Updating HSBBWeb, Possible???

I think those things can be corrected.  Swampboy and I perform most of the day-to-day management around here but we do not control site content.  Hopefully, MN-Mom (the owner) will see this thread and make the requested changes.  Thanks.

Thanks ClevelandDad, this site is awesome....I just hope someone way more knowledgeable than me volunteers to perhaps re-write some things to make it more current and check that the current information on time lines and coach contact rules are accurate.

Shouldn't discount crowdsourcing the updates.

I offered a long time ago to help update the recruiting portion and I am sure others would help. That was when we had the old interface. Definetly a good suggestion as it would answer lots of those questions asked on a continuous basis.

I agree that the content needs to be expanded and updated.

 

I'd also like to see more info to help current and future high school players get the most out of their high school baseball experience even if they don't aspire to play college or pro ball.

 

I'd also like to see more forum activity by parents celebrating the journeys of "normal" high school players.

 

I can only speak for myself Swampboy but I doubt you have many parents/players on here that have/are just "normal" high school players. 

 

I might be totally off base in my OPINION, but I think this site is mostly dedicated to "how to improve and market yourself so you can be recruited, and how to deal with playing at the next level."

 

I don't know, CaCo...we just see the posters, not the readers.  I would think there are many more readers than posters.

I agree with Go44.
The progression is and always was, how to make the HS team, how to make a college roster, and possibly getting drafted.
Now we have parents of middle schoolers planning for their players to be major leaguers, thats about 10+ years too soon to worry about it.
One step at a time.
JMO

The name of the site is High School Baseball Web, and I agree there should be more of that here.  CaC03, I would expect that parents with children the same age as yours would welcome that if they are asking "how does my kid make the HS team and do well" rather than hopscotching to questions  about college and pro ball before their kid has even played in HS.  A lot of people who come here looking for a site about high school baseball may leave when they see that so much of the focus is is on recruiting.

 

I agree with SB.  It would be great to see more about "normal" high school baseball. It's a great and compelling sport even without any linkage to the next level, and besides, some of the best players I've seen have not been interested in the next level for whatever reason.

 

How you do that I do not know. Current articles about how to approach HS ball would be good, but the meat of the site is the boards.  And I don't know what you do other than having topics where each of us talk about how our HS kids are doing, kind of in a vacuum case we don't all know each other's kids and the kids they play with and against.  But it can still be fun to read about.

 

Some of the most robust discussions around here have to do with specific problems posted by parents, such as kids not getting playing time or not making teams, or being put on varsity when the parent thinks they should be on JV, or vice versa.  While these can be a bit rancorous, at least they do one of the things the internet can do best, which is crowd-sourcing expert opinion for newbies.  Maybe the admins can find a way to be more welcoming to that sort of inquiry.

 

 

It is beyond silly for any parent to think they can secure their kid a spot in MLB.  However, as long as the colleges are recruiting 8th and 9th graders I think this board will see an influx of middle school parents on here that question whether their kid MIGHT be exceptional, rather than normal.

 

This is a great site to help a parent make those distinctions, and what to do if something unusual happens. In short, I am very happy to have found this site full of unbiased people who can give me advice about my kid and what the future could hold if my kid continues on this path.  Frankly, the path to MLB sounds very difficult, very expensive and not easy or fun. 

 

It's nice to have the dose of reality this board provides so I can pass it on to my son. While I congratulate him on his batting/fielding/pitching accomplishments this site has allowed my internal expectations to remain low.  Did he dominate at 12u, yes, does that actually mean he will get to the next level, no!

It is not beyond silly.
What programs are recruiting 8th or 9th grade players?

Well it is beyond silly but there are folks out there who dream of their kids being the next Jeter.

Arizona State, USC, and Miss. St. have all offered and gotten commitments from 8th graders in the past year or so and that's only off the top of my head. I know. It is ridiculous.

The thing is that HS ball is being "stolen" by underage recruitment.  Of course these young recruits are all in the news.  It still remains that the vast majority of recruits happen JR/SR year. 

 

 

 

TPM-If your kid is a talented short short I don't see the problem with dreaming of him being the next Jeter.  The likelihood is 99.99999% against them becoming that, but someone will.

 

Golfman25, I agree!  It really should be against the rules to offer to anyone below 10th grade, and I think 10th grade is pushing it!  How can these schools possibly know what these kids will be doing in 3 or 4 years, what will their body type be, what will their GPA's be, what will their ability be?!!?!??!  It seems ridiculous to offer to anyone in 8th grade and yet major programs are.  This is why I think an influx of middle school parents looking at the next level will be on the rise on this board.

