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A few takeaways:
1) don't try to pitch through an injury
2) if you lose your commitment, don't go to the press to talk about it. That just isn't a good look. If the press contacts you, just say "no comment". And by all means Daddy shouldn't be commenting on the situation in the press, that's just really not a good look.
3) a good reminder that nothing is official until the NLI is signed
4) don't try to pitch, or play, through injury.
3and2Fastball posted:A few takeaways:
1) don't try to pitch through an injury
2) if you lose your commitment, don't go to the press to talk about it. That just isn't a good look. If the press contacts you, just say "no comment". And by all means Daddy shouldn't be commenting on the situation in the press, that's just really not a good look.
3) a good reminder that nothing is official until the NLI is signed
4) don't try to pitch, or play, through injury.
Number 2.....Agree....100%.....and especially....don't do this:
His dad hopes his son might still land in the Pac-12. That would give him extra incentive when he faced UA.
Number 3....also agree 100%
#1 and #4.....agree somewhat as not all situations are the same.....BUT....in this kids case, it seems like someone, anyone....should have told the kid and the parents....don't risk it...get it fixed or rest it and be ready to head to AZ
3and2Fastball posted:A few takeaways:
1) don't try to pitch through an injury
2) if you lose your commitment, don't go to the press to talk about it. That just isn't a good look. If the press contacts you, just say "no comment". And by all means Daddy shouldn't be commenting on the situation in the press, that's just really not a good look.
3) a good reminder that nothing is official until the NLI is signed
4) don't try to pitch, or play, through injury.
Great points:
Question, do you think he was in no man's land in terms of getting the NLI from Arizona?
Buckeye 2015 posted:3and2Fastball posted:A few takeaways:
1) don't try to pitch through an injury
2) if you lose your commitment, don't go to the press to talk about it. That just isn't a good look. If the press contacts you, just say "no comment". And by all means Daddy shouldn't be commenting on the situation in the press, that's just really not a good look.
3) a good reminder that nothing is official until the NLI is signed
4) don't try to pitch, or play, through injury.
Number 2.....Agree....100%.....and especially....don't do this:
His dad hopes his son might still land in the Pac-12. That would give him extra incentive when he faced UA.
Number 3....also agree 100%
#1 and #4.....agree somewhat as not all situations are the same.....BUT....in this kids case, it seems like someone, anyone....should have told the kid and the parents....don't risk it...get it fixed or rest it and be ready to head to AZ
Do you think Arizona would have signed him with no NLI? Or should he have held off the High School season and wait for summer ball to show what he had in the tank?
So anyone in the recruiting process who doesn’t get it ...
The Arizona coach makes 500K per year plus incentives. He keeps his job and supports his family and lifestyle off this income. He’s not going to risk it with injured players he can walk away from.
Rule 1 about recruiting: It’s a business, then it’s a sport.
CollegebaseballInsights posted:Buckeye 2015 posted:3and2Fastball posted:A few takeaways:
1) don't try to pitch through an injury
2) if you lose your commitment, don't go to the press to talk about it. That just isn't a good look. If the press contacts you, just say "no comment". And by all means Daddy shouldn't be commenting on the situation in the press, that's just really not a good look.
3) a good reminder that nothing is official until the NLI is signed
4) don't try to pitch, or play, through injury.
Number 2.....Agree....100%.....and especially....don't do this:
His dad hopes his son might still land in the Pac-12. That would give him extra incentive when he faced UA.
Number 3....also agree 100%
#1 and #4.....agree somewhat as not all situations are the same.....BUT....in this kids case, it seems like someone, anyone....should have told the kid and the parents....don't risk it...get it fixed or rest it and be ready to head to AZ
Do you think Arizona would have signed him with no NLI? Or should he have held off the High School season and wait for summer ball to show what he had in the tank?
I don't understand the question? There's no way to know....did throwing thru the injury make any difference? Would he have gotten back to 92-95 if he had stopped? Who knows....injuries happen. Some guys come back as good as they were before. Some don't. You can't "sign someone without an NLI". The NLI is the "signing". They offered him a chance as a walk on, so it seems like they at least were still interested enough to see if he could make it back. If he shows up at AZ next fall and is back to 92-94, the fact he is a walk on wouldn't have mattered....he'd have been throwing. He says "he felt better this summer"...but was at 86. Will another year get him back to 95? Again, who knows. If it does, he'll have plenty of opportunites. You have to wonder what, if any communication he had with AZ all summer? This is part of the problem with signing early. You get your heart set on a school and then something happens, in this case an injury. He is throwing 86 now.....AZ doesn't sign guys throwing 86 so he's not getting signed. It's a sucky situation but if he hadn't committed and waited until this summer....he would still be getting limited looks because of the 86. It's nobody's fault....AZ liked what they saw when he was in the low-mid 90's. They don't like it at 86.....as would be the case with most other P5 programs. Again, I'm not blaming either side....it happens.
