The Height Factor

The heading is "Surprise, surprise" and the pitcher is described as "just 5'11"". What is the message you're trying to send here, ChicksDig?

D'oh!

I don't think the "surprise, surprise" title was because of his height. I got the impression that it was because he "put himself on the map" with his outing.

Size matters.

Simple as that.

For every 5'11" kid that does that, there are 6,872,493 other right handers that do that and they are all 6'2" in high school--and taller!

I read an article years ago about a scout who said he wouldn't go to see a pitcher under 6 ft. I have no idea if this was just one guy, but it seems the attitude behind it is common.

Too bad - I often wonder if Joe Morgan would be "discovered" by today's scouting. I've met him and he's definitely a little guy. Also a very nice guy. Was my favorite player as a kid.

Last year I posted an under 6' all star team. I also reviewed (take my word for it, my wife thinks I spend too much time on hsbbweb already)every mlb 40 man roster and 40% of the rosters were made up of guys 6' or less (a lot of the sixfooters listed probably were not) excluding pitchers of course. So the point being, to respond to justbaseball, yes they/scouts are probably missing the next Morgan, Rose, Maddux etc. because they "scout" with a tape measure, stop watch, and radar gun rather than determining if a kid can play.

Conserve fuel...starve a terrorist!

Last I checked height was not one of the 5 tools needed to play baseball. However I am sure there is a lot of lets say vertical discrimination going on in scouting and coaching circles. Maybe that explains why shorter players tend to hustle a little more and are just generally scraper players.

If you remove pitchers from the equation and remeasure all those guys that say they are 6'0, you will see a much higher % of players under 6'0 playing professional baseball than people think.

I think however that the 40 man MLB roster will show that big does count, and that percentage of shorter players will go down from that overall percentage.

I also did some informal research on height on MLB 40 man rosters, and I just went back and reviewed it.... These number +/- one or two... but not more than that.

Based on rosters currently Posted in USA Today website. 1-20-04
(not all current rosters have 40 players listed) Approximately Out of ~1300 players...

194 were listed as under 6' or about 15%
Of those 39 were listed as UNDER 5'10" or about 3%

14 LHP were under 6' or 1%
19 RHP were under 6' or 1.5%

I didn't count total number of Pitchers but can estimate approx 600 or so So we are talking only 6% of pitchers are under 6 foot tall....

There were 76 infielders and 63 outfielders under 6'

Again, These are the LISTED hieghts and BASEBALL is notorious for reporting Height as "taller" than actual....

Percentages tell us that is would be BEST to be 6' or taller.... Especially as a Pitcher.

The Seattle Mariners had the most sub 6' players, 11 ... or 27.5%

As the parents of sub-6-footers, I've heard this ad nauseum:

If you're little, you have to prove over and over again you can play. If you're big, you have to prove you can't play.

Baseball players come in all shapes and sizes from 160lb. Casey Fossom to 260lb sub-6 footer Bartolo Colon.

If you sat David Eckstine on Pudge Rodriguez shoulders would he be taller than Richey Sexton?

Let the fans and the scouts and the naysayers with tape measures (LOL) worry about the height thing.

The player just needs to worry about hitting the h*** out of the ball - throwing it hard and accurately, running like the wind and catching everything.

I know alot of tall guys that stink - and alot of "short" guys that are great.

I am with "ITS" here on tyhis one

If the kid can play there will be a spot for him at the high school and college level-- for the pros it gets a bit more difficult but it can happen.

TRhit

I counted 105 6 footers or smaller on the 40 man rosters of Anaheim through Houston, I kept on thru Montreal (just picking out highlights) but here are some names of the vertically challenged:
Colon, Ramon Ortiz, Eckstein, R.Alomar, TEJADA, Mora, Foulke, PEDRO, Williamson, NOMAR, Millar, Mueller,MANNY,T.Walker, SOSA,Magglio Ordonez, Graves, Lidle, Larkin, Burnitz, Castillo, Pierre, OSWALT,Ausmus, BAGWELL, BIGGIO,Berroa, LoDuca, Podsednick, O. Cabrera, VIDRO, Wilkerson, Bergeron...........

Conserve fuel...starve a terrorist!

njbbdad, you can add Aaron, Mays, Mantle, R.Allen, Berra, Campanella, Bret Boone,G. Brett, Brock, Buckner, Carew, Cash, Cey, Garvey, Clemente, Morgan and a whle bunch more.

BeenthereIL,

quote:

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Size matters.

Simple as that.

For every 5'11" kid that does that, there are 6,872,493 other right handers that do that and they are all 6'2" in high school--and taller!

---

Are you saying that there are more 6'2" right handers than 5'11" righthanders in high school and because of that "size matters" to someone?
or
Are you saying that there are 6,872,493 other right handers that do that and they are all 6'2" and therefore will also go to the Area Code Games and put their names on the map as well?

Knowledge is Power! Thank you Mavens and HSBBWEB!

No one is saying it can't be done.

What's being said is ..

If you are under 6' you better be D&^$n ... Darn GOOD!.... to make it in the bigs these days.

Because the percentages favor the taller players.

If you are over six feet, you need to be darn good to be a big leaguer too. You have to be darn good to be a big leaguer.

chicks...

Don't know what other way to say it...Bigger is better.

If a high schooler is 5'11" and throwing 86 touching 92...and another high schooler is 6'2" and throwing 86 touching 92, in whom do you think the scout is likely to have more interest?

BeenthereIL,

I would hope that the scout/recruiter would take a little more into consideration than just velocity and height. I think what you are saying is that there is more upside potential with the taller player. However that could be turned around and it could be said that if a taller player has more potential to throw hard, then a shorter player throwing the same velocity must have better mechanics and thus control over his pitches. Do you want to take the risk that you can straighten out the taller players mechanics, which have been ingrained in them over many years. I say go with the better pitcher regardless of height.

