They all hit the same!!!

Blinders hinder the vision.

Here we go..........

Please listen to me for just a minute ok. Speed is important especially for CF middle inf. And speed is a great thing and every coach would love to have every player on his team run a 6.4 60. Defensive skills are very important as well and every coach would love to have 9 guys out there that are outstanding defensive players. Being able to hit the ball consistently is very important and every coach would love to have 9 guys in the line up that can mash. But speed is useless unless it gets on base. And the best way to get on base is to be able to hit the ball consistently. So an average runner who can mash will always be more valuable to a coach over a kid that can fly but cant hit. Let me just say a below average runner that can mash is more valuable to me than a kid that can fly that cant hit. Because that kid will drive in the guys that are on base in front of him. That does not mean that speed is not important its just not as important as you apear to want it to be.

They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit.

The other skills are what makes a difference.

limom,
Have you seen your doctor lately...they have wonderful, new medications for your repetitive disorder...I would safely say you are a candidate for a medication change and FYI...while my son is a decent hitter he has NEVER been know for his speed (thunder thighs like his Mom) but he is playing college ball at a D1 school and is better known for his defensive ability...so he gets on base and hopes the next guy will hit and he can make it in

quote:

---

Originally posted by limom84:
They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit. They can all hit.

The other skills are what makes a difference.

---

I got news for you .... if they can ALL HIT, then they haven't faced any pitching. NO .. THEY CAN'T ALL HIT !!!!!

limo

They all hit the same?

NO THEY DON'T-- Does Bonds hit like Ichiro ?-- NO!!!!they both have great stats but they do not hit the same

What is the pitching level that they are facing in HS? Are they all facing the same level?

A .450 BA against poor pitching is not the same as a .450 BA against good pitching


As I have said before to you-- not to insult you--BUT-- you are way off base again--

Re-read Coach May's post-- he says it all--if a kid has speed and hits he is a gem-- if he has speed and doesn't hit he is a bum.

limom-- I think you should enter the real world at least once a day to see what is going on. May I send you the password to enter?

ASIDE TO LIMOM?---two questions

01--what baseball forums have you been thrown off in the past five years?

02-- Did your AOL chat room subscription expire ?

Please answer truthfully as this will have a bearing on your already damaged credibiltiy rating

Thanx you

You postulate that all hs players hit the same, therefore speed is important. Conversely, I could postulate that all hs players run the same, therefore hitting is important. Both would be wrong, but we can postulate pretty much anything.

If you honestly believe all hs players (even on a single team) hit the same, perhaps you have only heard hs baseball described without ever actually seeing them play.

I know it's a slow time of the year for baseball, but do try to make up a topic that has some grounding in reality. If it were in-season and there was baseball to talk, I know I wouldn't have bothered to post an answer, and I doubt many others would either.

TRHIT

We are talking about the top players in H.S., Kids that can hit and will play in College. Why such negativity about speed and defensive skills? This past H.S. season our team went with a weak hitter at third base but he was great defensively. There were 3 first basemen and 2 DH’s they tried over there that failed miserably, but boy could they hit.

That’s 3 pretty good hitters sitting on the bench.

The level of pitching on Long Island is whatever it is 78 – 85mph 1 or 2 kids 85+.

All I am trying to get across is that if have two boys that hit about the same but one is better defensively and steals 20 bases in 20 attempts, the pick is a no brainer.

Get a grip and just admit I am right.

Don’t insult me again.

I really hate being negative and I know it's obvious, but if no one answers her/his/whatever's posts, then the problem wouldn't exist. I hate to admit it but she/him/whoever must be like one of those sports talk show hosts that have just enough clue (not enough to really know anything) to tick everyone off and invite response. I am not entertained at all and will not play. For my small and probably insignificant part, this is the first and last post I'll make in response to the thread's originator. Cmon join me! We're streaking, we're streaking, cmon everyone we're going to the quad!

I'm not sure what kind of response you want to hear. I'm hardly an expert on baseball, but I have learned that different players have very different roles at the higher levels...and rarely do they "hit the same."

IMHO it's just too simplistic to isolate any one thing that separates players at the higher levels of baseball. There are just too many variables that a coach has to take into consideration when recruiting.

PS. The kid on the bench usually does not play better than anyone else on the team.

Limom,

You need to get your son out into the real world and see some actual baseball played.

