Triage recruiting suggestions for a 2016 D3 prospect

It is late, but it is not too late.  Pitchers are always in demand.  Roughly half of all recruits are pitchers.

 

Topping 83-85 mph can be D3 pitching for sure.  Particularly with an ACT in the mid 20's.

 

Captain U is not your answer.  Your son (and you) are the answer.  That means your son reaching out to schools on his vetted list directly.  Fill out the baseball recruiting profiles, email the coaches, call the coaches.  And go to some camps / showcases.  And did I mention call and email coaches directly!!!

 

You already seem to have a sense of a "sweet spot".  E.g., a Muhlenberg type of academic and baseball fit.  Your vetted list should reflect these types of schools, with some stretch and some safety schools too. 

 

Headfirst Honor Roll Camp will be in Jupiter, FL November 7 and 8.  Allegheny, Bard, Catholic, Dickinson, Muhlenberg, Ursinus...they will be there and are in this school/baseball profile.

 

Good luck! 

Many thanks, Branson!  The travel team coach is VERY anti-showcase (why pay for both HIS program AND showcases?), but several of those schools (including Allegheny and Muhlenberg) are in his potential zone.  Timing is good as well - Muhlenberg's prospect camp is October 11th, and my son will just be coming out of the strength-training component of his program then.  By Nov 7, he will have had 3-4 weeks to ramp back up his throwing program, and we can see where he is.

 

Thanks again...keep the suggestions coming, guys - I appreciate it!

His travel coach is wrong.  At this point HeadFirst is your best option.  However, if he stays around 80 then he won't have many options even at HF.

Here's the problem. You say your travel coach is anti-showcase? Not so big a problem if you're going to tourneys where you can look behind home plate and see at least six or seven guns go up while your kid pitches. I'm going to guess, though, that your travel team isn't getting into PG-type tourneys and, if they are, they aren't getting the prime draws, schedule-wise. DO NOT so quickly dismiss the showcase idea, especially those that are currently catering to uncommitted 2016's.

bebopdeluxe1... I sent you a private message.

I agree with BransonBB.  We used CaptainU for a long time (too long as I look back).  Lots and lots of invites to camps at schools he would never attend or that would not be a good baseball fit.  You can get all the info you need about the coaching staff at these schools from their website.  

 

My son is also a 2016 RHP.  We struggled with exposure/interest most of the summer until he attended Headfirst late August.  He has interest from multiple D3 schools based on his performance there and he did an overnight visit to one of those schools this past weekend.  Turns out they had seen him pitch earlier in the summer and the HF performance pushed him over the edge as a recruit for them (or moved him up their board).  It's expensive but you probably are not going to find another place with that number of schools in his baseball wheelhouse in one place between now and the spring.  There were over 100 schools at the HF my 2016 attended.  

 

If HF is not an option I would look for other showcases in the northeast - my 2016 just received an invite to the Prep Baseball Report (PBR) Fall Academic Showcase in MA 10/17.  That looks like one you could consider.  I'm not sure how he got the invite - I'm guessing it was just because he attended HF.  It looks like you can complete the info online and get an "invite" from them.

 

I'm not sure if your 2016 has been throwing but he should start asap and look to attend camps - look at the schools you are targeting, find the camps, have your travel coach reach out and then go and pitch.  These schools are filling their needs now for Nov early decisions.  The school we just visited had 6 recruits overnight on Friday and others coming in on Sat for their camp on Sat (the school also had an open house on Sat).  Don't wait for him to throw 85 - low 80s may be enough to get some interest depending on how he pitches.  You might also consider sending videos to these coaches - the HC this past weekend said they were looking at a few pitchers at their camp that they had only seen via video beforehand.  So the video at least got their attention - then they wanted to see them live. 

 

If I see another showcase that looks like a good fit I'll send you a PM.

 

There are a lot of members here who know a lot more than I do so I'm sure you'll get some great suggestions.  

To be clear, the position that his travel team coach takes is that - in some cases - these showcases are cattle-call-like operations where a lot of money is spent and very little specialized one-on-one connections are happening.  As far as the travel team that my son played on, I do believe that it was a pretty good program - a combination of Diamond Nation, PG (he spent a week in Fort Myers in July at a pretty high profile 18U event) and tourneys in CT and MA.  Lots of coaches with radar guns at these events.  And - to be clear - my son received interest this summer...although he was the #3 or 4 pitcher on his team, and the top two pitchers (who are both 2017 guys) are definitely D1 prospects (the #1 guy is a high D1 prospect).   The schools that want him are D2 and D3 schools where the academic component of the package is just not that great...but we knew that going in.  We knew that - given we started this process in April - the real value of this program is what he is doing right now: 2-3 months of specialized strength and conditioning training, combined with an integrated winter throwing program designed to add several mph on his fastball.