I'm also not so sure that we know the whole story with many of these. I know of one young man who committed to a Pac-12 school in 8th grade who was good, but by no means exceptional. He was a lefty throwing high seventies at the time of the offer/commitment. May have been some backstory we don't know of.

This year our son has attended several camps (USD, Stanford) & showcases (PG) and at each the coaches have talked about how much they hate the reality of having to recruit such young players. They also noted that it was an absolute necessity, as all the other schools were looking at 2019's, and they couldn't afford to be left behind. Like it or not - and finding it ridiculous or not, the recruiting of 8th & 9th graders is absolutely part of the game today, and there are plenty of examples of this out there in virtually every sport, not just baseball. 

 

From our perspective HSBBW is the single most valuable resource we have found regarding information on High School ball or any thoughts being given to playing at the next level. I do feel however that if the message board just became a bunch of parents talking about their son going 2 for 3 in the high school game or complaining about the JV coach this place would get real monotonous, real quick.

 

While I started reading this site when our son was in 7th grade (to get a feel for how HS ball worked), I never felt compelled to truly "join" the site until he entered high school. All the talk about Timmy's play in the 12u tourney and how that will affect his ability to play 3B for the Detroit Tigers someday really should have another home. Keep the site focused on HS ball and above. Just my opinion - but the call for more "normal" HS ball talk on here isn't realistic. How is "normal" determined? The kids who play baseball to avoid being in general PE aren't looking at this site, and neither are their parents. This site is clearly a resource to have a better understanding of the process of playing (and ideally succeeding at) varsity HS baseball and hopefully beyond, and it is the best site on the planet for providing that info. 

Just to add a little...

 

Some of these 8th grade "commitments" are parent/player initiated.  Parent of superstud 14-year old player approaches local or dream Big U., maybe during/after a camp.  Says its always been their 'dream' to play there - will "commit" if coach wants them.  Coach says, 'Uh, ok.'  8th grade player 'commits,' parent then runs to the newspaper, gets article, gets envy from all their friends.

 

Is there a commitment there?  Well, sorta, maybe?  Is it a problem with parents?  Or a problem with college coaches?  Probably both.

 

But for all those stories out there about colleges recruiting 8th graders, I'm pretty sure (and know for sure in some cases) that its more about the parent/player offering something that the coach has no real risk in agreeing too.

 

So when we say, 'Oh my goodness!!  Colleges are out recruiting players in 8th grade so I gotta figure all this out, send Junior to showcases, camps, get a video, get a recruiting profile cause I read its happening in the paper!!' - I say, calm down - it ain't always what it appears to be on the surface.

I am less worried about the coaches and more worried about the kids.  A kid in his first 2 years of HS has no clue about what he is doing after HS (let alone someone not even in HS yet).  They are not mentally or emotionally ready to "pick" a college.  Of course when they get "wined and dined" by some college coach, it can cloud their judgment.  And as Golden Sombrero points out, it seems like we have to protect the coaches from themselves. 

I'm not sure if it's ever been looked at, but I wonder what percentage of these kids who "commit" in 8th or 9th grade actually wind up going to that school?  It may be hard to do because these "commits" are not official or binding or kept track of in any "legal" way.  But I'm sure there is SOME percentage of them that never wind up at that school for one reason or another.  I just think it would be interesting to know what that number actually is...

For lots of reasons, this is probably true. Some don't progress as planned. Others reasons, as well. I'll give you an example. MSU offered and got a commitment from a pitcher from Arkansas before his 9th grade year. However, the kid was/is a 6' 4" lefty throwing 90mph. If that kid progresses at all, he's probably never going to see the inside of a college classroom.

That's one on the positive side!!  

 

There are other things that can happen along the way as well that we've all talked about before.  Coaching change and "commitment" is not honored with new coach.  Kid does not progress baseball wise the way the program thought he would.  Kid does not do academically well enough in HS to get into the school.  Program finds new recruits in the meantime and does not have a need for that position when it comes time for that kid to actually sign.  Kid gets in legal trouble.  Program did not have as many juniors drafted as they thought they would.  We can probably go on and on with the various reasons why a kid might not actually go to that school when the time comes.  The fact is, there is nothing binding about this "commitment", so anything can happen.

 

I'm just wondering how often that happens.  We may never truly know...

