he will bring his lead foot behind (passed) his back leg. Once he does this, he cannot come over to first.


This is not true.


Really? That's how I always understood it. What's the rule?

-------------------


OBR 8.05 (a) (comment): If a lefthanded or righthanded pitcher swings his free foot past the back edge of the pitcher's rubber, he is required to pitch to the batter except to throw to second base on a pick off play.

The MLB and MiLB interpretation is that the entire foot must break the plane of the back edge of the rubber for this to be called.


Wow, thanks. I had no idea! I thought you could not cross your back leg. That's what I was taught even in college!

Why is this mostly uncalled?

----------------


I can't speak for all areas, but in mine, it is rarely done. Very few pitchers break the back plane of the rubber with their ENTIRE foot to begin with, and even fewer of them try to throw to first after doing so. Try it.
The original post is interesting, but misleading.

It's extremely rare for a LHP HS pitcher to be balked for throwing over after swinging the free foot behind the rubber. But it doesn't matter anyways, because.....

Since you're guess-stealing on a LHP with a good move, all you need to know is: go on first move after your 3B coach gives you the steal sign (or when you guess that it's a good pitch to go on if you've got a green light).

Read-and-react stealing on a leg-lifting LHP: I don't like the risk-reward scenario of coaching my HS baserunners to "read" the LHP's intent and decide on-the-fly whether to go based on "opposites." If dyslexia doesn't get you, Murphy's Law will. Keep it simple. Guess right and go on first move.
Last edited by freddy77
I understand your point about guessing. Especially on a guy with a good move, however, as I stated originally, you watch the pitcher throughout the game to get his keys or tendencies. The same way if youre on second and you notice the pitcher get in the habit of "one looking" you. And the entire post was not just about a left handed pitcher. Righties were in there too. The things I wrote about were taught to me by my college coach and coach hill from kansas state (whose team finished 2nd in country in steals), so each input is greatly appreciated but all my post is doing is suggest you try it and see how it goes.

The first move is not always done. Alot of good HS guys and college pitchers (lefty) vary how long they hold the ball so if a guy is holding the ball for a good 6 - 7 seconds one pitch, then 1 second the next its hard to get that rhythmn and a good jump. And it also depends how quick he is to the plate. Alot of variables, I am just writing about certain keys to maybe look for, but different things work for different people. Pitchers are creatures of habit, so most of the time you can read his move and tendencies( ex: scouting reports). I myself would much rather have an idea of the guys move instead of guessing all the time.

When it comes to how quick he is to the plate, we do the same thing most major league teams do. We have a general idea of how fast (stopwatch wise) each one of our players steals second in and well get the pitchers time and catcher's pop time to second. If combining the pitchers FB time to home and the catchers time to second is more than our baserunners' time is... then we have a pretty good idea we can run. Although is sounds in depth, its really not and is pretty accurate.

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