 

The reality is that he is probably going to be a MUCH more attractive prospect to a good D3 program in March than he will be in late October/early November.  It sucks that the calendar is working against him - i.e. that a lot of programs will be making commitments NOW - but it is what it is...which is one of the reasons why I am asking whether D3 schools will still be looking to upgrade their recruiting classes in March/April...or whether - unless you get a commitment in the mid-November recruiting program - my son is SOL.

I just saw the post about the travel coach's view on showcases - I disagree with this approach.  When is this coach expecting to get your son in from of schools at this stage of the game if he doesn't attend showcases or camps?  

One thing you need to decide is if he plans to apply Early Action. My son just finished up 4 years in the North Coast Athletic conference and the schools that were interested in him all wanted him to apply early action. Son's ACT's was 29 and his grade point was in the mid 3's. 

If your son is Honor Roll or top 10% in his class he may qualify for the Scholarship Competitions many of these schools provide. These weekends usually include an over night and activities during the day competing academically against other students to gain additional scholarship money. The schools are making those lists now. 

If you go regular enrollment many D3's will have their baseball camps as late as December. I believe Ohio Wesleyan's was in December last year. So there is still opportunity.

My son did not commit to his school until late May of his Senior year. But he had many D3's recruiting him starting in as a rising Senior and D3 recruiting became very heavy during the fall of his senior year. Much of it do to Early Action.

I will keep my opininions of Wooster to myself.

I’m honestly not trying to be a wise guy, but your son isn’t really late because he hasn’t had much to show to college recruiters to this point. His target schools are just getting serious about 2016s right about now, so he’s fine, especially if he can show them something this fall.

 

A1) DII and DIII programs recruit high school seniors heavily during the fall. There will still be opportunities in the spring, but fewer of them.

 

A2) I recommend email (preferably with video) directly from your son to the recruiting coordinator, then follow-up phone call. Your son has to convince them that he’s worth looking at, and expressing a sincere interest in the school will help distinguish him.

 

A3) If the school doesn’t know the travel coach, I would have your son initiate the contact. The exception would be if the travel coach is very well known and respected in the baseball community and the school would be aware of that.

 

Diamond Nation would be a good place to be seen by DII and DIII coaches from PA, NJ, and NY this fall. They have 2 more 18U tournaments this fall, but one is this weekend. Contact DN and ask them if they know any teams who might need a guest pitcher. If he does get to pitch, make sure he contacts the schools that he’s interested in to invite them for a look. That contact might mean the difference between them showing up or not.

 

This map might help you identify DIII schools.

https://www.google.com/maps/d/...pj2bJ-k&hl=en_US

 

Since you mentioned the ODAC, this camp might be a good option. Some ODAC schools used to attend the camp in its previous incarnation.

http://community.hsbaseballweb...eyan-college-nov-6-8

 

Best of luck.

 

MidAtlanticDad:

 

I don't think you are being a wise guy...when I say that I think my son is late to this process, it is because he has not had a really integrated approach to this process until this year.  I am noes to the forum, but I took some time to read some threads first to familiarize myself with the community...and between the posts that I have read here and my experience this summer with my son, it seems that many aspiring college pitchers were doing integrated offseason strength/conditioning programs and playing on high profile travel teams well before the summer between their junior and senior year!  Perhaps I am wrong there...

 

I am an analyst by trade, and I understand numbers.  Had he started one year sooner...done the kind of strength conditioning work in the fall and winter of 2014/15 that he is doing now...had he played on this travel team in the summer of 2014...then he would have has a low-to-mid 80's FB this summer and this process would not feel so rushed.  I still believe that he has "projectability" - he is a legit 6'2"/185, he throws 4 pitches and knows what he is doing out there.  Just the fact that he was able to compete in some of these tournaments this summer with a FB that topped out at 80 is a testament to his ability to handle his business out on the mound (and pitch his way out of trouble!).  I really think that he has the potential to be a solid pitcher for a quality D3 program...but time is short before the November signing period, and the radar guns are out...

 

That is why I am really wrestling with counseling him to wait until the spring to make a decision - when he will have a better FB and will be able to show it on the mound.  His travel coach says that is a possibility...but it is taking a chance.  There just might not be a ton of landing spots then.

Bebop,

In D3 there is no signing period. All D3 commitments are verbal. The coach does not know he has the player until he shows up on campus, in the Fall and has paid his first Tuition bill. The only rush, in D3, for November is for Early action with admissions.

