Red shirt - who decides - what is the benefit?

There are way more posters on here who will give more valid answers on this, but here is how I understand red-shirting.

Who decides: The head coach

Who benefits: The head coach and the player.

why?: It allows the player to get his feet up underneath him a little more in various areas, i.e. maturity, baseball prowness, academics, etc. And this extra year of growth gives him 4 more years of playing time which the coach is hoping the redshirt paid off.

When is it made: Fall time

Can a player decline?: I guess he could, but I would think it means getting cut if he did.

YGD

In this case I think a lot will depend on the condition of the player when he reports in the fall.

There is another possibility here , though it is rather remote, but the coach may pull the scholarship if the player reports in nonplaying condition

The coach can pull a scholarship?

Once the NLI has been signed, he can't pull it until after the freshman year.

15.3.2.2 Physical Condition of Student-Athlete. Financial aid awarded to a prospective student-athlete may not be conditioned on the recipient reporting in satisfactory physical condition. If a student-athlete has been accepted for admission and awarded financial aid, the institution shall be committed for the term of the original award, even if the student-athlete’s physical condition prevents him or her from participating in intercollegiate athletics.

Also, the term "redshirt" isn't well defined, but fundamentally it simply means that the player does not compete during the season. The coach always has the right to not use the player, but practically, the player has no way to refuse competition, even if it is only for one pinch running situation--which would mean one season of competition is consumed.

If it turns out that the player is medically unfit to compete, and that fact is rigorously documented, it is to his benefit to make sure that the injury is documented. If the player is subsequently unable to compete for medical reasons (or a few other hardships), so that he unavoidably misses two seasons, he may be able to get a 6th year in which to complete his 4 seasons of competition.

The decision to redshirt is usaully on the coach. Now a redshirt player counts against his 35 man roster and as a scholarship player (27). Most coaches are now using the redshirt if they have a talented player with a talented upperclassmen ahead of him. This player will not get enough playing time, innings, at bats etc to waste the year of elgibility.
Some coaches may let you know at the end of the fall, some just before Feb 18 when rosters are due and some not until the season is underway and the player hasn't seen the field. It works pretty much the same with a medical redshirt..

A player who has been told he was going to redshirt can also be summoned to become active if a player or players that were ahead of him are injured etc and he is now needed to step in.

Again there are folks here who have lived this. In my experience, I wish my son had gotten a redshirt when he had 30AB's as a Freshman with most in bad games.

I HAVE seen schoarships pulled because of the player not being able to play--if a coach wants to he can find a way--as I say it is rare but it happens

Coach Merc--I agree with you about the frosh redshirt--my guy did and it helped him immensely and he was the one left to make the decision on the eve of the first game--he and Coach had a long meeting going over the pros and cons---took the redshirt and then started for 4 years

TRhit,
Yes, a coach can find a way. He can present the situation to the recruit such that it is apparent that the recruit can win the battle (collect one years's scholarship) and lose the war (not have a desirable place to play baseball).

3 Finger

It is like a job--if you cannot produce they find someone to replace you and you do not get paid

Redshirt is not declared until after the playing season is over as Coach Merc has mentioned.

I wouldn't worry about it, he's got a full year in front of him until that is determined, if at all.

TPM


Read Coach Merc's post---that is not what he said !

Pitcherparent, I think you get the jist of redshirting.

There's no need to panic about a coach pulling your son's scholarship. Like TPM said, your son has plenty of time to heal and even be in tip top shape to report in the fall ready to play ball. Sometimes information passed to posters on here is unnecessary and I'm afraid you got some of that.

You're original questions pertained to "redshirting". No player can ever know what the coach will do with his program. Afterall, it is his program. Just be sure that if the coach brings it up that your son asks all the right questions so he'll know what is happening.

YGD

Speaking of incorrect info look at what you say--how do you know the boy will be in shape for next fall?

Another question--does the school he signed with know of his physical situation?

Folks --I would suggest you stop painting "rosy" pictures when they may not be---too much "feel good" stuff going on here and in the world today--people know to know what may happen, not what will happen but what may happen

don't forget the trainer(s). They can at some schools have the final say on ability/condition to play.

