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Transferring from JUCO to D1

B Bravescoach100+ posts
Son is returning to his JC for his second year and will be signing with a D1 later this fall. My question: if he plays this fall but sits out next spring, would he have 2 or 3 years of eligibility left upon entering D1 next fall? I realize that JUCO fall baseball does not count towards your 2 years of JC eligibility, but cannot find how this scenario would apply to NCAA eligibility rules. Son may elect to do so if it would mean a 3rd year of D1 participation instead of 2.

Thanks in advance for any input.
"Your worth comes down to what you mean to others."
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F 3FingeredGlove1,000+ posts
The assertion that "JUCO fall baseball does not count towards your 2 years of JC eligibility" is generally not true.
The NJCAA rules say that (Article V, Section 7):
A. Student-athletes must not have previously competed during two seasons in a given sport at any intercollegiate level.
B. Participation in any fraction of any regularly scheduled contest during the academic year shall constitute one (1) season of participation in that sport. Participation includes entry into an athletic contest and does not include dressing for such an event.

Perhaps by play you mean "take part in practice", rather than play in a contest. If so, then neither the NCAA or the NJCAA will care.

NCAA D1 permits players to take part in up to two JC scrimmages, under a very narrow set of circumstances, without being charged with a season of competition. (14.2.3.1.1) Playing in a regularly scheduled game will cost a season of competition, by rule.
Last edited by 3FingeredGlove
B Bravescoach100+ posts
Thanks, 3FG...though it was explained to me by the NJCAA office that the fall seasons are separate and apart from the spring seasons and do not count towards eligibility. Thus, I'm assuming that V7A above pertains to transfer students who have already played 2 seasons elsewhere and are, thus, ineligible to play at the JUCO level. Also, I'm assuming that V7B pertains to "in-season" participation which, in this case, would mean spring baseball.

CPNM...this was proposed by at least 2 of the many D1 coaches who are looking to sign my son. From their standpoint, they would rather have him for 3 years instead of 2. The thought of son sitting out the spring does not appeal to me - especially in light of the numbers he put up this past spring - but if it means an additional year of D1 baseball, it's certainly something to consider.
B Bravescoach100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by 3FingeredGlove:
NCAA D1 permits players to take part in up to two JC scrimmages, under a very narrow set of circumstances, without being charged with a season of competition. (14.2.3.1.1) Playing in a regularly scheduled game will cost a season of competition, by rule.


And herein lies my question...does this rule pertain to JC fall baseball? I'm guessing not but I can't find the specific NCAA provision.
CollegeParentNoMoreCollegeParentNoMore1,000+ posts
quote:


CPNM...this was proposed by at least 2 of the many D1 coaches who are looking to sign my son. From their standpoint, they would rather have him for 3 years instead of 2. The thought of son sitting out the spring does not appeal to me - especially in light of the numbers he put up this past spring - but if it means an additional year of D1 baseball, it's certainly something to consider.


Perhaps they don't want other schools or scouts to see him? Does he really need/want 3 years at a D1? If he hopes to play professionally 5 years in college can be very costly...
B Bravescoach100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by CollegeParentNoMore:
quote:


CPNM...this was proposed by at least 2 of the many D1 coaches who are looking to sign my son. From their standpoint, they would rather have him for 3 years instead of 2. The thought of son sitting out the spring does not appeal to me - especially in light of the numbers he put up this past spring - but if it means an additional year of D1 baseball, it's certainly something to consider.


Perhaps they don't want other schools or scouts to see him? Does he really need/want 3 years at a D1? If he hopes to play professionally 5 years in college can be very costly...

Good points though "other schools" won't be an issue as he will have already signed this fall. As for pro scouts, I suppose that could factor into this but that might be a stretch. Further, based upon the in-district JC tuition we've paid and the healthy amount of scholarship money he's being offered, the financial component of this is really not an issue. What he's struggling with is 2 yrs of JUCO and 2 yrs of D1 v. 1 yr of JUCO and 3 yrs of D1...all dependent upon my original question.
F 3FingeredGlove1,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Bravescoach:
Thus, I'm assuming that V7A above pertains to transfer students who have already played 2 seasons elsewhere and are, thus, ineligible to play at the JUCO level.