BishopLeftiesDad:

 

Thanks for the post!  Actually, OWU is another school that he is interested in...I only mention Wooster because the coach reached out to him, and his HS has sent kids there - which will hopefully help him in the admissions process (Wooster is ABSOLUTELY a stretch school for his transcript).  And, while I do not know all of the ins and outs of D3 recruiting, I would think that my son would probably have a better chance of parlaying his baseball chip at a "stretch" academic school that does not have a program with as much success as a school like Wooster has had.

 

For a school like Wooster - or OWU, for that matter - I fully recognize that I would be writing a big check for him to go there...he won't have the grades or test scores to get any kind of meaningful merit $$$.  As we look at the situation, it is either 1) a school where his current transcript would play, and we hopefully get some merit aid, or 2) a school where baseball helps him get into the school...but with little in the way of $$$.

 

I am probably leaning more towards scenario 2 - at the end of the day, I want him to go to the best school that he loves...but the more options the better!  If you have any specific insight into OWU, I would love to hear it - please shoot me a PM.

 

Thanks!

Welcome to the site.  Lots of great advice so far.  Regarding timing, yes, D1 is much earlier than D3 and it sounds like your target is generally correct.  Many HS players are still maturing and developing physically coming into their HS senior years.  So, they are less appealing at the earlier signing dates than they will be during their spring season.  It is what it is.  Don't sweat it.  Control what you can control.  Their will certainly be D3 doors open in March/April for a P throwing 82-84 with successful experience on an established club team.  It might not (or might) be choice #1 but that is the reality for most.  Just focus on finding the best fit that works with the circumstances given.

 

When choosing prospect camps/showcases, school camps this fall/winter, choose wisely.  There will be hundreds of schools that would love for you to come to their camp and contribute $200 toward their budget.  This is your only go-around so gather info and make the choices that are best bang for the buck and most targeted for your son.  You will find plenty of info here.

 

As far as son spearheading vs. club coach vs. Captain U, use all of your resources.  Take advantage of the connections of the coach but coaches usually have specific circles.  Your target circle, as you are finding out, is likely to reach outside of his.  So, in those instances, son should initiate but list coach as a reference so schools have a good source to fact-check.  Don't wait to see what club coach comes up with and then react.  Attack from all angles now.

 

Just to be sure you know, you can search past threads on any topic and there is a treasure trove of info here.

 

Try to enjoy the process and make sure you don't let it interfere with enjoying son's senior season.  Best wishes and keep us informed.

 

 

 

OK, good. I would say he's late to the development process as opposed to the recruiting process, but I understand what you mean.

 

A lot of guys are doing S&C programs, and some guys are just gifted. And the really good ones combine both.

 

My approach would be to work like hell this fall to find a good home. If that doesn't materialize, then work like hell to prepare for the spring. There's no down-side to working on it this fall. He can always turn down an offer that isn't from the right program, but first he needs to get an offer.

 

There's plenty of up-side to working on it now. He might actually find a good fit. He'll definitely gain experience communicating with coaches. He may make a contact that turns into something in the spring.

 

Many of our kids have had to wrestle with the notion that a better offer could be right around the corner. In my experience, it rarely is.

 

Added later: There's no signing period for DIII. NLIs are for athletic scholarships.

Also, be aware that, the way D3 is set up with no athletic $$ and no formal commitment, there are many schools that bring in a LOT of kids in the fall.  Make sure your son is asking specific questions during the recruiting process regarding where he likely fits on the depth chart.

 

Great point, cabbagedad.  One of the good things about working with this travel team coach is that he has good relationships with his network of coaches...and he strives to find programs for his kids where they have a slot on the team and won't get recruited over.  it doesn't ALWAYS work out that way, of course, but that is the goal.

I am going to take this another direction. Your son has the rest of this fall and his senior year of HS. This should be enough to find a place where he can get a good education and play ball.

 

I would take a different approach. Whether he is recruited or a walk-on he will need to compete. My focus would be in finding schools which make sense for your son and your family.

 

Do your research, make a list of schools (20-30) that make sense. My sense is that your focus is east coast. With that as a foundation make appointments for your son to visit as many schools as possible this fall and winter, have him take the tour, learn about the school, let him learn what the world of D3 schools looks and feels like.

 

At the same time; have him contact either the baseball coach or recruiting director to let them know of his interest in the school. See if you can get a 15-minute "meet and greet" within the context of your son visiting the school. Not all will make the time but many will. Your son at that point will be more than a name on a prospect list but a real person. It will be far easier for them to have him checked out on the field once they have established that; he wants to come to their school, he is academically qualified and that Dad is aware of the financial commitment that the school represents.

