Reversing a call

Without knowing what the umpire said, my guesses would be...

1.) Coach convinced umpire that the runner initiated malicious contact. If this is true, the runner should have still been called safe, and then ejected.

2.) Coach convinced umpire that the runner dove over the catcher (assuming diving is not allowed at this level).

3.) Coach convinced umpire that as soon as there was contact, the runner was out, and that the ball rolled out of the glove after the runner was out. Would have been incorrect, but possible that this is what happened.

The umpire could have announced out loud to the opposing coach why the call was overturned, thereby letting the fans understand as well. Seems like this would have helped, though by no means is mandated.

Or, upon discussion it was realized that like most non-proffesional levels, it is illegal to crash the Defender?

Being that there is no "must slide" rule almost anywhere in any level of baseball, the "no slide rule" in the OP made me think there was contact allowed or contact as long as it wasn't malicious.

Even at the HS level, I see many collisions at the plate where there was no MC, so we play on.

True, the word "crashes" makes it seem excessive, but then I wonder why there was no MC called.

There are "must slide" rules in most recreational leagues (Little League, etc.) and in NFHS rules. Any state can adopt the NFHS rules in whole, or in part with changes, as they see fit. Perhaps your state did not adopt the "must slide" rule, but you should know that it is quite commonly in place pretty much everywhere below the college and pro levels. If you have never encountered this rule before, I don't know whose rules you've been playing under.

Gentlemen:

To try and clarify. It is a collegiate wood bat league, basically using NCAA rules. It is specifically stated that there is "no slide rule". I used the term crash because that is how it appeared to me. It was not malicious in my opinion, just the result of a runner going flat out arriving just after the ball did.

Therefore, my confusion, given the lack of a requirement to slide or avoid contact, was how, absent malicious contact, could the home plate umpire make the correct call as the ball did wind up on the ground, yet reverse it after consultation with the base umpire.

The explanation given the coach was that contact was not allowed, which goes against the league's stated position. It doesn't really matter a great deal, but I'm trying to learn if there would be basis for overturning what to me seemed to be a correct call that I'm not aware of.

There is no NCAA (or NFHS) rule requiring runners to slide (perhaps that is from where the confusion emanates), and NCAA rules contemplate legal collisions.

NCAA does have a collision rule (at all bases) requiring the umpire to judge whether:

1) The collision was avoidable (i.e., could the runner could have reached the base without the collision?);

2) The runner was attempting to reach the base or dislodge the ball, and;

3) The contact was malicious.

If the collision was not a legitimate attempt to reach the base, the runner is out, even if the fielder drops the ball. Malicious contact results in an ejection and an out (unless the runner reached the base before the MC, then it's just an EJ).

So, HTBT, but the explanation was not a good one.

Don't believe there's any "must slide" rule anywhere.

If one slides direct to bag the he will not be called out on avoidable contact.

If defender does not have the ball and the runner holds up to avoid collision he should get the base on obstruction.

If the defender has the ball and is blocking the basepath and the runner goes in high then generally the runner will be called out and risks "malicious contact".

On "bang-bang" that result in a train wreck it becomes a matter of umpire judgement. Umpires should confer to "get the call right" even if it means reversing a previous initial call.

Good ball means baserunners should always slide when its going to be a close play. There are many different type of slides for different situations.

quote:

Originally posted by Midlo Dad:
There are "must slide" rules in most recreational leagues (Little League, etc.) and in NFHS rules. Any state can adopt the NFHS rules in whole, or in part with changes, as they see fit. Perhaps your state did not adopt the "must slide" rule, but you should know that it is quite commonly in place pretty much everywhere below the college and pro levels. If you have never encountered this rule before, I don't know whose rules you've been playing under.

Just so you know, there is no "must slide" in any national code that I am aware of. LL has a rule that says if the fielder has the ball then the runner must slide or attempt to go around the fielder. Fed's rule says the runner never has to slide but if he does, it has to be legal. I can't remember NCAA's exact rule so I can't comment.