Original Post
Replies sorted oldest to newest
You might want to define the terms. Is Full Ride just tuition (and books, as they're usually a gimme), or are room and meal plan considered? Or is it all of what's available as in tuition/books only if the schools has no accommodation or no meal plan?
A full ride is board, room, books and tuition. If you live off campus, you get books, tuition and a nice check to take care of the apt. and food.
That's how I would define it as well, but I've heard parents claiming full ride with significantly less. With the way the poll was starting out with votes, a new webster might be assuming that the 'expected' schollie was something over two-thirds.
Seems to me the results of this poll may be misleading. School costs vary greatly and a full ride at one school may be less than a partial scholarship at another.
playball50, A full ride means that the parents don't have to pay for anything.It is all taken care of.
and that is a very rare occurrence
especially for a position player
also it is only a one year scholarship
especially for a position player
also it is only a one year scholarship
bbscout, I think you are missing the point. There are large differences in the cost of tuition for schools (public vs private). Likewise, the quality of schools and their baseball programs vary greatly. It's not always about going to school without paying for anything.
I didn't miss any points. Check what the thread is about. If it costs $100,000 to go to school and the $100,000 is taken care of in a scholarship, then you have a full ride. If the scholly takes care of $90,000, then you dig in your pocket for $10,000 and your son is on a 90% ride.
I am sorry to say you are still missing the point. It is misleading to compare only scholarship percentages. Which is the better offer - School A $10,000/year full ride or School B $40,000/year 75% scholly?
playball50,
A full ride at School A is worth $10,000.
A full ride at School B is worth $40,000.
The quality of offers is not being debated.
The definition of a full ride is
In your example, School B, might not be the best offer, if the player or his family cannot afford the $10,000 remaining balance.
The full ride offer of $10,000 is best in that case.
Tricky ain't it?
A full ride at School A is worth $10,000.
A full ride at School B is worth $40,000.
The quality of offers is not being debated.
The definition of a full ride is
quote:
A full ride is board, room, books and tuition. If you live off campus, you get books, tuition and a nice check to take care of the apt. and food.
In your example, School B, might not be the best offer, if the player or his family cannot afford the $10,000 remaining balance.
The full ride offer of $10,000 is best in that case.
Tricky ain't it?
playball- Let's put it this way. bbscout sends his kid to school on a 100% ride to a 20,000 school and pays nothing. You send your kid to school on a 75% ride to a 40,000 school and you pay 10,000. It has more to do with what you have to pay and not how much you get. Is your argument that the 40,000 school is a better academic school?
I agree, it is tricky. In my opinion, I did not give you enough information in my example to determine the better offer. What is the value of knowing only the scholarship percentage?
playball50,
Not much really, except, a higher percentage might indicate the value the school places on the player to their program.
And, its one way for to answer someone when dollars don't really need to be discussed.
Not much really, except, a higher percentage might indicate the value the school places on the player to their program.
And, its one way for to answer someone when dollars don't really need to be discussed.
quote:
Originally posted by playball50:
I am sorry to say you are still missing the point. It is misleading to compare only scholarship percentages. Which is the better offer - School A $10,000/year full ride or School B $40,000/year 75% scholly?
school "A"
The poll, if folks are honest, will probably point out how few players get higher than a 60 percent ATHLETIC offer.
But, in fairness, two more questions should be asked:
What percentage of other GRANT money did your child get in combination with his ATHLETIC money?
And, what percentage of FULL RIDE did that equal?
But, in fairness, two more questions should be asked:
What percentage of other GRANT money did your child get in combination with his ATHLETIC money?
And, what percentage of FULL RIDE did that equal?
we got zip, and that is two boys going to college.
bbscout:
What you say is exactly my point. This survey is fine for what it is, but it's not the whole story, which might be of some value to folks.
If one kid gets a full ride, all athletic money, and another gets 50 percent athletic money and 50 percent other grant (federal/state financial aid, academic, outside scholarship)money, the parents of both kids can say their kids have full scholarships. Perhaps not "full rides," but does that really matter?
Given that many schools work on scholarship blending to stretch those limited baseball dollars, it is possible that those two kids could be playing on the same team and be equally prized recruits in the eyes of the program.
