Walk ons

I think you always hear about those success stories of walk ons and we all happily cheer for the kid. I would never tell a player what to do, but I can honestly say that every walk on player I've known has not been one of these we hear the great stories about. It's a very difficult road for any player and to begin that journey in a walk on spot is even more of a challenge.

Sometimes though a player just wants to be a part of a particular program... that might make him happier than playing every inning of every game for some other school.

lafmom,
I agree, you don't hear much about these stories.

I don't know much about the situation, whether he had been playing in a league possibly, I am going to try to find out. Often people ask about their players missing a year (transfer, playing after graduation) so I thought this was interesting.

BTW, we also have a walk on catcher, who has seen some action, to relieve the catcher late in the game.

Most likely, some of this was being at the right place at the right time.

quote:

Originally posted by Tiger Paw Mom:
Most likely, some of this was being at the right place at the right time.

This is true..along with the coach and his staff being open-minded and looking out for what is best for their team regardless of the source of the help.

I can only imagine that the successful walk-on player is both extremely motivated and extremely realistic.

Congratulations to Clemson's walk-on second baseman and to Coach Leggett and his staff.

I think you would be surprised at how many players are actually walk ons - especially at lower level schools. Since baseball gets so few scholarships most coaches have to be creative with the money they give and that includes looking into academic money instead of baseball money.

I had the privilege of walking on at a NAIA school and probably 40% of my team mates did not get baseball money. We all knew that we would play for four years and be done. We just wanted to play a little longer.

By walk-on, aren't you referring to a kid who shows up at tryouts mostly out of the blue (a pure walk-on)?

An "invited walk-on," on the other hand, may be a great player with academic money who was aggressively recruited by the coach. Or he may be a star recruited by a team with no money left to give.

Would you call this kid a "walk-on?": Mega-star goes to the University of Texas for two weeks, gets homesick, drops out and enrolls in hometown JUCO which is out of scholarship money, and is almost free anyway.

We have a hitting instructor at a local baseball academy who was a walk-on at Stanford. Sean Flikke. From what I hear, he did pretty well. You never know.

I can expand on the Sean Flikke story a little bit, because he was an instructor at the Headfirst camp in Jupiter years ago. One of his former teammates addressed the group when introducing him. He said that when Sean came to the coaches to ask to try to walk on, he was of course allowed to try. The teammate talked about how he would never forget how Sean was, for the first few weeks, shagging balls in the outfield in his high school sweats while all the regular players were in their Stanford uniforms, and how hard he worked to try to make the team. He said that the first time Sean stepped up to the plate in fall scrimmages, he hit a ball so far out of the park "that it is STILL traveling somewhere out there." He made the team, and became one of the team leaders in his time at Stanford. It is a wonderful story and he is a great guy.

Arizona State University regularly has lots of walk-ons. Many of them stars in college and later in professional baseball. There are similar examples at the University of Southern California, including a pitcher who started for the Trojans in the College World Series and is now in the starting rotation of a Big League team. Stanford also has such players. The difference is that they are recruited walkons with lots of talent from the get go.

I hate the word because it is a tag that sticks with you. You are a walk-on for that first walk-on tryout if you make it you become a teammate. So many guys go to a specific school for academic reasons and don't plan on baseball or for some reason they were just not recruited. Many people look at a walk-on as someone who was not good enough to be recruited but they are so wrong about that perception. How many time do you hear comments like.........

"The starter got hurt so they had to put a walk-on in"

"He's a walk-on bullpen catcher"

"He's a walk-on pitcher who mainly throws BP and mop up work"

I don't think that it is about being in the right place at the right time, it is more about being good enough to make the team. Why don't they say something like...........

"The starter got hurt so they had to put a books only guy in"

"He's a 30% bullpen catcher"

"He's a 70% pitcher who mainly throws BP and mop up work"

If you have to start describing teammates by how they made the team, you are getting very close talking about a "class system".