I agree with justbasball 100 percent.
Yes recruiting begins earlier, but coaches are not actively recruiting middle schoolers. They are not allowed to.
So this now creates panic mode, my child will be left behind.
Dont drink the kool ade.

Don't kid yourself. They do actively recruit some 8th and 9th graders. No, they can't call, but they have other ways. I've had more than one school reach out through back channels before my kid had ever played a single high school game. However, it's very, very rare. I don't think it's something you need to plan for. However, as more and more kids enter showcases as younger kids, you can expect schools to start earlier and earlier with recruiting. But, yeah, to think it's something normal is out there a bit.

Yes, it is happening and it's actually a good thing for the college.  Maybe even good for the 8th grader, maybe not!

 

We see some 8th graders that look like a sure bet to be successful at a very high level.  If you are College A, how long do you wait to recruit that type kid?  You wait too long and you might find out he committed to College B.

 

Let's face it, if you are a college recruiter and your trying hard to recruit a 16 or 17 year old kid, and go watch him only to see an 8th grade kid that is already as good or better than the kid you're trying to recruit... What do you do?

 

I have seen several 8th graders that stood out in a big way.  Bryce Harper, Justin Upton, Jason Heyward, Ryan Sweeney, Delmon Young, Jeff Clement, etc. Thing is, most of them never end up playing college baseball. In fact, three of those mentioned above, ended up being the first over all player picked in the draft. The one that did play in college became the 3rd pick.

 

Also... I'm not sure about a certain word that is used often here. That word is "reality" as it pertains to a kids baseball future and many other things.

 

I understand the word, but not sure how it relates to a young baseball player.  I think reality can have a negative effect on a talented young kid.  To me reality is more of a result than something to use for predicting the future.  Reality can get in the way of the very things it takes to be successful.  I wonder how many great accomplishments, discoveries, inventions, were a result of someone that heavily considered reality.

 

Reality tells us that only 750 people can play in the Big Leagues at any given time, At least until September.  Only so many can play in College.  Of those 750 players at any given time, or thousands that have done it... How many do you think cared about reality? Somebody has to be one of those 750. Sure, reality tells us that millions wanted to, but didn't.  That is reality because it is factual history.  But how can history tell us how successful any certain individual will be?  

 

Seems to me that dreams and reality clash.  It takes a lot of hard work and persistence to make dreams come true.  So sure there is the reality of everything, but don't let it get in your way. Make sure something else stops you from reaching your goals. If you're a baseball player, you shouldn't clutter your mind with reality.  Reality does have its place in all our lives.  Just not always helpful in reaching our goals and dreams.  At some point in time, reality will show up.  But there is something special about those people that take the journey neccessary to beat the odds/reality.

 

This is just my opinion, certainly nothing I say should be considered vitally important.  I think in my past life, I must have been a River Boat Gambler.

roothog, you and I are usually on the same page BUT I have to disagree with some of this.  You are right, back channel contact is rampant, even if offers aren't allowed yet.  But I do think it's something parents should have a plan for, not plan on it actually happening, but be aware that it does happen and to have at the very most a LOOSE plan for the unlikely.

 

Imagine you are the parent of a 9th grader, he's really breaking apart from the pack, you start thinking wow the kids getting pretty good.  In comes a local college coach that says I'd like to offer you a 25% scholarship if you commit right now. If you know nothing, if you haven't looked at other people's stories, if you haven't got a clue as to what is "normal",  how do you know what to do? Do you wait until it's staring you in the face, however unlikely that is, to actually figure out this world OR do you educate yourself for the highly unlikely scenario?

 

I think of it like this, am I likely to win the 500 million dollar power ball with my $1 ticket, no.  Have I already loosely formed a plan of the things I would buy and pay off if I did win, YES!  Nothing wrong with having a loose plan.

For any youngsters who might be reading this:

 

One person's clutter is another person's reason, I guess. I think reality is always a good thing to be aware of. I think youngsters should always think carefully about youth marketing (the post I am quoting is not marketing) that is targeting your dreams...whether it is about baseball, Hollywood, appearance, muscles, career as a fighter pilot, whatever.

 

Consider the following examples:

 

1. You dream about playing in MLB. You are a spot starter in HS. You have a chance to go to an Ivy or MIT or Stanford with no baseball, or make a baseball roster at a JUCO. Need-based aid at the Ivy or others means there is no financial consideration. Clutter mind with reality or not?

