CSG,
I'll throw my two cents in if you want some advice. I think you should just let it ride out, who cares that your son got yelled at one time? You said the kid's a freshman and got moved up to the sophmore team and you were mad they changed his position. Maybe they wanted his bat and the sophmore 1b had worked hard for 2 years and has some tools, they moved your kid to catcher and 3b to get him some innings there and looking to the next year where they can play them both. And they believe in the soph 1b. I think you should be greatful your son got moved up, who cares what position he's playing as long as he's hitting and seeing some better pitching. If you really didn't want him switching positions then you should have told the coach you wanted him moved back to the freshman team playing his normal position. This is a HUGE assumption on my part but it sounds like your mad he moved positions even though he moved up a level, maybe your son was mad too and showed it on the field either by mumbling under his breath, playing half hearted, whatever and that's what caused the coach to take him aside and yell at him and call him selfish because instead of enjoying being on the sophmore team he was complaining about where he WASNT playing. Sounds like he will be a good one and now your on Varsity you don't have to deal with the freshman or sophmore coach anymore so let it be and forget about it.
Buster Posey the 5th pick in the draft from Florida St was a shortstop his entire career, I imagine that he was his best player on his H.S team since he's at Florida St, then after a few years there they realized he'd have a better shot at getting drafted behind the plate and he'd help the team because they can play their new stud freshman at SS and they probably needed a catcher. He didn't complain, made the switch for the better of the team and improved his draft position. More people need to pay attention to stories like that and not worry where they are playing but appreciate the fact they are playing at all and getting ABs and exposure over the summer. That's my two cents.
You stated you did a lesson with this young man?
I assume you took his money??
I assume you took his money??
Yes, I have been giving hitting lessons for about 15 years for grand slam, started out working for baseball schools USA and stayed involved from there.
CSG, contact the Varsity Coach, have a meeting with the two coaches (Varsity and Sophomore), your son and yourself. Voice your concerns. Simple
Payball2 – That might work in your program, but not in most schools and I no for a fact not in my sons. That is what this whole thread is about.
Why not?
read my suggestion.
Because in our school, our kids are told that the coaches will not deal with the parents. If the player has a problem, he or she should take it up with the coach.
What are the requirements necessary to become a high school baseball coach in IL .... don't they first have to be a teacher in the district and then have to pass a first aid test or something like that?
Nails – It was not about the position he played, it was the fact that he was called up and did not see the playing time. He would play any position he is asked to play and he did. And the kid who was getting the innings never played first base before and it showed.
quote:Originally posted by CSG:
Nails – It was not about the position he played, it was the fact that he was called up and did not see the playing time. He would play any position he is asked to play and he did. And the kid who was getting the innings never played first base before and it showed.
CSG join the athletic booster club.
I believe the only requirement is the ACEP certification.
CSG, Didn't the coach approach you?
CSG, Didn't the coach approach you?
thought you said he was pitching and DHing......I think the lower levels are designed to see what you got, move kids around, then try to win. Now your criticizing the other kid........maybe the coach wanted to give the kid a fair chance before he benches him so he doesn't have a parent complaining tha the didn't give him a chance. I wouldn't worry about it, sound like he played. I'd worry about what he did to get the other coach so mad that he felt he had to take him aside and yell at him for being selfish, get to the bottom of that. Then decide if your son needs to change his attitude a little bit or if it really is the coach and just be glad your not playing for him next year.
Play Dog – That’s pretty funny, My wife just accepted the position of secretary of the booster club. No perks yet and we really don’t want it that way.
Playball2 – No coach they have not.
Playball2 – No coach they have not.
coaches shouldn't have to explain to parents what they are doing or why they are doing it. I sure the kid knows what he did and it was spelled out to him in the conversation. I am glad to see a HS coach use his entire roster, especially at the sophmore level and if that causes your son to sit 7-8 games out of a 20 game schedule so be it. I sure there were kids that sat out more games than that.
Nails - I am not trying to disrespect any of your comments, but did you really read the post. I am talking about a freshman that sat way too much at the upper level that might have been better playing with his class. And am I in no way putting anyone down, the player I spoke of was actually are best hitter on the team and it affected him at the plate. The basis of my post was how a so-called Teacher/Coach could do this to a Student/Athlete. Which leads into the topic of this whole thread.
quote:Originally posted by Nails:
I'd worry about what he did to get the other coach so mad that he felt he had to take him aside and yell at him for being selfish, get to the bottom of that. Then decide if your son needs to change his attitude a little bit or if it really is the coach and just be glad your not playing for him next year.