Would many, if not most people see it that way? Of course not.
Until they look at the bill ... or lack thereof.
What you say is exactly my point. This survey is fine for what it is, but it's not the whole story, which might be of some value to folks.
If one kid gets a full ride, all athletic money, and another gets 50 percent athletic money and 50 percent other grant (federal/state financial aid, academic, outside scholarship)money, the parents of both kids can say their kids have full scholarships. Perhaps not "full rides," but does that really matter?
Given that many schools work on scholarship blending to stretch those limited baseball dollars, it is possible that those two kids could be playing on the same team and be equally prized recruits in the eyes of the program.
Would many, if not most people see it that way? Of course not.
Until they look at the bill ... or lack thereof.
I typically don't like "Poll" type questions because you are limited by the authors labels, however I am interested in the answer to rz1's question. Once the term "full ride" was defined, answer the question or don't. Once we understand the simple numbers then if you like, debate the quality or sense of 100% of this or 50% of that. Maybe I'm wacked here but I think it's a very personal qualification based upon many factors regarding what is a better deal. For my part, my son is an 06 so what the hell do I know!
When discussing scholarships on this board I would assume everyone would use the baseball scholarship as the scholarship being discussed…that is unless they specifically mention that academic money was part (or all) of the scholarship. While I admire the student that gets any scholarship money because of his high academics, it is misleading to let everyone assume an academic scholarship is an athletic scholarship. If a coach told you he would increase your son’s baseball scholarship if he weren’t eligible for academic money….well…most will never know. 
Fungo
Fungo
..and with less than 1% of the votes counted, it's too early to call..........
Uh, oops, sorry about that.......
Wrong poll.
And I tried to vote while I was logged into my Floriday ISP, and I was able to vote, but I noticed that the total vote count did not change even when I voted two or three times.
The Memphis attorneys are on standby at a Fedex jet headed to Florida.
Uh, oops, sorry about that.......
Wrong poll.
And I tried to vote while I was logged into my Floriday ISP, and I was able to vote, but I noticed that the total vote count did not change even when I voted two or three times.
The Memphis attorneys are on standby at a Fedex jet headed to Florida.
I'm a coach and not a parent but this is a great topic. I can remember a few years ago, I had s stud pitcher and he kept getting offeres of 55-65%. When he got an offer of 65%, I told the parents to jump on it. They were upset because they thought I was selling their son short. They knew of several kids that got "full-rides." A real "full-ride" is rare. Almost always, it includes both athletic and academic. If not, you had to be such a stud pitcher that you probably are going to go in the draft. The problem then is, many parents "fudge" a little on what they say their child received. A "full-ride" isn't always a "full-ride."
Fungo
I'm not trying to take this poll in the wrong direction, but I am trying to fill in with debate what I see as a hole in how the results will be interpreted.
The poll will tell us about baseball money ... and a lot about the quality of offers received by members of these boards.
But, in separate discussion, when you factor in other grants (particularly those monies available based on income, but academic money as well), you can get a slightly different picture.
Ultimately, I think it will be interesting to see how important those other monies were to the decision of where to sign.
I'm not trying to take this poll in the wrong direction, but I am trying to fill in with debate what I see as a hole in how the results will be interpreted.
The poll will tell us about baseball money ... and a lot about the quality of offers received by members of these boards.
But, in separate discussion, when you factor in other grants (particularly those monies available based on income, but academic money as well), you can get a slightly different picture.
Ultimately, I think it will be interesting to see how important those other monies were to the decision of where to sign.
OldVaman,
The academic/athletic/need based blending of scholarships does sound as if it would make a good topic for discussion (or poll). Our situation may be different, but we never had any discussions with any coaches about any monies other than the baseball scholarship. Another source for education money in the state of Alabama comes from the parents that purchased a college education to a state university while their child is in their infancy for a greatly reduced rate. Do other states have programs of this nature?
Fungo
The academic/athletic/need based blending of scholarships does sound as if it would make a good topic for discussion (or poll). Our situation may be different, but we never had any discussions with any coaches about any monies other than the baseball scholarship. Another source for education money in the state of Alabama comes from the parents that purchased a college education to a state university while their child is in their infancy for a greatly reduced rate. Do other states have programs of this nature?