Well-put, rz1, which is why in the best programs (or even most programs) it is not an issue that I have seen very often. In fact, I see it most among the fans and virtually not at all among the coaches and players.

There has been many questions asked by parents regarding their sons walking on to try out for a team, either because they were not recruited by anyone, they missed a few years of playing, were not happy at their previosu school.

I have seen responses from, they don't have anything invested in that player to why would you want to play for just books, to if he was any good why wasn't he recruited elsewhere.

The term is intended to mean he was not actively recruited, or offered an opportunity, but decided to give it a shot at open tryouts (mandatory for D1 schools).

The player now has to compete for a chance to make the fall roster, to make the spring roster. I would assume most are happy to be part of the team, make as much contribution as they can, even though they may not see (as some people perceive) much playing time.

In this particular situation, I was giving a scenerio of how my perception of being a "walk on" has changed.

In this particular situation, for both players, who made the team, opportunity arose because a major player was lost and a highly recuited catcher came with an injury that is taking longer to rehab. So for these players they were good enough to make the team an opportunity opened for them to play, regardlesso f it is 30%, 50% or 80% of the time.
The point is, many of previous posts have been very negative about trying out for a team, more cons than pros.

I just thought that I would offer another side to the story for those who have perceptions of the negative side of what can happen if you "walk on" to a team. It had nothing to do with talking about or creating a "class system".

quote:

I hate the word because it is a tag that sticks with you.

Great point. You're always known as a walk-on even if they give you a full ride and plead with you to return the next year.

It's a tag that's so hopelessly vague that it carries little meaning, other than an emotionally pejorative one.

quote:

by RZ: I hate the word because it is a tag that sticks with you

I would agree that it does stick with a guy, but I don't see it as a negative in any way .. in fact the ones I know happily wear the label like a badge

it simply denotes that they became a team member thru open tyrouts - that's a real loong odds accomplishment which also means eventually pushing a recruited player off the roster and earning athletic aid.

and in many/most programs a "bullpen catcher" is a non-roster staff member (student volunteer),
who'd love that walk-on label and the roster spot that goes with it

Last year I met a parent of a former player, he introduced himself and then added, "my son was a walk on".

Today coach in radio interview referred the player as a walk on.

I guess it all depends how it is perceived, one of the original points of my post.

Being a walk on has nothing to do with talent or lack of talent. It is often a result of no more BB money or the fact that the school like a player but has not been able to fully evaluate the player.
There are success stories and this should have no negative connotations. The problem is you get no BB money atleast for the 1st semester and probably not the 2nd either unless some money is freed up.

Jemaz how is Smitty doing at Arizona State ? Ron Davis's son is also at Arizona. He coached my son for awhile. I understand Ron is coaching a pro team in Arizona .

TPM Definition:

quote:

The term is intended to mean he was not actively recruited, or offered an opportunity, but decided to give it a shot at open tryouts

NCAA definition:

quote:

Walk-ons are varsity athletes who do not receive any athletically related financial aid even though they compete at institutions that award such aid.

A highly recruited 5 tool player whos wealthy parents insist on paying for his education so the team is not charged a scholarship comes to the team as the inheirent starter, he is by definition a "walk-on".

The term is intended to be constude as being not anything to do with recruiting or opportunity but rather a financial aide term. I may be splitting hairs but as Jemaz said

quote:

...which is why in the best programs (or even most programs) it is not an issue that I have seen very often. In fact, I see it most among the fans and virtually not at all among the coaches and players.

I just don't like when someone says a "walk-on" did this or that, when the term is used in a connotation that he was not good enough to be recruited at one time. I just seem like a negative word. IMHO

quote:

Originally posted by Bee>:

quote:

by RZ: I hate the word because it is a tag that sticks with you

I would agree that it does stick with a guy, but I don't see it as a negative in any way

Never said negative tag. I would rather have the tag of "teammate".

IMO - If you hit .350 - or strike them all out - it dont make much difference what anybody calls you. LOL

Thanks for posting that NCAA definition. RZ1. I'll have to search out the NAIA and NJCAA definitions which are probably different to some degree.