Nails - as his travel coach, I can assure you and everyone else that his HS coach is an absolute idiot for calling this kid uncoachable. He is one of the most respectful, thankful, and accomodating young men I have ever coached...not to mention extremely talented. Just another example of the player being more qualified than his coach.
I read everything. I don't know what exactly sitting way too much means. All I know is he was on the sophmore team and playing. I honestly don't even know how it affected him at the plate.......and you or the kid could have suggested to be moved back down. I am assuming your saying his benching or strictly DHing affected him at the plate.
Good discussion and civil. Thanks, I appreciate that. I think I can chime in with some thoughts as well. I think I might be qualified. Have I coached HS? Yes 20+ years. Have I coached Legion? YUP! Junior Legion? YUP. Little League? YUP!
First we don't have the HS league down in our area that you do. I do understand that there is a stipend on that. Could anyone verify that. I'd appreciate it. If so, you see at least a portion of the HS coach's request that his players play for him. I've never understood wanting to have my best players play for me during the summer via Legion if they can find better competition. I do/have worried at times about the coach of those teams. You ask why travel coaches and HS coaches can't get along. Many do and do so with great communication. I've had some of my kids play for SIBullets. I'd trust him with all my kids. I've had kids play for Rick Strickland and the St. Louis Pirates. Again, I trust Rick. I've also had kids play for another organization and I wouldn't trust that coach at all. I think it amazing how some players can play for a summer program and then, the players register at certain private institutions. I'm sure you all know that that practice goes on. Thus some lack of trust. What needs to happen is for those coaches and the coaches for those summer teams to meet and get to know one another and set up avenues for communication. I know that SIBullets sent me updates via emails and we had phone conversations. That is how it should be. The bonus for my program was that those kids I was left with were mostly younger playing "up" in the summer. In turn, that also opened up positions on the Jr. Legion Team. I was able to coach them more and so, they were prepared to give the starters a run for their money when tryouts occurred. That kept my program strong. It is really very simple, what is the best thing for the player! If the adults can get along and find out what the player wants, everyone will benefit. JMHO!
I edited this to add comments on coaches and what they do. Comments in this thread paint all coaches with a broad brush. That isn't the case at all. For example, we ran a plyo program at 6:30 in the morning 3 days a week. We ran a weight program. We set up open gyms. In short, we spent a considerable amount of time in the off season giving our players opportunities to improve their abilities. All things were done within the constraints of the IHSA Guidelines. I think that many coaches do the same.
First we don't have the HS league down in our area that you do. I do understand that there is a stipend on that. Could anyone verify that. I'd appreciate it. If so, you see at least a portion of the HS coach's request that his players play for him. I've never understood wanting to have my best players play for me during the summer via Legion if they can find better competition. I do/have worried at times about the coach of those teams. You ask why travel coaches and HS coaches can't get along. Many do and do so with great communication. I've had some of my kids play for SIBullets. I'd trust him with all my kids. I've had kids play for Rick Strickland and the St. Louis Pirates. Again, I trust Rick. I've also had kids play for another organization and I wouldn't trust that coach at all. I think it amazing how some players can play for a summer program and then, the players register at certain private institutions. I'm sure you all know that that practice goes on. Thus some lack of trust. What needs to happen is for those coaches and the coaches for those summer teams to meet and get to know one another and set up avenues for communication. I know that SIBullets sent me updates via emails and we had phone conversations. That is how it should be. The bonus for my program was that those kids I was left with were mostly younger playing "up" in the summer. In turn, that also opened up positions on the Jr. Legion Team. I was able to coach them more and so, they were prepared to give the starters a run for their money when tryouts occurred. That kept my program strong. It is really very simple, what is the best thing for the player! If the adults can get along and find out what the player wants, everyone will benefit. JMHO!
I edited this to add comments on coaches and what they do. Comments in this thread paint all coaches with a broad brush. That isn't the case at all. For example, we ran a plyo program at 6:30 in the morning 3 days a week. We ran a weight program. We set up open gyms. In short, we spent a considerable amount of time in the off season giving our players opportunities to improve their abilities. All things were done within the constraints of the IHSA Guidelines. I think that many coaches do the same.
At our hs there is a stipend for coaching summer baseball, as there is a stipend for coaching other hs sports that run summer leagues, camps, etc. We run or summer baseball during the day (late mornings)tuesday thru thursday and this gives the players the weeknites and weekends for travel baseball and other sports, i.e. basketball leagues, football passing camps, etc.
quote:Originally posted by Gamer:
At our hs there is a stipend for coaching summer baseball, as there is a stipend for coaching other hs sports that run summer leagues, camps, etc. We run or summer baseball during the day (late mornings)tuesday thru thursday and this gives the players the weeknites and weekends for travel baseball and other sports, i.e. basketball leagues, football passing camps, etc.