Hmmmm...I didn't think that this subject or my answer to the first posting was so "difficult" to understand.

The first post talked about a 5'11" pitcher at the Area Code Games.

All I said was that size matters and scouts are looking for height if velocity and command are the same.

I'm only 6'tall. My son is not a pitcher but is 6'2"+. Scouts said that they "like" his size...."he's tall enough" is a common message.

If you don't believe that size matters, then that is fine. I'm not trying to convince anyone. I just happen to believe, based on my experiences, in high school baseball circles, when kids are being considered for play at the next level, size matters...nothing more and nothing less.

BeenthereIL,

quote:

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Don't know what other way to say it...Bigger is better.

If a high schooler is 5'11" and throwing 86 touching 92...and another high schooler is 6'2" and throwing 86 touching 92, in whom do you think the scout is likely to have more interest?

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I would hope that other factors would come into play at this point and not height alone.

For instance, what about pitching smarts, mound presence and poise, the ability to bunt, better feel for the game, personal character or even the ability to get more batters out.

I would hope the scouts consider other things, but you may be correct, maybe they don't. JMHO

Knowledge is Power! Thank you Mavens and HSBBWEB!

Last year....we met a scout at a game...he introduced himself...asking some basic quesitons..well, I walked up as my hubby and this scout were talking...

After saying hello and almost in the same breath..the scout said, "How tall is he now?"

I answered six foot...

He quickly said, "Do you think he'll get any taller? (keep in mind he was a junior in hs at that time)

I just said, "Well look at his dad, he's 6'4"...

so it obviously is on everyone's minds...

My son is a 6'5 catcher. Before the players on his teams even started throwing or warming up, I would have scouts ask who he was. The reason, I've been told, is longevity. Bigger players do things with less effort and tend to break down less throughout the season.

Scouts are not looking who knows or who doesn't know how to do thinghs at HS level, they are looking for players with natural skills and tools, that they can project in 4 to 5 years in the future. In the minor leagues they are going to learn what they need to learn. If you going to the supermarket to buy turkey and they are selling them for unit and not for weigh, do you choose the smaller or the biger?

"Peace is, the respect for the other people's rights".
Benito Juarez

I would not want to play for a coach that thought my height was more important than my talent. I think if a coach chooses a player because of his height he is probably not a successful coach.

If you have been to a professional baseball game or spring training at any level, stood next to some players, you understand that some not but all players are very tall. They are huge people.

I think that Beenthere's point was that if all things are equal; command, velocity, speed, etc. the bigger player will draw more interest. It makes sense to me.

I was looking at the first 5 rounds of 2003 draft;
17 players under 6'0" were signed.
12 of them are 5'11" (3 INF., 2 catchers, 5 OF, and 2 PIT)
3 of them are 5'10" (2 OF, and 1 LHP)
2 of them are 5'9" ( 1 INF, and 1 OF)
Only 4 of them were signed from HS.
Only three of them are pitchers.
No comments!

"Peace is, the respect for the other people's rights".
Benito Juarez

RACAB...where is that link to find that info? is online?

Thanks, Pam

Texas2004
Go to mlb.com, hit the minors link, clik on 2003 draft and go round by round like I did.

"Peace is, the respect for the other people's rights".
Benito Juarez

thanks...

It really is pretty simple. If you are a five tool player you won't have to worry about your size. If not, well it depends: a one tool player can be a hot item as well - if he can pitch 98 mph - and he won't have to worry about size either.

But the majority of players don't have 5 tools or a super dominate tool. It is not a matter of all things being equal either. Size is like having an extra tool - if you don't have it then you need one or more of those other 5 tools that hopefully the big guy doesn't have.

Ironically it is not your size, but your concern over it that is your biggest hurdle and greatest enemy. Concern can breed worry. The sense of unfairness breeds frustration. Frustration is one of the most powerful and draining emotions there is. It robs a player of energy better spent playing the game.

The best advise I can think to give is put the issue on the back burner where it belongs - work hard, play hard, keep an upbeat and positive attitude and you have a far better chance of the issue not holding you back.

Racabs post on numbers was interesting. 17/150+. Is that more or less than anyone expected.

Maybe, scouts look at height in relationship to a potential frame. HS grads wll most likely not get taller, but will get bigger. All things considered, will a shorter HS player that gains weight lose some of the edge they had when lighter, and will that tall player who gains bulk potentially have more room for improvement. I don't know.

I think scouts have to look at "potential" versus "real time" production. Maybe thats why the height question comes up so often in the scouting process. I'm sure there are many more shorter players that did not get an opportunity to take the next step than tall prospects. Regardless of the over/under numbers, it sure seems to me that there is a tall guy mentality when grading prospects.

...even more interesting is that only 3 of the 150+ players are pitchers under 6 feet tall.

hi everyone, baseball starts here on Monday. I love all the info i get from this site and rarely if ever post anything. However, no matter how wrong we think it is that scouts focus on bigger players, it is a fact. our son is a junior and 6'6" and still growing. He played on one of the better 18u teams in florida this past summer. He was an average player on that team. Any guesses who got the bulk of the attention at the tournaments? I don't say it's right or fair but that is how it is. that doesn't mean a short kid has no chance but they will find it harder to garner attention. thanks for all the great info you fine people share with everyone every day.....by the way baseball starts here on Monday. i grew up in Ohio so i can sympathize with all the people up north.

Hey, tampp...We're hoping to be above -10 by Monday.

Been... care to trade property values for warm weather? On second thought, even at these prices I'll take sunshine!

Height may or maynot be a factor, but does someone have a rack I can stretch my 09 in just in case.

I just took this out my backdoor