When you sight examples of Long Island HS baseball, and postulate on how the rest of the world is exactly how it is in your little world you come off as very naive and silly.

3 Examples for You from the world of HS baseball "outside of Long Island":

• David Adams IF Margate, FL- can't really run (about 7.0) + fields and throws Ok (84 mph arm) + is possibly the best pure hitter in HS for 2005 = Full ride to Virginia
  
  
• Prince Fielder 1B? Milwaukee Brewers (double A)- Can't run at all + Can't field + best hitter in Brewers Organization = $3 Million signing bonus
  
  
• Henry Sanchez 1B Mission Bay HS, CA- can't run at all (7.54) + is just ok defensively + top power hitting prospect in the nation = Full ride to San Diego St + Probable 1st round draft pick.

Do you get it yet LIMOM!?!? There are differences in players abilities...big differences!! Just because you've never been out of Long Island to see them doesn't mean they don't exist!!

I know...I know...everyone on little Johnny's team is no better than little Johnny...My kid is the best ever!!! Right?!?

Go and watch...actually watch (with an unbiased eye) some actual top-level baseball and you'll see what I mean.

limom84

"All I am trying to get across is that if you have two boys that hit about the same but one is better defensively and steals 20 bases in 20 attempts, the pick is a no brainer."

Well, if that is really all you were trying to get across --- why didn't you just say that --instead of saying "The top players in H.S. all hit about the same" & "They can all hit. They can all hit...."

You would have received a completely different set of responses if you had said what you meant to say instead of what you did say.

By the way you also said "This past H.S. season our team went with a weak hitter at third base but he was great defensively" ... How can you have a weak hitter at thrid base if they can all hit -- and all top players hit about the same???? Which is the case????

limom

It was not meant as an insult just PURE UNADULTERATED FACT!!!!

How about you not insulting all of us here with your trash talk and lack of knowledge regarding this great game of baseball!!!!!

Blazer,
Knowing David Adams since he was a little guy, he was one of those who you just knew was going to go far with his bb career. It was evident from a very early age, and that to me is what seperates the men from the boys, even if you are just one of those who hits AND/OR has great speed. He has great presence of the field, that bb "sense" no everyone has and a very nice young man. Does anyone think that coaches or scouts DON"T notice that?
You can be the best hitter or have the best speed, but you need some other things as well (I think they are called tools).
One of our HS players who broke school and county records WAS NOT, I repeat WAS NOT the fastest on the team (he couldn't steal if his life depended on it). However he was a beast at getting the ball over the 375-400ft fence, has a tremendous arm for the OF, led the team in HR,RBI and rarely sat. He struggled his senior year, lots of pressure, but earlier had landed himself a really nice scholarship at an ACC school because he HIT the ball. This summer the beast emerged again and broke team records, not for speed, but for hitting.

Does the originator of this post know that the top HS players in the country usually face 90+ pitchers on a regular basis? Let him/her post away regarding their opinion, what he/she says makes sense in relation to geography. But in the end it is the ones who offer the scholarships, signing bonus, etc. whose opinions really count.

TPMOM,

I had the pleasure of scouting and coaching David Adams this past summer at a showcase event and I have to agree with your assesment of him.

My post was not to take away from David's ability but to illustrate that players without the top "measurable" tools (running speed, arm strength) are sometimes more valuable. For my money David Adams is the player I'd want most if I were a big time college coach.

A bright, humble, kid that's not all about projection but can flat out play.

If you asked me to pick a position player I'd want to start a college program with out of this year's class it'd be Adams!

Mostly because he can flat out rake...but also because he's a super kid.

Blazer,

Exactly my point. If you don't have skills to play other positions than you are competing with these type of players.

There are very few great hitters out there and the rest "HIT THE SAME"!!

Blazer,
Oh wow, that is so neat. David's dad used to be one of my son's coaches and we played together in Margate for years. We had a blast back in those days. I just recently saw them over the summer and was excited to find out he was going to Virginia.
So I could definetly relate to your reference. And yes, he can flat out play!
I think that maybe the original poster may just have a hard time relaying what he/she actually means to say. Or seems to change his/her mind mid thread.

LIMOM,

YOU ARE DELUSIONAL....

You know what they call all the players that "hit the same" (AKA=Can't hit)...They call them ex-players after HS.

Maybe that's what you mean...is that all the very average HS players who can't hit a lick are all the same...in that case yes.