 

Once he gets to his senior year he should send the coach and the recruiting director his schedule. As the season progresses he should send any local newspaper clippings which may feature him or his team. You want to make sure that the coaches know that you are working hard both in and out of the classroom as well as showing them that he has a real interest in attending their college. 

 

I am not discounting the advise of those that advise showcases and camps. I would prefer to focus on finding the right fit for your son. Whether he is recruited or not; he will have to compete to both make the team and his playing time. However, both will be far easier if he has found a school where he can succeed in the classroom while growing as a person through his college experience.

ILVBB:

 

That is OUTSTANDING advice!  As a parent who wants to pull every lever and turnover every stone to figure out where the keys to the castle are hidden, at the end of the day the NUMBER ONE component of this process is to find a school and community where my son will learn and grow.  If baseball can be a component of that, all the better...but - as a parent - posts like yours help me keep perspective on what the real goal is here...

 

Thanks.

 

(and if he can find a 85 mph fastball, all the better)

 

When our 2018 attended a camp last Xmas with 6-7 D1 & D2 coaches they emphasized that while the recruiting game had changed, and they were forced to recruit earlier and earlier, that every single one of them had either just signed a senior or would be adding 1-2 more seniors in the spring. They all noted that there are many a "late bloomer", and they would be remiss to not keep roster slots (if not scholarship slots) open for those kids. 

 

This particular host D1 school added that they were still following 3-4 seniors closely, and specifically wanted to wait until spring to see how they matured. They also wanted to get more of a read on any of their current commits / current players who may end up leaving through the MLB draft come June, or who may not make grades once their 1st semester senior year transcripts and test scores came out. Not all of that applies to a D3, but it certainly shows that the book doesn't close come November. Best of luck! 

 

Lots of moving parts.  

Son is currently a senior at OWU & is an outfielder on the baseball team. He didn't commit until May of his senior year & was fortunate to receive academic & need-based aid that made attendance at OWU possible. Have to say that Coach Mott has followed thru with his statements made to son during his recruiting visit. Son has started since 3rd game of freshman year & has had very good career so far. I would recommend OWU to anyone looking for a school with high academics & athletics. By the way the baseball team will loose 14 players to graduation this spring. Opportunity knocks!

Your son is not too late for the D3 decision making process. He is late for the exposure process. He can shamble and fix it. Right away email the coaches at desired colleges, explain interest in the college and the baseball program. Ask how to get in front of them this fall and winter.

 

Theres Head First in FL. Check for fall showcases at Diamond Nation. If there are tournaments college coaches attend ask how to latch on to a team. Often teams need extra pitching. Check All Star Baseball in West Chester to see what showcases they're running. Chances are coaches who respond to his email will mention showcases they may attend. This will open up exposure to schools he didn't consider.

 

Be careful with how D3s make offers. If the coach isn't committed to the player the player may discover after he's at the school he's competing with 20+ pitchers for a couple of roster spots. Education is first. But going where he's loved for baseball ups the odds of getting on the field. Good luck.

Just want to add a couple of points and echo others. 

 

About OWU.  My son was accepted to OWU and almost went there.  Came really, really close to doing so. Many attractive things about the school.  And the baseball program seems to have fully  recovered from a few down years.    In the end it came down to being closer to home vs having an Ohio adventure.  I mention this because although he did not have a great transcript, he is  an accomplished artist and got an substantial art scholarship at OWU.   So financial aid at D3 isn't just about grades, it's also about special talents.  Don't know if your son has one.

 

Second, really want to stress the nature of D3 recruiting at some schools.  Can't speak for all of course.  I know from talking to others that different schools work differently. But take my son's incoming class as an example.  There are 25 incoming freshman and 8 incoming transfers.   That's a LOT of guys.  We gather that all were "recruited"  to some degree -- some more intensely than others, it seems, but each one to at least some degree.   It's pretty clear that not all will be on the roster come the season.  

 

I should say that a very significant number of the recruits are, as you can imagine, pitchers.   It's obvious that the coaches are looking for pitchers and they are going to go with the one's that show the most potential during the fall. Not all D3 necessarily bring in so many guys.  But I imagine that pitchers are among the most likely players to be "over-recruited."

 

As  Cabbage said above, we've learned from our experience that when your son is  talking to a D3 coach, he's got to ask some very direct questions about what they see his potential role as.  They will give you a lot of used cars salesman type talk about various things, but unless you press them they are liable to stay away from specifics -- unless they are specifics that they know you will be happy to hear.    Even if you don't like the answers you will get to specific direct questions,   you need to hear them anyway if you are to make the most informed decision possible.