Fungo
Florida has that program as well.
The NLI papers have the percentage on them, so (theoretically) the baseball money is not open to interpretation.
As in the situation CoachB25 described, or were I a new parent here, this poll currently suggests that 25% of quality players can expect a full ride, and more than half can expect better than 60%. I'm thinking that's not realistic.....
The NLI papers have the percentage on them, so (theoretically) the baseball money is not open to interpretation.
As in the situation CoachB25 described, or were I a new parent here, this poll currently suggests that 25% of quality players can expect a full ride, and more than half can expect better than 60%. I'm thinking that's not realistic.....
Not trying to muddy the water,but our son just started recieving letters from some colleges(Division I and Division III).
The Division III states due to NCAA restrictions Division III are not permitted to offer athletic scholarships but can on academics and financial need.This is in NC.
The Division III states due to NCAA restrictions Division III are not permitted to offer athletic scholarships but can on academics and financial need.This is in NC.
Orlando…You’re right!..as usual. There have been 42 votes counted at this time. Let’s say those 42 votes represent a 42 man roster (not unrealistic)…we have 11.7 scholarships to pass out. According to our poll we have 10 players on full rides and 14 players with less than 90% but more than 60% so let’s say those 14 players are at 75% or using 10.5 scholarships and we still have 18 more players claiming scholarship… it doesn’t take an Einstein to understand we’re in trouble with the NCAA.
Note: I understand the majority of active Websters have sons of above average talent… so it would make sense that the poll would be somewhat high…but it does send the wrong message in my opinion.
Fungo
Note: I understand the majority of active Websters have sons of above average talent… so it would make sense that the poll would be somewhat high…but it does send the wrong message in my opinion.
Fungo
Kentucky has a program you can pay into beginning when your child is very young towards their college education. I never participated, so I don't know the details. There's also another program that kids earn money for a college in Kentucky by keeping the highschool GPA up as well as good ACT score. Every little bit helps! My son is a senior, so I don't know what the total amount will add up to. I don't think the poll results are realistic either. Either people are talking about combined monies or this poll is only reflective of a group of people that had the top level players. I personally know of only one kid from here that has received a full ride (meaning fully paid by athletics). Of course there may have been others recently that I'm not aware of, but I still think this is a very rare thing. In my opinion, if you get 50%, that's a great offer.
Fungo
Many if not most states now have some form of a college savings program. And it is a good thing for many.
What parents aren't told, though, is that if/when you apply for financial aid, your need-based aid is calculated on what you have. That savings money counts against you. Now, if you save enough, and/or you get enough money from a school that isn't need-based (academic or athletic), the point is moot.
But if not, well, that's where polls like this and debates like this can help.
Many if not most states now have some form of a college savings program. And it is a good thing for many.
What parents aren't told, though, is that if/when you apply for financial aid, your need-based aid is calculated on what you have. That savings money counts against you. Now, if you save enough, and/or you get enough money from a school that isn't need-based (academic or athletic), the point is moot.
But if not, well, that's where polls like this and debates like this can help.
There have been threads before where a new webster could infer that this site is reflective of a cross-section of hs players. It's not. People come to this site because they have a talented player who could benefit from the advice and experience here to get to the next level for them. Most, probably all, have players who would be called above average. (If they aren't, they ain't gonna be playing in college in anyway )
Maybe to put it into context for Websters with '05 and younger players --- the people voting would have to be early-signing '05's, or current college players/parents who have cared enough to continue posting. If those college players/parents are still here, chances are it's because the players are doing well and they have the breadth of experience to be of significant help. (Josh springs to mind, Fungo!) So, it's probably that the voters thus far do represent particularly successful and well-rewarded players.
) Maybe to put it into context for Websters with '05 and younger players --- the people voting would have to be early-signing '05's, or current college players/parents who have cared enough to continue posting. If those college players/parents are still here, chances are it's because the players are doing well and they have the breadth of experience to be of significant help. (Josh springs to mind, Fungo!) So, it's probably that the voters thus far do represent particularly successful and well-rewarded players.