Transfer student rules are in Section 10. And it doesn't matter if the season has taken place elsewhere or not: players can only have two seasons of competition at a JC. That's the point of Section 7.
quote:

Also, I'm assuming that V7B pertains to "in-season" participation which, in this case, would mean spring baseball.
Not too sure which part of "any regularly scheduled contest during the academic year" sounds like "just spring".

Look, I don't know if the NJCAA or NCAA actually follow these rules or not. But the rules are quite clear.

If he is thinking of not playing this spring, and if the D1 coach can find a spot on the 35 man roster, does it make sense to transfer mid-year? He wouldn't be eligible to compete at the D1 this spring, but if there is room on the 35 man roster, he would be able to practice. I'm having trouble imagining that the JC coach will want to have a non-competing person practicing with the team this spring, and a player who doesn't even practice during the spring is probably going backwards.
CollegeParentNoMoreCollegeParentNoMore1,000+ posts
quote:
Further, based upon the in-district JC tuition we've paid and the healthy amount of scholarship money he's being offered, the financial component of this is really not an issue.

The cost I am referring to is the cost of being 22 or 23 when starting pro ball rather then 20 0r 21. Older players are not offered much of a bonus and not given as much time to show they can play, thus the (indirect) high cost of 5 years of college is fewer professional opportunities.
Rick at Informed AthleteRick at Informed Athlete5,000+ posts
Bravescoach, here's the specific NCAA rule that you're looking for. As 3FG has pointed out, there's nothing in the rule that separates fall ball from the spring season.

Bylaw 14.2.3.1.1 Two-Year College Scrimmages. A two-year college prospective student-athlete may compete
in a scrimmage as a member of a two-year college team without counting such competition as a season
of competition, provided the competition meets all of the following conditions: (Adopted: 1/11/94, Revised:
5/9/06)
(a) The scrimmage is approved by the two-year college;
(b) No official score is kept;
(c) No admission is charged;
(d) No official time is kept;
(e) The scrimmage is played prior to the two-year college’s first regularly scheduled outside competition;
and
(f ) The prospective student-athlete participates in not more than two such scrimmages or dates of competition
per academic year.

3FG has also made a good point about transferring at midyear if your son is considering sitting out the spring. However, I think most Div. I coaches would not use a slot on the 35-man roster for a player who they knew would not be eligible to play.
B Bravescoach100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Rick at Informed Athlete:
Bravescoach, here's the specific NCAA rule that you're looking for. As 3FG has pointed out, there's nothing in the rule that separates fall ball from the spring season.

Bylaw 14.2.3.1.1 Two-Year College Scrimmages. A two-year college prospective student-athlete may compete
in a scrimmage as a member of a two-year college team without counting such competition as a season
of competition, provided the competition meets all of the following conditions: (Adopted: 1/11/94, Revised:
5/9/06)
(a) The scrimmage is approved by the two-year college;
(b) No official score is kept;
(c) No admission is charged;
(d) No official time is kept;
(e) The scrimmage is played prior to the two-year college’s first regularly scheduled outside competition;
and
(f ) The prospective student-athlete participates in not more than two such scrimmages or dates of competition
per academic year.

3FG has also made a good point about transferring at midyear if your son is considering sitting out the spring. However, I think most Div. I coaches would not use a slot on the 35-man roster for a player who they knew would not be eligible to play.


Thanks much, Rick. I still find it confusing why the NCAA Bylaw you reference is seemingly in direct conflict with the NJCAA stance that fall baseball does not count towards spring eligibility...assuming the word I received from the national office was correct.

Regardless, son has every intention of playing his 2nd year of JUCO out of respect for his coach...simply exploring alternative options just in case. And, to clarify, he would not have transferred midyear but would have finished his academic year at his JC and saved a year of playing eligibility if, in fact, that be the case.

Many thanks to you, CPNM, and 3FG for your responses....been an enlightening discussion.
B Bravescoach100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by fillsfan:
Bravescoach, why didn't your son just go to the D1 school this year? If the coach wants him so badly it would make sense to go now.