 

For example, It's now clear to us  that at my son's school some of these 33 guys were definitely brought in because the coach believes the player can make an immediate impact.  Other guys were brought in because they believe the guy is a serious competitor for an "open" spot.  But "open" doesn't necessarily mean that there is no incumbent in the relevant position.  If there is one, that means you are being brought in to compete possibly against both an upperclassman  incumbent with whom they aren't completely happy and other incoming players  (either transfers or frosh).  Still other guys seem to have been brought in more as what might be called depth guys. 

 

Guys in the first category though not exactly golden -- since nothing is guaranteed -- are in the least danger.  Guys in the second category are in some jeopardy of either being cut if they don't compete as well as expected or at least of not seeing much playing time  in the first year.    Guys in the last category are in the most danger of being outright cut. 

 

You can look at this in two ways.  If you are risk-averse, you can decide that that kind of program is not for you, unless you are  one of the guys brought in with expectations of making an immediate contribution.  (But finding a program that will regard you as a likely contributor from day 1 is a harder slog, unless you are a genuine stud.  So there's risk on that side too, if you are not such a stud.)

 

Or if you know you are not a can't miss stud and are non risk-averse,  you can accept the risk but do everything in your power to minimize it.   What will really matter at a program that doesn't recruit you as a can't miss contributor is that you show up in the fall playing at the top of your game, ready to compete with all comers.    If your kid shows a significant jump in velocity, for example, from the time the coaches first recruited him to the time fall workouts begin,  that will make a definite impression and move him up in the pecking order.  

 

From your description of your son,  I would guess that not that many D3 coaches --at least at highly competitive programs -- would recruit him right now as a can't miss stud,   But since we aren't talking athletic scholarship money, not being a can't miss stud just means he's not the kind of guy right now a coach will want to spend his  early admissions chips on.  But I would guess that a fair number of coaches would see him as guy who can compete for a spot.    If that's the way he's seen,  you've got plenty of time in a way.  Focus on finding schools that are the right fit academically with a baseball program he's prepared to go in a compete hard for a spot at.   But know that nothing is at all guaranteed and that what  will ultimately determine his baseball fate at such a school is how he is playing come the fall. 

 

SluggerDad:

 

Great stuff.  Thanks for your insight...it seems to be jiving with some of the stuff that I am learning through this process.  I am a financial analyst by trade, and so I am coming at this from several angles - and I would certainly welcome forum members' input as to whether my conclusions from the work I have done makes sense...

 

Just a little more about my son, and where he is right now mentally.  He does understand that baseball will probably have to be a part of the admissions package if he wants to get into a better school than his transcript would allow.  While I have the money to pay outright, I would like - if possible - to get back some of the financial commitment that I have made over the past several months to his travel/development team...but if the school is a material jump academically/reputationally from the kind of school he could get in without baseball (think Landmark Conference schools in the Elizabethtown/Susquehanna vein), that would be very important.  He has made significant strides through this development program...since he started in late April, he played a very challenging summer baseball schedule - including a pretty high-profile PG tournament in Fort Myers in July...and it is a testament to him that he was able to have some reasonable success in the these tournaments despite a 76-78 mph fastball.  He now sits in the 80-82 range, and his travel coach thinks there is probably a couple more mph to be had as he continues this program through the winter.

 

Lastly, and most importantly, while my son appreciates the increased visibility that he has had, and he recognizes that the work that he is doing in the fall/winter will improve his effectiveness this spring, he is also uncertain how much of a time commitment he wants to make to baseball in college.  I will defer to the board, but I am sure that there are D3 programs out there that are not super-high-profile programs (like, say, Wooster or Wheaton MA - two schools we are looking at from an academic standpoint that regularly bring in guys with PG pages that reflect 82-84 mph FB's the summer before senior year) who still treat their programs EXTREMELY seriously, and require their players to make an almost D1-level time commitment.  One of the things that I like about the Centennial Conference is they seem to understand that baseball is only part of the overall college experience, and things like limits on fall practices (only 4 weeks, 4 times a week) sound very appealing to him.