Thank you for keeping the kids interest in mind during the summer coach.
Some of the other premadonas that think their **** does not stink should pay attention.
Now lets playball!
I have enjoyed reading all the posts about travel vs. H.S. ball. My son is a perfect example of a high school coach/system that failed. Long story short: Last summer when he played travel ball his HS coach told him that he could not do both. He has been a starter since frosh year and done well for his team each year.In the end he was pretty much benched this year (junior year/varsity) as a direct result of his coaches displeasure with his decision to play travel ball last summer. The coach openly discussed his problem with travel ball and called it nothing more than park district baseball. I just have one thing to say, our high school coach has made no effort whatsoever to help players pursue collegiate baseball hopes. If you have a boy that has these aspirations, shouldn't evreyone team up and help these kids wherever and whenever they can? I would think it would be a feather in their cap to see a young man move on from their HS program and play college baseball. And as far as approaching our high school administrators, forget about it! Parents should be seen and not heard at our school. My son has lost a lot of desire to play ball. In the end the coach hurt himself by not playing my son. If my son can compete and perform on the national level(and an honor roll student as well), wouldn't a HS coach want this kid on the field playing for him? Let's face it, there are good and bad coach's at all levels.
Coachb25 just made the best comment in his last post that ive heard a high school coach make in a long time on this board and most certainly in this thread ....." Ive never understood wanting to have one of my best players play summer ball for me when he can play against better competition with the travel team " Hurray ! Hurray ! A high school coach who sees the light and sees things for what they are . NO EGO INVOLVED ...JUST DOING WHAT IS BEST FOR THE PLAYER ..NOT HIMSELF . His high school summer team will actually survive without this player/players for a few games . I just knew there had to be some HS coaches on here that made some sense . All of that other bunk that we have had to endure on here from the other HS guys is just that ..bunk . Trying to make things more complicated for the player ..when it should be so very simple. Common sense has prevailed .
Alco
Obviously your sons coach is not acting in his best interest . No way should a coach try to tell a player he cant play on another team to try to improve by playing against better competition . I would request a meeting with the coach to hash it out . If you cant come to some sort of an arrangement i would consider getting your son elsewhere depending how important this is to your son .JMO
Alco
Obviously your sons coach is not acting in his best interest . No way should a coach try to tell a player he cant play on another team to try to improve by playing against better competition . I would request a meeting with the coach to hash it out . If you cant come to some sort of an arrangement i would consider getting your son elsewhere depending how important this is to your son .JMO
Thanks Sully,
We already did that and the coach was not happy that we intervined. He would just assume take it out on our son and watch him be miserable from the bench. A very sad situation.
We already did that and the coach was not happy that we intervined. He would just assume take it out on our son and watch him be miserable from the bench. A very sad situation.
In another sad note, my son has no confidence to play this summer with his travel team as he virtually no at bats and even less time on the field during HS ball. It really took the wind out of his sail at a very crucial time of his baseball (jr. year).
I would consider a transfer
Trust me, we have considered it! Moving my whole family for my son to play his senior year of high school is not really an option. It is a lesson he will live with forever & hopefully learn how to treat people.
quote:Ive never understood wanting to have one of my best players play summer ball for me when he can play against better competition with the travel team "
Sullitiger, find where it says that any of the coaches who responded on this board are against players wanting to play travel baseball and post it. It didn't happen. The original post was why HS Coaches want travel players to play with them. I think the coaches answered the questions relative to the original posts.
By CoachB25 own admission and respectfully to him, he has never had to be put in that situation because they do not have high school summer league.
His comment speaks for itself . Basically ..go ahead and play against the better competition . Twist it around any way you want but im confident the other posters will understand my point of view despite what you say. As far as the HS coach wanting the travel player to play with him ..thats fine as long as hes allowed to do both . No reason why that cant be worked out . Shouldnt be so complicated
The gist of coachbs comment is very clear
The gist of coachbs comment is very clear
quote:Trust me, we have considered it! Moving my whole family for my son to play his senior year of high school is not really an option. It is a lesson he will live with forever & hopefully learn how to treat people.
ALCO - Check to see if yor sons school meets AYP standards, a lot of schools in DuPage county do not and allows a student to transfer.
I think players should play and coaches should coach. IF a player coaches or a coach plays, we have a world that is mixed up. If a coach plays and coaches then we have players that cannot be coached or play without fearing that a player may be their coach or a coach that may be a teammate. Coaches and players must be separate and distinct. If Whitney Young had Prairie Ridge's players they would be IHSA champs but only if their coach was able to be the catcher for both teams.
quote:Originally posted by CSG:
ALCO - Check to see if yor sons school meets AYP standards, a lot of schools in DuPage county do not and allows a student to transfer.