But, those are also the players who's playing days will end with HS baseball!!!

So really what you should say and the title of your post should have been...."THEY ALL (CAN"T HIT) THE SAME"

No matter what level I umpire, be it youth, HS legion or NAIA, there are always 3 types of hitters.

The good, the bad and the ugly..........

They do not hit the same.......

quote:

---

Originally posted by blazer25:

LIMOM,
YOU ARE DELUSIONAL....

You know what they call all the players that "hit the same" (AKA=Can't hit)...They call them ex-players after HS.

Maybe that's what you mean...is that all the very average HS players who can't hit a lick are all the same...in that case yes.

But, those are also the players who's playing days will end with HS baseball!!!

So really what you should say and the title of your post should have been...."THEY ALL (CAN"T HIT) THE SAME"

---

I've figured it out ... this thread is really about pitchers ... there are a few great hitting pitchers out there, but for the most par, they DO hit the same (not at all).

You people are crazy for responding to an obviously disturbed person.

We have all tried and it is useless. I will not post on another topic that Limon starts. It is pointless.

.

Never mind. Why bother.....

To the all knowledgeable on the HSBBW. Try reading my posts first before you make dumb statements. I have never said that hitting is not important.

What I have stated is “THE BEST PLAYERS IN HIGH SCHOOL ALL HIT”, so get a grip all.

What makes one good hitter more desirable than the other? Of course it is the other tools he possesses.

Fielding
Speed
Arm

I guess most of your boys can’t run and struggle defensively

I like limom idea.. made doing my BA stats very easy.

LImom

"I guess most of your boys can't run and struggle defensively"

I didnt want to pull the trigger on this but now you downgrade our kids in general and the time has come to asj this --- what is the story with your son ?--you have never mentioned him--you only talk about your theories and the "scouts" who fill your head with drivel and now you insult us and our sons. That does not fly !!!

I think you are the needing to get a grip--you are truly lost in cyberworld !!!

And that is scary !!!!!

LImom

"I guess most of your boys can't run and struggle defensively"

I didnt want to pull the trigger on this but now you downgrade our kids in general and the time has come to asj this --- what is the story with your son ?--you have never mentioned him--you only talk about your theories and the "scouts" who fill your head with drivel and now you insult us and our sons. That does not fly !!!

I think you are the one needing to get a grip--you are truly lost in cyberworld !!!

And that is scary !!!!!


One more thing--have you seen the likes of Upton, Maybin etc hit ???

Ok I lied I couldnt resist any longer. All the best kids in High School hit the same is what you said. That statement alone shows that you are totally clueless.

Trhit

Consulting Director of College Select Baseball? How could that be? Let’s see if you can choose between the following players.


Of course we know stats mean very little to evaluators, so two players have similar hitting skills, both play the outfield, both get a great jump on the ball, but one has a great arm and runs a 6.8 60yd the other a an average arm and runs a 7.25 60yd.

All knowledgeable one, choose your player!!!!


P.S.

COACH MAY you have no integrity posting again.

Loved the little joke on the PS...yeah, right,

OK, what does 'hit the same' mean? Stats, approach, swing? Does a quality leadoff hitter 'hit the same' as a cleanup hitter? How about the 2,3, & 5 slots -- so they all 'hit the same', too? You talking hr guys or guys who spray the field? Hitting for power or average?

Absolutely all other things being equal, speed would make the difference. However, "all other things" are a lot of things: arm, hit for power, hit for average, fielding, baserunning skills, acumen, makeup, size, projectability, attitude, approach, grades, test scores, eligibility and on and on. Not saying that speed is the least of these, just that an 'all other things being equal' sitch isn't particularly common, and may actually be impossible.

limom

You condescending manner is totally abnoxious and abusive!!!

Your opening remark as to Consulting Director
yea-- You ask How could that be? -- VERY SIMPLE_- that is my positio of responsibility ---that is fact and we are very proud about what we have attained with our program--my wife and my coaches have truly made it work well for the betterment of the players and their parenst and college acceptance

Your question as to which player I choose:

I truly need to know more--- what is their physical makeup-- what is their mental makeup

Are you the mother of one of them???