 

Looking at where he is right now (hitting 82 with his FB, with a couple of mph hopefully to come), as well as his projectables (he is 6'2"/185, and still growing - now that he is in a serious strength/conditioning program), I do think that coaches could be intrigued by his upside.  However, I think that it is VERY important that - wherever he goes - he is involved right away.  I fear that if he is one of 6-8 pitchers that a program brings in - with the hope of finding 3-4 legit needle-moving players - he could fall by the wayside.  It does look like - for good programs like, say, a Wheaton MA, they do not have a ton of non-uniform-number players...they get a bunch of guys who have PG 82-84 mph players, and they do not have the need to over recruit as much as, say, schools like Muhlenberg or Washington College - where there seems to be a TON of guys on the roster...and I have to struggle to find guys on those rosters who have PG pages (not that is is the be-all, end-all to have a PG page, but still...).  For teams like that, a kid who is throwing a legit 82 now, with the potential to find a little more between now and next fall, would be attractive to one of those programs (please correct me if I am wrong here).

 

I would agree that my son is not a "can't miss stud"...but he is also a kid who - just based on his size, his recent introduction to the PG-level travel team environment and the clear gains that he has made in just 2-3 months of strength training - could be an attractive risk-reward for a program who does not get the Wooster/Wheaton-like 82-84mph 17-year-olds.  We are also in a position where we do not need much (if any) in the way of financial assistance to pay the nut to go to some of the schools he is targeting.  I think the next step is to come up with the list of schools in the three conferences that he is looking at (Centennial, North Coast and NEWMAC) where there is a favorable athletic/academic balance, have my son draw up an e-mail - assisted by his travel coach - and we will see who responds.  Because of his transcript, we will  see if any of these schools have enough interest to combine a school visit with a throwing session sometime after he takes the October 24th ACT.

 

And...if none of these schools are interested in looking at him for the November early commit period, that's OK.  The more I have learned about D3, the less concerned I am about him having to DEFINITELY have a slot this fall.  My sense is if he is throwing 82-84 this spring, and having a great senior year on the mound (he was all-league last season, and will probably get a bit of pub in the preseason previews), we can hopefully find a school that will be interested!

 

Thanks for the insight, guys.  Keep it coming...and PLEASE feel free to critique any of my preconceptions...my goal relative to this board is not to be right, or win arguments with other posters, but to have the absolute BEST information to help my son through this process.

 

 

Bebop,
While conferences do have limits on practice etc. In reality, coaches still expect you to get your work in. Yes the additional is all voluntary and in yor own or in small groups. But I will tell you coaches know who is putting in the "extra" work. If a player is doing just what is "required" the coach will know. If that kid is not a stud it will effect his playing time. Once a player gets to campus it is no longer about projectability, but what can you do for me now. If a coach sees a player not striving to get to his ceiling, he may use a kid who is.
I have heard quite often, the coach doesnt like my kid. When I talk to my sin, lo and behold, that kid is not in the weight room or doung long tos, or spending time in the cage. So make sure your son is aware of this. Otherwise a school at the top of the conference's mentioned may not be a good fit. I know at OWU that the extra work is expected even if it is Voluntary.

My son is a freshman at a D3 this year and while I expect his time committment will be less than other people at some D1 and D2 schools, he is awful busy right now.  He is up at 6:30 three days a week to run, has lifting 3 days a week, has study hall 2 nights from 7:00 to 10:00, has a full load of 16 hours which include a calculus and physics and also has a on campus job just like every student at his particular school.  He has little time to even talk to mom and dad very much. 

Just to echo what Bishop said. 

 

My son is at a Freshman at a highly competitive D3.  Coaches made it clear that they are looking for guys to get themselves game ready by the  first day of fall practice. 

 

The work of doing so is up to the players.  But believe me, as Bishop said, the coaches are well aware who is putting the work in and who isn't.   "Voluntary," three days per week weight lifting started a few weeks ago.  Though by Division 3 regulations,  the coaches cannot observe or lead these workouts, the coaches did organize the players into work out groups, designed a schedule so that all groups have time and space to get their work in and assigned a team leader to lead each group.

 

So you bet you're not going to miss those if you are serious about being game ready from day 1 of fall practice. 

 

In addition, the  field is open and accessible.  And coaches encourage guys to make the most possible use of the facilities.  Guys have been out there working since the first day of school.  Pitchers team up with catchers to get their bullpens in,  outfielders are out there doing long toss.  The cages are being used all throughout the day.    So don't let your son be deluded by how he's going to have to work right off the bat. 

I think he understands that there will be an off-season component to the team - he is currently doing strength/conditioning 3-4 times a week, and the "voluntary" component of organized baseball activities at his HS will start in December.  I am also sure that, for,the programs that have very successful programs - like a Wheaton or the top North Coast teams - there is even a higher level of off-season workouts and preparations that are expected if you want to ever see the field.  In some ways, the NCAC may be one of the most difficult D3 conferences - with a high level of baseball AND a high level of academic responsibilities.  For me - and my son - the hope is he can find a school/program that balances academics and baseball in a way that he can handle.