CSG: That's an interesting concept.
Thank you CSG-I will!!!!
Wasn't Don Kessinger a player-Coach. Different thread norfrank
I once saw Dopn Kessinger leave his position at shortstop; go into the dugout and put on his warm up jacket. He then went to the mound, replaced the pitcher, went back to the dugout and took off the jacket and went back to his position. I think he had AYP but not sure.
quote:Originally posted by Playball2:
By CoachB25 own admission and respectfully to him, he has never had to be put in that situation because they do not have high school summer league.
No, we don't. Our option is to develop our teams via Legion programs. We do not get a stipend for that. We are prohibited so much more than coaches in the north. Really, there is no way a southern team should ever win state. You guys get to coach your teams for 30 more games a year than us.
What we get to do is have our legion team be comprised exclusively of our school players. Until just recently we didn't even allow graduated players to come back. Our motivation, at least at my school could be summed up in my job interview years ago and said by our AD, "Coach Butler, if you take this position, there are expectations. If you do not meet those expectations, you'll be released." I wrote that one down and put it on my computer desktop. Again, we encouraged our best players to play for SIBullets and/or the St. Louis Pirates. We were able to win a lot of games that way in HS referencing how we used our legion program to build skills in the other players.
Playball, would this be a situation where your job was in jeapordy should you not win in the summer? I'm sincere in this question since it is so foreign to me. I will concede this point, any parent that feels that their sons are being forced to play on any team has the option of turning in that program to the IHSA. I will agree that my perspective is not the same as a coach from the north. I do state that my approach would not have changed. I loved getting to deal with the young players before it really counted. I loved building a good repoire with them before I had to be the hardnosed head coach. I loved knowing exactly where we stood going into our off season lifting and plyo programs. JMHO!
Pete Rose was a player-coach.
That worked out well.
That worked out well.
I was recently told that high school baseball is not about winning. Winning is a bonus and the relationships you build with your coach & teammates, academics, friends and time management are what it is all about. I agree completely. It is just a shame that some coaches feel that the year is a total loss if the players don't meet their standards as far as playing on teams other than their own HS team.
Coach B, Do I have to run a summer program? Yes, Is it the best interest of our program to run one? Yes would I be released if I did not run a summer program? Probably (for a lack of commitment). We do have a legion team around, I was offered the position with the understanding that the team have a fair representation of the three high schools that the legion team can draw from. I declined the position. I have not and will not ever tell a kid they can't play, I have and will continue to put forward my input with regard to their mental makeup and it's necessity to play at a higher level. I currently, have two players on weekend travel programs one of which is Sparky's.
I believe that there is a chance that your perspective would change given a particular set of circumstances. The same exclusivity you were given for legion is the same reason HS coaches are getting ripped for on this thread. How is that?
Each situation presents a different set of circumstances. A large number of my players are multiple sport athletes who already miss games for basketball contest and football 7 on 7's.
Last year my CF was the 13th round draft pick of the Pittsburgh Pirates who played at an extremely high level of travel. That year (summer of '06) in the regional final we lost to Loyola 1-0 (The year Loyola played in the summer state championship and fired their coach) My CF went to the east coast to play in a huge tournament. Do I think he was the difference maker in the loss, yes. Did I make a decision in the best interest of the player? yes. A program that I owe nothing to? yes. My team and program? no. But I decided long ago that I would never put a player in the middle.
However, I won't sit idle and watch persons of travel baseball (be it parents or coaches) devalue or deface the importance of our programs in the development of young lives. Something that has happened repeated through this post. If I stand alone, I stand alone, so be it.
I believe that there is a chance that your perspective would change given a particular set of circumstances. The same exclusivity you were given for legion is the same reason HS coaches are getting ripped for on this thread. How is that?
Each situation presents a different set of circumstances. A large number of my players are multiple sport athletes who already miss games for basketball contest and football 7 on 7's.
Last year my CF was the 13th round draft pick of the Pittsburgh Pirates who played at an extremely high level of travel. That year (summer of '06) in the regional final we lost to Loyola 1-0 (The year Loyola played in the summer state championship and fired their coach) My CF went to the east coast to play in a huge tournament. Do I think he was the difference maker in the loss, yes. Did I make a decision in the best interest of the player? yes. A program that I owe nothing to? yes. My team and program? no. But I decided long ago that I would never put a player in the middle.
However, I won't sit idle and watch persons of travel baseball (be it parents or coaches) devalue or deface the importance of our programs in the development of young lives. Something that has happened repeated through this post. If I stand alone, I stand alone, so be it.