Trust me this comes into the picture as we are an unaffiliated program and pick and choose players as myself and coaches decide--parents like you only hurt your sons !!! the airplanes cannot carry all that baggage not can the busses or cars in a caravan

Based on the info you gave me I take both players--- we use DH and EH-- more hitters the better provided that you are not the mother/father of one of them because then he loses--we are FAMILY when it comes to team

Give me more info and maybe we cut one of them but if he can hit we will find a spot--I am the father of hitters so hitters mean something to me and both had great foot speed to boot


Hey ---dumping on Coach May really is a boost for you-- LOL == he is one of the most respected coaches on this site

FACTS FOR LIMOM--- parents like you, if in fact you a parent, are a detriment to the game of baseball and even more so a larger detriment to this web site

If you are from LI then I am ashamed to admit I grew up there and played youth ball there-- you cast a long shadow on LI baseball


Fellow members sorry for the diatribe here-- but the time has come--limom needed to be taken to task

Ahhh...Now I feel so good... I brought you down to my level.

Okay, let's rephrase the question. Identical twins both play the outfield. Again, they have similar hitting skills and the same parents. They are identical in every aspect, except one is faster and has a better arm than the other, you know, the 6.8 runner with the great arm. There is only one opening on your team for an outfielder. Choose your player...

This, to me, seems like such a simple task for an evaluator of talent.

I think you need to rephrase yet again. You started by saying they have "similar" hitting skills. Then you go on to say they are "identical" in every way. Which is it identical or similar More to the point, what is the point.

It seems, IMO, rather clear that you are interessted in discrediting the notion that people can judge (baseball) talent objectively. If that is your premise you are probably correct as it is a very subjective process.

Is scouting/evaluation an exact science. Of course not. Every scout, every school, every organization, team etc. looks at and judges things in different ways. For example, the "Moneyball" school of thought is to look at statistics very heavily. Others may look simply at mechanics, bat speed etc. and take no look at stats.

My son went to one elite showcase tryout where the "60" time was clearly of paramount importance. At a tryout for a MLB scout team they didn't even run- the head scout said if we "like" how you hit, we'll find a place for you, "it ain't a track meet".

It's different strokes for different folks when it comes to judging talent. One scout's treasure is another's trash.

At the bottom line, IMO, you have over simplified the concept, notion and process of hitting and "types" of hitters and how different people value and assess that skill, which is especially difficult, given that it is probably the hardest skill to master of any in sport.

It's just a very complicated process that does not lend itself to pat answers or explanations.

quote:

---

Originally posted by limom84:
Ahhh...Now I feel so good... I brought you down to my level.

Okay, let's rephrase the question. Identical twins both play the outfield. Again, they have similar hitting skills and the same parents. They are identical in every aspect, except one is faster and has a better arm than the other, you know, the 6.8 runner with the great arm. There is only one opening on your team for an outfielder. Choose your player...

This, to me, seems like such a simple task for an evaluator of talent.

---

Limom84, Your lack of experience is showing.
It's summed up like this that was well put by my own son who is a talented pitcher in his second year of college. " Things are different here. These guys can flat out hit".

During the course of HS, I can only think of one kid who gave him a real threat at the plate. He is now a wealthy young man. Does this tell you something?

IMHO, You need to listen to some other folks here that have much more experience than you. A lot of them are very highly regarded in the baseball community.

As to your example. I would look way beyond what you have stated. It is impossible for them to be identical in every other way.(I have twins)

Limom ....

Before I let a fraction of a second make a difference in recruiting I would look for other more important differences.

Character ... baseball smarts ... baggage ... grades ... dedication ... mental approach ... team-player? ...

These traits will tell me more about whether a young man is going to excel at the next level more clearly than looking at the difference between a 6.8 60 and a 7.0 60.

limom

Again you fail--- how can they be identical if one has a stronger arm than the other and has better footspeed


Also one can evaluate talent via postings--one can only evaluate players by seeing them in person

--anyone who tells you that they can is pulling your proverbial leg

If we could evalaute on the web we would not need travel teams , showcases etc to evaluate players-- mom and dad could just "send it in".

TRHit-

Thanks for your helpful response. By the way, my son does have identical twin friends that he works out with. They take hitting lessons from the same coach, and you really can't tell which one is which during batting practice. At a showcase, one really did run much faster than the other. Identical twins, yes. Identical running skills, no. I don't know how they throw compared to each other. Since you can't pick, I'll choose for you. You can have the one that doesn't run as fast. They are both great kids, though.