I hear you, but after reading the article I don't think the PSA and father came off that bad (except for the "extra incentive" comment was cringeworthy LOL). They seemed pretty accepting and matter of fact about it. Still good advice not to talk with the press in general about this, but I have to admit that part of me does like articles of this type because it is a real life illustration that an oral commitment is not binding and that DI programs can and will pull an offer. That is, it happens.
The HC went about this the right way to give the PSA an opportunity to catch on elsewhere - not blaming him as he was trying to be forthright. Unfortunately, he may not look the best but the facts are that he pulled the offer and now other PSAs know that this is a possibility at AU.
Qhead posted:I hear you, but after reading the article I don't think the PSA and father came off that bad (except for the "extra incentive" comment was cringeworthy LOL). They seemed pretty accepting and matter of fact about it. Still good advice not to talk with the press in general about this, but I have to admit that part of me does like articles of this type because it is a real life illustration that an oral commitment is not binding and that DI programs can and will pull an offer. That is, it happens.
The HC went about this the right way to give the PSA an opportunity to catch on elsewhere - not blaming him as he was trying to be forthright. Unfortunately, he may not look the best but the facts are that he pulled the offer and now other PSAs know that this is a possibility at AU.
What is a PSA? I hope you don't mean a public service announcement....lol. That's not what the article was. The headline in the paper is misleading....and makes no mention of the injury. Seems like kind of a "shot" at U of A from the start. Making it sound like this is something unique at Arizona (or any other major college) shows a lack of knowledge on the way college recuriting works. It happens all the time, not just at Arizona. Any kid being recruited by a major college and committing as a sophomore (or earlier) knows this. If they don't, they really need to be more knowledgeable about the process BEFORE committing to a college as a 14 or 15 year old kid.
I for one thought the athlete's response was reasonable and while the comment about extra incentive was a bit much, it was pretty understandable. I bet that kid would dream of looking right at the HC as he shuts down his team for the win. Pipe dream for sure, but can't you empathize?
The whole "give the kid a chance to work out elsewhere" is mostly meaningless boilerplate coach-speak. In the end he did what he had to do, absolutely, but let's not award the HC for his high-mindedness and candor.
RJM posted:So anyone in the recruiting process who doesn’t get it ...
The Arizona coach makes 500K per year plus incentives. He keeps his job and supports his family and lifestyle off this income. He’s not going to risk it with injured players he can walk away from.
Rule 1 about recruiting: It’s a business, then it’s a sport.
Correction. He didn't pitch well this summer and they move on.
Buckeye 2015 posted:CollegebaseballInsights posted:Buckeye 2015 posted:3and2Fastball posted:A few takeaways:
1) don't try to pitch through an injury
2) if you lose your commitment, don't go to the press to talk about it. That just isn't a good look. If the press contacts you, just say "no comment". And by all means Daddy shouldn't be commenting on the situation in the press, that's just really not a good look.
3) a good reminder that nothing is official until the NLI is signed
4) don't try to pitch, or play, through injury.
Number 2.....Agree....100%.....and especially....don't do this:
His dad hopes his son might still land in the Pac-12. That would give him extra incentive when he faced UA.
Number 3....also agree 100%
#1 and #4.....agree somewhat as not all situations are the same.....BUT....in this kids case, it seems like someone, anyone....should have told the kid and the parents....don't risk it...get it fixed or rest it and be ready to head to AZ
Do you think Arizona would have signed him with no NLI? Or should he have held off the High School season and wait for summer ball to show what he had in the tank?
I don't understand the question? There's no way to know....did throwing thru the injury make any difference? Would he have gotten back to 92-95 if he had stopped? Who knows....injuries happen. Some guys come back as good as they were before. Some don't. You can't "sign someone without an NLI". The NLI is the "signing". They offered him a chance as a walk on, so it seems like they at least were still interested enough to see if he could make it back. If he shows up at AZ next fall and is back to 92-94, the fact he is a walk on wouldn't have mattered....he'd have been throwing. He says "he felt better this summer"...but was at 86. Will another year get him back to 95? Again, who knows. If it does, he'll have plenty of opportunites. You have to wonder what, if any communication he had with AZ all summer? This is part of the problem with signing early. You get your heart set on a school and then something happens, in this case an injury. He is throwing 86 now.....AZ doesn't sign guys throwing 86 so he's not getting signed. It's a sucky situation but if he hadn't committed and waited until this summer....he would still be getting limited looks because of the 86. It's nobody's fault....AZ liked what they saw when he was in the low-mid 90's. They don't like it at 86.....as would be the case with most other P5 programs. Again, I'm not blaming either side....it happens.
Bottom line. He was at 86 this summer. AZ has moved on.