My bet is that not 100% of the kids represented on this site are going to an NCAA Div. 1 school with 11.7 scholarships available to disperse to a roster of 40.
I am also going to bet that a fair % is at a Div. 1 Juco with 24 scholarships available to disperse to a roster of 24.
My frame of reference on the question "What percentage of school costs (tuition, room, board, books) were offered to your son via ATHLETIC scholarship when he signed a letter of intent or for this years class verbally committed?" would be that of a parent of a JUCO player. The LOI from the NJCAA covers tuition, room and board and books. Perhaps this has the poll tweaked higher than some of you think it realistically ought to be.
I am also going to bet that a fair % is at a Div. 1 Juco with 24 scholarships available to disperse to a roster of 24.
My frame of reference on the question "What percentage of school costs (tuition, room, board, books) were offered to your son via ATHLETIC scholarship when he signed a letter of intent or for this years class verbally committed?" would be that of a parent of a JUCO player. The LOI from the NJCAA covers tuition, room and board and books. Perhaps this has the poll tweaked higher than some of you think it realistically ought to be.
To confuse things a bit more: my son is at a D-2, and his scholarship money adds up to approximately 75% of the total amount needed for tuition, room, board, etc. Of this 75%, the non-academic portion is 55%, and of that 55%, 25% simplys says "baseball", and 30% consists of two "grants", both tied to the school's athletic department.
If you ask how much of his scholarship is "pure baseball", I guess the answer is 25%, yet he is getting an additional 30% because he is an athlete playing baseball at his school. The academic money is available to all students hitting certain academic marks.
Our experience was that many schools had grants that weren't "pure baseball" money, yet they typically came from the athletic department with labels such as (names modified to protect the innocent) "Booster Club Grant" or "College Athletic Grant". I don't know how these go into the NCAA computational process; one publication we consulted says my son's school gives "4" Baseball scholarships (partially funded), yet when you add all of the non-academic funds just that we know of, the total is far higher. I suspect the grants get counted as part of the NCAA calculation, but don't know for sure. Our bottom line financial analysis in all of this as we sorted things out was pretty simple: what check will mom and dad have to write each year?
If you ask how much of his scholarship is "pure baseball", I guess the answer is 25%, yet he is getting an additional 30% because he is an athlete playing baseball at his school. The academic money is available to all students hitting certain academic marks.
Our experience was that many schools had grants that weren't "pure baseball" money, yet they typically came from the athletic department with labels such as (names modified to protect the innocent) "Booster Club Grant" or "College Athletic Grant". I don't know how these go into the NCAA computational process; one publication we consulted says my son's school gives "4" Baseball scholarships (partially funded), yet when you add all of the non-academic funds just that we know of, the total is far higher. I suspect the grants get counted as part of the NCAA calculation, but don't know for sure. Our bottom line financial analysis in all of this as we sorted things out was pretty simple: what check will mom and dad have to write each year?
Very simply
The total cost of school is "X" --the check you sign each semester will tell you your percentage including any academic or grant money
Your NLI and yearly scholarship papers will tell you the amount of baseball money you are getting
There are very few full rides and yes the parents do "fudge" a bit when discussing the numbers.
From our experience, we have been doing this nearly a dozen years now, a BASEBALL SCHOLARSHIP over 50% is excellent with 30% being the norm and yes differences can be made up via grants, academics etc but talking strictly baseball 30 % is pretty mucj the norm and anything over 50% is excellent
Also keep in mind that those who get the supposed "full ride" are usually high draft pick players and never get to college which in turn frees up $$$ for the late signees.
BOTTOM LINE: for the uninitiated keep in mind that most "full ride" stories are usually full of something else---yes they happen but very rarely--trust me on this
Be happy for any financial relief that college baseball can give your son and his college costs
The total cost of school is "X" --the check you sign each semester will tell you your percentage including any academic or grant money
Your NLI and yearly scholarship papers will tell you the amount of baseball money you are getting
There are very few full rides and yes the parents do "fudge" a bit when discussing the numbers.
From our experience, we have been doing this nearly a dozen years now, a BASEBALL SCHOLARSHIP over 50% is excellent with 30% being the norm and yes differences can be made up via grants, academics etc but talking strictly baseball 30 % is pretty mucj the norm and anything over 50% is excellent
Also keep in mind that those who get the supposed "full ride" are usually high draft pick players and never get to college which in turn frees up $$$ for the late signees.