I give up.

quote:

Originally posted by TPM:
Redshirt is not declared until after the playing season is over OR as Coach Merc has mentioned.

I wouldn't worry about it, he's got a full year in front of him until that is determined, if at all.

Redshirt is just a designation for the year you are in, nothing is set in stone UNTIL after the season is over.

Calm down TR, the advice given has been helpful.

As 3FG pointed out, correctly, medical redshirts vs redshirts are not the same.
Medical redshirting which is actually called a "medical hardship" must be documented rigorously to show the player was not capable of participating and competing during a substantial part(70% I think) of the season.
The decision to grant the medical redshirt, or deny it, rests with the NCAA, or conference, if affiliated. There must be a request to grant the medical redshirt, supported by the documentation, and the requests normally are made when the season is concluded.
It seems to me if we have a parent with 9 posts who asks a very legitimate question, we should seek to provide accurate information and not create needless anxiety. If someone wants to provide them with the broad list of things that might go wrong, it should be referenced accordingly as things that might occur, in my view.
As 3FG posted, the NLI cannot be withdrawn due to the injury. Do we know other ways? Yes but there are no "facts" to suggest that is even a consideration here.
If the doctor is saying 6-9 months, he would be ready by Fall ball. Those are the facts. Could the world end before then? Well of course but we have no "facts" to suggest it will/might.
The clear answer is this young man cannot be medically red-shirted if he cannot participate in the Fall. Should he still be having medical issues impacting the ability to compete by 2/11, the medical hardship process could be applicable.
Could the Coach choose to red-shirt along the lines and reasons Coach Merc provided, for non-medical reasons? Of course and Coach Merc did accurately summarize the non-medical process.

TPM

I am always calm

AND

I do not need you giving me orders or telling me what to do-- who the heck do you think you are anyway ?

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
TPM

I am always calm

AND

I do not need you giving me orders or telling me what to do-- who the heck do you think you are anyway ?

This would be what One would call an Oxymoron.

TPM & TR always have calm discussions.

Thank you all for all of your insight. This website is so helpful for those of us who are going through this for the first time.

I want to paraphrase what I understand about redshirting:

The head coach decides who redshirts. He may or may not discuss it with the player, but ultimately it is the head coaches decision.

The head coach can decide to redshirt a player in the fall, or spring, but the final declaration isn't made until after the season is over because the situation or circumstances may change.

It seems to benefit the player more than the coach, because it gives the player an extra season of eligibility.

I guess I don't understand how it benefits the coach to redshirt a player. How often does a player stick around for a fifth year? If the player is taking up a roster spot and getting scholarship money it seems more like the coach the coach is sending a probationary notice to the player.

To answer a couple of questions:

The school does know his medical status. It was the team doctor that did the surgery. The surgery was recommended so he would be at 100% for college even though it totally wipes out his high school and summer seasons.

Another question, what are the other ways an NLI can be withdrawn.

Thank-you

quote:

the final declaration isn't made until after the season is over

Look at it from the NCAA's point of view. Soon after an academic year begins, teams start filling out squad lists, which deal with a number of aspects of each player, but for this post, consider just one checkbox: Did the player use a season of competition last year? It is a yes or no question, and it really doesn't matter if the decison to not compete came early in the year, later in the year, or was just the natural outcome of not being asked to play. So, there is no "final declaration", it is just a simple fact which can only be determined once the season is over. (I'm purposefully avoiding the subject of a "medical redshirt", which is instead one kind of hardship waiver.)

Of course it is the coach's decision; all decisions about playing time are made by the coach. Well, I suppose a player could decline to play in a game even though asked to play, but I suspect he won't be on the team for long.

Regarding ways a NLI can be withdrawn, the NCAA website has very complete information. Also, if a player has signed a NLI, then he and his parents can and should read the contract (preferably before signing ). The most obvious way a NLI becomes void is if the player isn't admitted to the college. A NLI isn't enforceable if the player decides to not enroll at any D1 or D2 school.

A player and a school may mutually agree to cancel the contract. The school, especially a D1, hold the upper hand here. It is rare but schools sometimes make it clear to a NLI signee that it is in his best interest to mutually agree to terminate the NLI. This has happened to both healthy and inured players. But most schools honor their committments, even the verbal ones.