3and2Fastball posted:A few takeaways:
1) don't try to pitch through an injury
2) if you lose your commitment, don't go to the press to talk about it. That just isn't a good look. If the press contacts you, just say "no comment". And by all means Daddy shouldn't be commenting on the situation in the press, that's just really not a good look.
3) a good reminder that nothing is official until the NLI is signed
4) don't try to pitch, or play, through injury.
To be fair neither dad nor the kid slammed the college for pulling the offer and said they understand why they are concerned.
Probably shouldn't have commented at all but their comments were pretty classy and not taking shots.
But yes, definitely never try to play through an injury. Missed time sucks but better to be seen 2 games at full strength than 30 games impaired by injury.
CollegebaseballInsights posted:RJM posted:So anyone in the recruiting process who doesn’t get it ...
The Arizona coach makes 500K per year plus incentives. He keeps his job and supports his family and lifestyle off this income. He’s not going to risk it with injured players he can walk away from.
Rule 1 about recruiting: It’s a business, then it’s a sport.
Correction. He didn't pitch well this summer and they move on.
No he got injured, was 10+ mph slower than where he had been previously and walked 14 in 13 innings in HS baseball. It was a culmination of things - not so cut and dry that he didn't play well. Either way he's not the player he was expected to be. Even if he was only an 87 guy to begin with and committed to mid major - topping at 77/78 3 months before signing day is a huge problem. This might fly at schools where there isn't money attached but it definitely is not where they can make one phone call and get a healthy 90s guy. He would've been gone at any D1 for the most part, not just Arizona. If anything the coach did this kid a huge favor by letting him know now so he has more time. I don't think it was right for them to run to the papers.
"The whole "give the kid a chance to work out elsewhere" is mostly meaningless boilerplate coach-speak. In the end he did what he had to do, absolutely, but let's not award the HC for his high-mindedness and candor."
The coach did the kid a huge favor.
If the kid begins attending he loses a year and can't transfer and play immediately to D1.
The coach did the same thing at Nevada and UA. By being honest up front he allows the kids the chance to play; might upset parent and player, but better to be eligible to play than heading to a JUCO on the way back to D1.
The coach keeps touch with all his recruits on a constant basis.
Obviously, the mantra of pick the school regardless of baseball didn't happen here. If it did, he would be walking on.
PABaseball posted:CollegebaseballInsights posted:RJM posted:So anyone in the recruiting process who doesn’t get it ...
The Arizona coach makes 500K per year plus incentives. He keeps his job and supports his family and lifestyle off this income. He’s not going to risk it with injured players he can walk away from.
Rule 1 about recruiting: It’s a business, then it’s a sport.
Correction. He didn't pitch well this summer and they move on.
No he got injured, was 10+ mph slower than where he had been previously and walked 14 in 13 innings in HS baseball. It was a culmination of things - not so cut and dry that he didn't play well. Either way he's not the player he was expected to be. Even if he was only an 87 guy to begin with and committed to mid major - topping at 77/78 3 months before signing day is a huge problem. This might fly at schools where there isn't money attached but it definitely is not where they can make one phone call and get a healthy 90s guy. He would've been gone at any D1 for the most part, not just Arizona. If anything the coach did this kid a huge favor by letting him know now so he has more time. I don't think it was right for them to run to the papers.
Correction, as stated by RHN
Rule 1 about recruiting: It’s a business, then it’s a sport.
His velocity was down and the coach moved on.
PSA = Prospective Student Athlete. Sorry I use that meaning the recruit/athlete.
If the kid or his dad hadn't spoken there wouldn't have been a story. Apparently they decided a story worked in their favor instead of against.
Goosegg posted:"The whole "give the kid a chance to work out elsewhere" is mostly meaningless boilerplate coach-speak. In the end he did what he had to do, absolutely, but let's not award the HC for his high-mindedness and candor."
The coach did the kid a huge favor.
If the kid begins attending he loses a year and can't transfer and play immediately to D1.
The coach did the same thing at Nevada and UA. By being honest up front he allows the kids the chance to play; might upset parent and player, but better to be eligible to play than heading to a JUCO on the way back to D1.
The coach keeps touch with all his recruits on a constant basis.
Obviously, the mantra of pick the school regardless of baseball didn't happen here. If it did, he would be walking on.
Possibly, but it sounds like you're giving kudos to the coach for protecting his position (which is understandable) and for spouting the typical boilerplate coach-speech, which as I noted, is not praise worthy. As another poster stated, this really isn't very newsworthy. I agree that the player did not pick the school over baseball.
Not a huge fan of Jay Johnson. Didn’t like his coaching style when sons team played him when he was at Reno. I must say though, he gets the most from his players and has done a good job at AZ.
That said, he did this kid a favor. Why go where you know you are not one of their guys. Move on and find a better fit.
Regarding the press. Today’s world is all about social media and telling everyone your business. This is just another example. I sure once he lands somewhere else that there will be another social media blast.