 

It is also important to him - and to me - that he can catch his breath and enjoy his college experience, and if he goes to a place where the combination of a challenging academic workload (which will be a clear step-up from his high school responsibilities) AND an extremely demanding D3 baseball commitment (which the top programs will have in place) makes it impossible to actually grow up and enjoy his first time away from home, then that is no good, either...so if that means going to a lower-profile baseball conference, or going to one of the lower-profile baseball programs in a conference (like, say, a Muhlenberg or Washington College in the Centennial), that might be the best fit of all.  He has a better shot of being truly WANTED by the coaching staff, he will have a better chance of being on the field (which will keep him engaged with the program), and he will still have the benefit of a great college experience.

 

 

One other thing about small college admissions these days.  Many are HUNGRY for kids who can pay full freight.  Merit aid is basically a tuition discount.  Schools use it to compete for the stronger students in their admission pools.  But many smaller schools with small endowments actually can't afford this practice, at least not  in the long run.   They are caught in a bind.   Without doling out the merit aid many would not meet their admissions quotas.  But doling out merit aid makes them need more students who can pay full freight.   Bottom line,  the fact that you can afford to pay full freight will actually make your kid marginally more attractive to certain schools than he otherwise might be. 

 

There are, of course, small schools that  don't give out any merit based tuition discounts.  They tend to be the super elite colleges with huge endowments and highly selective admissions criteria.   They give out need base aid and engage in need blind admissions.  But like i said they are much, much tougher to get into.  These schools basically have their pick of the litter when it comes to the most able students. 

 

(My banker friend, who specializes in the higher education sector, says partly because of all the tuition discounts that less prestigious schools feel compelled to hand out, a very big shake down is coming in the next few years.  But that's another story)

 

Bebop, I think you are doing a great job with research and assessment.  I think, what others are trying to convey is that, even with the programs that put a bit less emphasis on the athletic aspect and require a bit less time, it is still a full time or near-full time commitment.  The college experience for a college athlete is markedly different than the college experience of a non-athlete.  It consumes a very significant portion of the student's time outside of class and studies.  If a prospective student athlete has concerns about that going in, he should think long and hard about whether that is what he truly wants.

What is his vision of "a great college experience"?

SluggerDad:

 

My guess - and it is only a guess - as to why schools like Muhlenberg and Washington College have such huge rosters is because many kids on those teams are full-pay kids who may not have the academic bonafides to qualify for merit aid or to get in without baseball.  As someone who was a full-ride guy at Vassar (and someone who is already dealing with this issue with an older, non-athlete son who I am paying FULL STICKER PRICE to send him to Villanova), I understand that these schools need full-pay students to offset the merit kids.

 

To an extent, I am hoping to use my checkbook to help my kid get into a better school, but if he can bring an 83 mph fastball to the table, perhaps a $5,000 discount off of full price (which would STILL require me to write a $50,000/year check, mind you) to pay for the baseball development program would be nice!

you are definitely wise to the ways of the academic world, my friend. Think of all  those D3 schools, with expensive facilities,  where maybe 1/3 of the students participate in varsity sports.  Damned effective technique for getting more students to come to your place.  That also explains the growth of JV programs at some D3's.     

This article is old but it talks to what Slugger Dad had to say about tuition discounts. This has struck Wittenberg hard. They have always been one of the cheaper schools in the NCAC but it was cheaper yet do to discounts to get students to campus. 

 

https://www.moodys.com/researc...2-outlook--PR_276176

 

Don't get me wrong, My son committed a lot of time to Baseball and Academics, but he still found time for "College Life". But he is very competitive and has always done the "extra", it paid off for him, in that he was a weekend starter all four years. At most of these D3's if you have an academic conflict with an athletic commitment, such as a practice or workout, the academics come first. you miss the practice or work out and make it up on your own time.  This did not apply to Games though. If you had a conflict with academics you should have worked it out with your prof long before it came a problem. When some D3's get to regionals their student athletes are taking finals in hotel rooms with a proctor. 

Son only visited one D3 where it was expected that you schedule all your classes to be done by noon so you could work on Baseball the rest of the time. Workouts every morning at 6:00 am as well. Son ended up not attending, because the academic reputation was not what he was looking for in Chemistry and the facilities were terrible.  

My guess is that for those types of schools it's mostly about raw admission numbers and trying to distinguish themselves from other similar schools. That is, baseball is another tool for attracting kids from the very limited pool of strong academic students. For example, Wash College only enrolled 13% of their admitted students in 2014. Sports may make the difference for kids who have lots of other options. It might also motivate a kid to apply who otherwise wouldn't have.