To answer your question would require details which I do not care to share on an open forum. My posting intent was to clarify eligibility rules with respect to JUCO transfers. Anything more than that is personal in nature and will remain so.
CollegeParentNoMoreCollegeParentNoMore1,000+ posts
Just to clarify....... my son enjoyed his year of playing at a non-lowly JC instead of riding the bench for a D1 coach that didn't fully recognize his skill Smile

Once you find a coach that treats your son right (i.e. JC coach) your son should do the same for the coach. Don't know if that's the situation here, but I only see upside in playing the 2nd JC year and not making waves.
Last edited by CollegeParentNoMore
B Bravescoach100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by CollegeParentNoMore:
Just to clarify....... my son enjoyed his year of playing at a non-lowly JC instead of riding the bench for a D1 coach that didn't fully recognize his skill Smile

Once you find a coach that treats your son right (i.e. JC coach) your son should do the same for the coach. Don't know if that's the situation here, but I only see upside in playing the 2nd JC year and not making waves.


CPNM...you brought me back in as I couldn't agree with you more. In fact, son turned down a number of substantial offers from major D1 schools based purely upon the respect and gratitude he has for his JC coaching staff and program. That being said, and the reason for this post, was to clarify what other options he may have in the unlikely, and unforeseen, event that circumstances change following his fall season this year.

PUH...I must respectfully disagree as, in my opinion, one doesn't continually hone his skills sitting on a bench - D1 or otherwise - all while wasting a precious year of eligibility. And, btw, son's team was ranked #17 Nationally and was one opponent away from going to the JUCO DII World Series. Should you consider that "lowly", then so be it.
PU Pop Up Hitter dad1,000+ posts
Yes I was kidding but believe it or not, I've been told by some just being on a D1 roster is preferred by some to playing at a lower level.

Bravescoach, son lost a 1/4th of his eligibility for a two bit D1 program. If it was a workplace situation, the only term would be a "hostile work environment". Total opposite from his JC program. Lack of accountability was the main problem.
B Bravescoach100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Pop Up Hitter dad:
Yes I was kidding but believe it or not, I've been told by some just being on a D1 roster is preferred by some to playing at a lower level.

Bravescoach, son lost a 1/4th of his eligibility for a two bit D1 program. If it was a workplace situation, the only term would be a "hostile work environment". Total opposite from his JC program. Lack of accountability was the main problem.


Sorry to hear that, PUH, though I'm afraid I've heard that story way too many times...which makes my son's eventual decision that much more important what with the more stringent NCAA transfer rules. As we all know, college recruiters can often put forth a real nice sales pitch via a feel-good approach...only for son/daughter to discover a different side once on campus. In my son's case, he knew what he had in returning to his JC coach/team for his 2nd year of eligibility which he was very comfortable in doing. Yes, things can always change though I don't anticipate that as his coaches are really good guys and have acknowledged the sacrifice that son has recently made for them and their program. With that, I'm confident that this thread was simply fact-finding and nothing more. My best to your son and hope he's found a better alternative.
PU Pop Up Hitter dad1,000+ posts
Bravescoach, thank you for the kind words for son. I think doing the 2nd year at JUCO is good, and if your son does real well, he can get drafted. I surely hope you received enough information on your inquiry.

Pop up is at least having a good time going to the same school as his best friend. Its nice to have a friend on the same team.

I do know of one poster whos son left JC after one year, went to a big program. For him it worked out well, started all three years too. I think his talent and hard work was very instrumental in his success. You don't see too many transfers to D1 after only one year of JC. Best wishes to you and your son.
B Bravescoach100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Pop Up Hitter dad:
Bravescoach, thank you for the kind words for son. I think doing the 2nd year at JUCO is good, and if your son does real well, he can get drafted. I surely hope you received enough information on your inquiry.

Pop up is at least having a good time going to the same school as his best friend. Its nice to have a friend on the same team.

I do know of one poster whos son left JC after one year, went to a big program. For him it worked out well, started all three years too. I think his talent and hard work was very instrumental in his success. You don't see too many transfers to D1 after only one year of JC. Best wishes to you and your son.


Thank you.

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