Showcase/Camp/Combine/Pro tryout

Fungo,
Have been wondering that myself since son was in HS.

Fungo

Great point

Perhaps our resident expert DIBBLE can explain the differences

Dibble,
I deleted your post because I felt as if "advertisements" for multiple events would only confuse the average poster. I'd like to read in your own words the difference.
Thanks,
Fungo

quote:

I'd like to read in your own words the difference.

Good luck with that one Fungo!

LMAO

"Son I can't today. My knees hurt"

I think there is enough articles on the subject on the HS baseball web clearly posted for even a caveman to figure out the difference

Dibble, once again... you have offended us.



Will people ever learn?

Fungo;

The lines are "blurred". The result is not!

In 1987, when I started the 1st Area Code games and 1983 the Japan/America Goodwill Series, life and expectations for "simple" to define. The pro scouts selected the players for the games and we played 6-8 games in four days. The players tools were evaluated and recorded without a public report.

That is a "Scouting combine". The players did not pay to participate, however the college coaches and pro scouts who did not coach the teams did pay for field cost, umpires, baseballs and hotels for the pro scouts/coaches.

From our tryouts [12 each year], the pro scouts, MLSB and college coaches invited
players to their pro tryouts [no charge] and college camps [a fee].

Because of the desire by players and parents for written evaluation and the quest for the D-1 partial scholarship, the emergence of the "showcase".

PG has risen to the top as the best "showcase" which has produced the results desired by players and parents and college coaches.

Because of this "showcase" mentally, the 16-18 year old baseball player has not learned the "inside game", the art of "sensing" and "creativity" necessary to compete on the International or professional level.

In December, when we travel to Australia for 30 games in 18 days against the best players in Australia, our American and Cincinnati Reds teams, coached by professional scouts, observed by professional scouts, filmed by professional TV and their performances and their learning ability communicated to specific coaches and media.

This environment is for high school players; the opportunity for teaching and competition
equals development. There is no pressure,
learning to be creative is "fun".

Bob Williams

quote:

Originally posted by Consultant:


Because of this "showcase" mentally, the 16-18 year old baseball player has not learned the "inside game", the art of "sensing" and "creativity" necessary to compete on the International or professional level.

Bob,

I dont understand that portion of your post.
Not saying I agree or disagree - but would like to read more of your reasoning and observations.

Speaking for myself as a BB dad and former coach - I certainly havent emphasized showcase baseball over learning the game and acquiring a "feel" for the game. But showcases sure are fun IMO - and provide great opportunities for kids to show their stuff IMO.

Its in the game;
When we observe the high school player today
as compared to our years with Edmonds, Dimitri and Delmon Young, Torri Hunter and many others, I ask myself the questions.

Has any player ask his coach how to hit the "slider"? How to "read the bat", how to evaluate the hitter when pitching.

I recall, 4 years ago in Adelaide, South Australia, Delmon, age 15 was telling the two 18 year old hitters, exactly how the pitcher was going to pitch to them.

Research, study the great hitters or pitchers [read books], intelligence, focus and sensing
will provide a foundation for improvement.

Bob

Bob,

I certainly would agree with that.

I always believed that reasoned anticipation of an individual situation was as important as the physical skills a player might have.

If you are saying that critical aspect of the game is overlooked at showcases - I would agree in most cases.

Bob,
Not trying to read between the lines but are you saying that showcases have hurt the player in his ability to play the game? Or could it simply be the large number of Showcases, Camps, Combines, and Pro tryouts are competing for same talented players and diverting the talent elsewhere? If so, is that bad for the player or is it bad for the event planners? I really don't know.
Fungo

Fungo;

There is the "dilution" effect, however the showcases, travel teams, college camps have all presented creditable reasons for their existence. Baseball teaches everyone to make adjustments.

Showcases are a stage for presenting talent.
When I operated the AC games for 19 years, I had only two goals. One is to selected the best talent available and second was to adjust to the audience [scouts, coaches and agents] demands and desires. For several years, we invited former ML players to provide clinical information. One year, we had Dusty Baker, Eric Davis and several other professional hitting instructors. Eric controlled the clinic, no one else could offer comments. Eric Davis said quite simply
"AT A SHOWCASE YOU KNOW WHAT COMING, A FASTBALL" "THEN TURN THE BAT LOOSE, SWING HARD"!

The point is that in showcase, you learn to adjust to the desires of the audience.

In a series of games to learn to compete and hopefully to win. You learn your role on the team, if it can be properly defined by the coach.

A successful player is like the Japanese lady in the movie "Mr. Baseball". Take the best from all cultures and make it your own.
The Japanese have a word. "canti"

Bob

Bob,

It would be hard to argue with that.

But I dont think we can deny that it all follows the larger trend.

The larger trend is a cornerback in football - who has been beat all day - and his team is losing by 40 points - and then he makes a tackle and does a dance.

Or the big slugger - whose team is getting hammered - hitting a homer and staying at home plate and admiring it - even though his team has just been embarassed on the field.

The team thing isnt the focus anymore - so I dont think you can expect most kids to go that route. Some do - but most - as you say - adapt to their environment IMO.

Its in the game;
what you are now discussing is "leadership" by players, coaches, parents and scouts.

The cornerback who dances is showing off his team and the other team. The next play this cornerback will receive a message from the "tight end".

A Korean shortstop hit a HR off our American pitcher in the Seoul, Korea ML stadium and then proceed to walk around the bases. Our pitcher, who later became a UCLA coach "drilled" the next batter. I was sitting with the officials of Japan and Korea behind home plate. The Korean officers turned and stated
"Americans play rough" On the very next play the Korean runner ran to 2b on a double play, however he did not slide.

Micah our 2b from Oakland did not flinch he threw the ball into the runner's head and he was later carried off on a stretcher. Micah is still playing professional USA ML, Korea, Japan. Eddie Bane, now Scouting Director of the Angels was our coach.

Our players exhibited leadership and creativity. This is International Baseball.

Their maybe fewer "team players", however I will never stop from finding these mentally
tough players. "Baseball teaches life".

Bob Williams

Bob,

I agree - and I sincerely hope that the pendulum swings back to that type of play at the levels beneath the pros.

(I do think that once you get to the pro level - not too much has changed over the years - as the cream rises to the top - and the rest just gets discarded regardless of influence/connections).

We shall see.