 

I think the money part is a little murkier. Many schools in this category will help the student get expenses down to the EFC. What if the baseball player needs a sizable need grant to make it work? But I'm not naive. If it's obvious that a baseball recruit can pay the full nut, the coach and Admissions will be aware of that at some schools.

 

The schools we visited took the NCAA rules regarding non-athletic scholarships very seriously. Student athletes can't be treated any differently than the general student population when it comes to merit and need scholarships. Don't expect any award that he wouldn't have earned if he was a non-athlete student.

 

p.s. Thanks for the memory jog on Be Bop Deluxe. Added them to my playlist today.

Wow - a 92% admit rate and rolling admissions.  Ouch.

 

I agree with the point that the schools in the good-but-not-great category are in deep kimchi.  It will be interesting as I go through this process to see what schools are going to have ANY flexibility on discounting the sticker price....because, again, while schools like, say, Muhlenberg or Washington College are good schools that are a cut above the average LAC, I don't know if they are $58,000/year good.  The good thing about living in this neck of the woods (southeast PA) is that there are a TON of schools within a 300-mile radius...and there are probably a few solid LAC's and regional universities who would be THRILLED to get $35,000-40,000/year from me.

 

To be honest, I am not looking for much - if I can get $5,000/year (to offset the money that I have put out on this baseball program) I would be happy with that.  We will see what happens.

MidAtlanticDad:

 

Nice to know there is a Bill Nelson fan out there...although the internet handle comes from the name of the college radio jazz show I DJ'ed back in the day...

 

I do understand the limits of non-athletic scholarships at D3 schools...and that is why my expectations are not great.  I do not know the construction of the left-tail of the admissions distribution curve at some of the schools that my son is looking at, but I do think that he is not so horrifically far away from the low-end of the 25-75 statistical pool that it would be a scandal to throw him a few bucks.  I am hopeful that he can put up a mid-20's ACT score, which will definitely fall within WC's 25-75 range (actually close to median) and should be right around Muhlenberg's 25th percentile.  His GPA isn't great, but it is on a positive trend and he attends a good school that has sent many kids to the 'Berg.  It is also interesting that WC's yield is only 13%..which means that it is a safety school for a LOT of kids.  If my son really connects with the coach and the school, and is prepared o make a commitment, I would think that throwing a few bucks my way to guarantee that they get $45,000-50,000/year from me would make some business sense...but we will see what happens.

 

And guess what?  If those schools don't work out, there are others out there.  At the end of the day, to a certain extent, college is what you make of it.  If anything, some of the discussions that I have had with people over the past couple of months has helped me step away from the ledge a bit.  For my son, I am hoping that baseball can provide a valuable way to increase his work ethic and sense of self-confidence, as well as a way to make a college smaller and give him a sense of community/family (with hopefully a little less alcohol consumption than a fraternity!).  

 

Like some parents on this site, I want him to get into the best school that he can get into, and I am EXTREMELY fortunate to have the $$$ to help make that happen.  I just want to make sure that I am not spending a ridiculous full-price sticker for an education that may not move the needle in terms of employment or grad school opportunities.  I am paying full-boat for my older son at Villanova, but he is getting a pretty good educational experience, he is killing it in the classroom, and I am confident that he has the intellect and drive to leverage that degree somehow.  For my younger son (who is not quite at the same place), it is more about growing up and understanding how to work for what you want...which is why I think baseball can play a valuable role....and it is probably more important for him - even if he can throw 85 next fall - to go to a school where he can balance everything...a school that does not have 6AM practices and a dog-eat-dog-for-playing-time culture.

 

Does that make any sense?

bebopdeluxe1,

 

Makes perfect sense, I just wanted to disconnect the FB from the merit scholarship.

 

I tried to do the same thing with my 2015, but he was more comfortable choosing a school where the coach really wooed him, and he was closer to the top than the bottom on the academic side (but still within the 25-75 pool). I would have happily paid more at a higher academic, but in the end it was mostly his decision.

Just an update...after further research (including a TON of great info from posters here - thanks, guys!), we are really focusing on the Centennial Conference.  It seems to be the right blend of great academics and a baseball commitment that feels more balanced than in some of the other conferences.  My son is prepared for a 15-20 hour/week commitment in the fall, but also wants to have time to enjoy his college experience...and still have enough time left over to get his schoolwork done!

 

Focus schools right now are Washington College, Muhlenberg and Ursinus (although UC might wind up being too close to home for him).  I will let you guys know what happens!

Sent you a PM