BOTTOM LINE: for the uninitiated keep in mind that most "full ride" stories are usually full of something else---yes they happen but very rarely--trust me on this
Be happy for any financial relief that college baseball can give your son and his college costs
As informative as this site is, a complete understanding of the recruiting process, doesn't really happen until it's over.
Play select ball, follow the timeline, kiss the hs coaches a$$, make good grades, be able to hit rotationally and linearly (that might not be a word, if it ain't PIC can tell us) and voila a full ride to the college of your dreams and playing time the first year.
And then you get a 33% offer to that college of your dreams with a chance to play and you hold out for a "full" ride. Wait a minute.
The CHANCE to play at the college of your dreams is significant by itself especially if you can see fitting into the lineup early.
There is some out there that would pay for that CHANCE.
That you only have to pay 67% is not a bad deal.
The college of your dreams is probably offering about 15 boys the CHANCE to play and willing to pay X that ain't a "full" ride.
If you don't take it, there is another player that will..................
Play select ball, follow the timeline, kiss the hs coaches a$$, make good grades, be able to hit rotationally and linearly (that might not be a word, if it ain't PIC can tell us) and voila a full ride to the college of your dreams and playing time the first year.
And then you get a 33% offer to that college of your dreams with a chance to play and you hold out for a "full" ride. Wait a minute.
The CHANCE to play at the college of your dreams is significant by itself especially if you can see fitting into the lineup early.
There is some out there that would pay for that CHANCE.
That you only have to pay 67% is not a bad deal.
The college of your dreams is probably offering about 15 boys the CHANCE to play and willing to pay X that ain't a "full" ride.
If you don't take it, there is another player that will..................
quote:
Play select ball, follow the timeline, kiss the hs coaches a$$, make good grades, be able to hit rotationally and linearly (that might not be a word, if it ain't PIC can tell us) and voila a full ride to the college of your dreams and playing time the first year.
FO
You crack me up!
This thread is becoming very informative and is touching on some of the complexities involved in the recruiting process.
A few points:
Recruited players often have choices to make.
Offers from different level schools.
Even schools in same division have big variations in the quality and success of their baseball programs.
A partial scholarship at a dream school, with a quality baseball program may be a better fit than a full ride at another school.
Scholarship blending is very common and allows the coach the ability to spread his scholarship money over more players. He can get more bang for his buck.
In the end, the scholarship % is a personal thing. If it gives your son the opportunity to play baseball at the next level, or possibly his dream school, count your blessings.
A few points:
Recruited players often have choices to make.
Offers from different level schools.
Even schools in same division have big variations in the quality and success of their baseball programs.
A partial scholarship at a dream school, with a quality baseball program may be a better fit than a full ride at another school.
Scholarship blending is very common and allows the coach the ability to spread his scholarship money over more players. He can get more bang for his buck.
In the end, the scholarship % is a personal thing. If it gives your son the opportunity to play baseball at the next level, or possibly his dream school, count your blessings.
playball50,
You got it!
quote:
A partial scholarship at a dream school, with a quality baseball program may be a better fit than a full ride at another school.
quote:
If it gives your son the opportunity to play baseball at the next level, or possibly his dream school, count your blessings.
You got it!
quote:
Originally posted by FormerObserver:
As informative as this site is, a complete understanding of the recruiting process, doesn't really happen until it's over.
That, my friend, is as accurate as it gets.
Anyone out there with a 2nd-time-around experience? If so, were you able to anticiapate everything? Most things?
We went through it twice, but for it to be compared, both times would have to be close to the same, and they were not. The first time was easier than the second, because there was only one solid offer where the school showed a lot of interest. We took the offer 
. The second time there were many more choices and we went over a lot more do's and don'ts before making a decision. I really think that if we had 8 kids that received offers, it would not necessarily be easier or harder......each situation is different.
. The second time there were many more choices and we went over a lot more do's and don'ts before making a decision. I really think that if we had 8 kids that received offers, it would not necessarily be easier or harder......each situation is different.