 

2. You dream about playing in MLB. You are 15 yrs old. You are the fifth pitcher on your average HS team sitting 75 mph. You have heard about the advantages of getting seen at camps and showcases. But you know the family might have to stretch a bit to cover the cost. Let reality enter your mind, or follow your dreams on the camp and showcase circuit?

 

I have no problem with people of all ages, including youngsters, considering reality in their decision-making. Why wouldn't you use all information that is available? If you don't use available information, I would call that dumbing-down.

 

Maybe your dreams will guide your course of action in spite of reality, or maybe reality will hold sway. In either case, I would not advise that reality is ever a clutter for anyone's mind, including a youngster's.

 

 

LSU, Texas AM and Florida St, got those from PG web site. There are plenty of others,
trust us on this one.

I did mention a "talented" young kid.

 

That kind of eliminates the 5th pitcher throwing 75 from attending showcases and other recruiting events.  He would be wasting his time and money.  It doesn't mean he can't work hard to get better.

I liked PG's post.  I took it to mean that the talented baseball player should shoot for what is unlikely and not let the percentage of likely success bog him down.  In my opinion it is the parent that needs to be aware of "reality". 

 

It is entirely possible for a parent to support their kids dream without actually buying into it themselves.  As with any specialty career, if the kid makes it that is amazing, but if you know your kid is 5 deep in the rotation then you aren't going to fork over $600 that the family can't afford for a showcase, no matter what the kid wants, that's just being a parent.  My kid is NEVER going Ivy so I won't even touch that one, but, as long as he gets a college degree in something I'm good if he chases his baseball dream while getting his degree. Not my team, not my dream!

OK, I see that word used once elsewhere in your post now.

 

So again, for youngsters who may be reading this, add the word "talented" that wasn't  part of the original text quoted in my previous post, so it now reads, "If you are a talented baseball player you shouldn't clutter your mind with reality".

 

Thing is, dreamers don't always have a realistic view of their own talent. If a kid is dreaming about MLB he probably thinks he has the talent or potential, whether he does or not.

 

I respect your point of view, and am standing by mine.

 

 

I would recommend that any kid that lacks the talent necessary to impress baseball people to stay away from events geared for exposure.  

 

Never will I ever tell any kid his dreams are impossible to fulfill.  It's easy to know where your skills line up in your current situation.  If you are topping out in the 60s, you can dream about playing in the Major Leagues, but no one that I know of will be selling you on that dream.  Those kids should understand they have to work extra hard rather than show off their current skills.  A dream without some type of plan isn't very likely to be fulfilled It's not a serious dream!

 

Also I see a difference in being realistic and actual reality.  If that makes any sense.

UVA and Virginia Tech -  9th graders.

They are out there... There are more than a few...

 

I coached a kid who committed to a D-1 before he played a single HS game...  

 

He was taken in the 1st Round this year...

Yes, they are out there.

 

But I don't think its wise to create an expecation - through all of the middle school parents that are on this site lately, to make them believe it is normal.

 

It is not.  I can only think of 1 or 2 parents of 1st round kids that have posted here in my dozen or so years reading this site.  Those are the types of kids who might(?) get that opportunity.

 

From the 2011 and 2014 drafts, I (personally) know 4 kids (and their parents) who were drafted in the 1st round.  None of them made a commitment until their junior year in HS.  3 of them signed for pro ball due to their 1st round status straight out of HS.  One is already in the big leagues.  The other 3 will be shortly.  They are special and somehow they were able to wait.  One waited until the end of his junior year in HS before committing.

 

It is not normal to get an offer in 8th or 9th grade.  Not even in 10th grade.  Much less "commit."  Lets not create the illusion that it is.

Definitely not normal for an incoming freshman...

Our 2015 1st Round (3rd Pick overall) SS committed to FSU during Sophomore Spring season... That was semi-normal actually...

That is 'semi-normal' for a 1st round/#3 pick (10th grade commitment).  But not for the masses that read this site.  That was my point.

Still semi-normal. PG shows, I think about 90 2018 commits. I would also think that will pick up during the holidays as they have more unofficial visits. In the end, I'd think you would average 4 or 5 per state (the majority coming from California and Florida). In contrast, Colorado just had their first commitment from a 2017 last week and he's still the only one.

I don't have all the facts here about this specific kid and "when" the actual "college" recruiting started but i bet it was earlier than when he actually committed to a local engineering school. He verbally committed his Freshman year in HS and had been playing in an organization exposed to that HC for many, many years prior to that commitment. Exception? absolutely...he just went 1st round and got at least $3M+ in the draft. I would have recruited him too if i had the chance.