BTW. is a star baseball player a walk-on if he gets football money then plays baseball?

rz,
A 5 tool player who has wealthy parents and does not accept a scholarship is a walk on or a recruited walk on? Did I mention anything about recruited walk ons?

If he gets books only he is not a walk on by definiton?

I was speaking about the player who comes to open try outs and gets a chance to play.

Seems like the original intention of the post has gone in another direction. Trying to give an example of a great thing that has happened to these players.

Thanks for the NCAA definition, apparently, should not be looked upon as negative.

quote:

If you have to start describing teammates by how they made the team, you are getting very close talking about a "class system".

Rz, that's a good point. I would hope that a teammate would never refer to another in that manner or in any way other than a "teammate". All players recognize that kids don't perform on any given day based on their scholly... or I hope they do.

As discussed already, "walk on" means a lot of different things from "invited" walk on to a kid that actually puts on sweat pants and trys out in the fall. While all have to work hard, I still think that for the most part "walk on" has to proove himself much more than the other kids... but there's always the exception and much does depend on the circumstances.

re the NCAA defintion:
much better info is offered on this board

my money says if ya ask the NCAA tomorrow to confirm that definition ... each person you speak to will give you a different answer & at least 1 will put you on "hold" till the call is dropped



how many classic movies are out there about about a scholarship guy who only got in for 1 play in his entire career??

From Dictionary.com:

quote:

1. Also called walking part. a small part in a play or other entertainment, esp. one without speaking lines. Compare bit2 (def. 6).
2. an entertainer or actor who plays such a part.
3. an athlete trying out for a team who has not been drafted, specifically invited, scouted, awarded a scholarship, etc.

Pretty vague word in popular usage

quote:

Originally posted by Tiger Paw Mom:
A 5 tool player who has wealthy parents and does not accept a scholarship is a walk on or a recruited walk on?
He's a walk-on by definition. The only difference between recruited walk-on and a player who makes it through the tryouts is that the recruited walk-on starts fall practice with the team and does not go through that tryout. Neither is guaranteed a spot on the Spring roster.

Did I mention anything about recruited walk ons?
Did I?

If he gets books only he is not a walk on by definiton?
I think if those books are part of Athletic Aid then he is not a walk-on.

Seems like the original intention of the post has gone in another direction.
I don't mean to take away from those players and/or any other player that does well. I'm just opening up "walk-on" discussion. All I'm saying is that I don't care for spotlighting those who are not under a scholarship because at the end of the day they are all teammates and whos to say they are not more deserving than other scholarship players on the team. It is a financial definition.

Trying to give an example of a great thing that has happened to these players.
I agree ,

If a previous walk-on makes the team the following year is he still considerd a walk-on?

If a previous walk-on makes the team the following year but is rewarded scholly he is no longer considerd a walk-on?

If a tree falls in the forest does anyone hear?

I may be wrong with my inturpretation of the definition but regardless how a player makes a team I don't feel a walk-on tag should be used unless it is in reference to who are scholarship players.

quote:

If a tree falls in the forest does anyone hear?

I like this one better...

If a man is talking and no women are around, is he still wrong?

Oh, c'mon Frank...you know the answer to that, don't you?

Of course!

Sheesh! I gotta' run and catch a falling tree before it is wrong! Ya' hear me!

quote:

Originally posted by rz1:
Never said negative tag. I would rather have the tag of "teammate".

There ya go!

We’re all far too used to labels. He’s tall, he’s got a strong arm, he can run like a deer, he’s here on a ‘ship, are all pretty cool and positive labels. But he’s short, he couldn’t break a window, he’s slow as a slug, or he’s a walk on, have a negativity about them, no matter how hard anyone tries to say there isn’t.

I agree with you that, teammate is the label I’d want, and its usually what the players call each other, but its the narrow minded parents who seem to want to put those labels out there. Mebbe its to make their own kids look better, or mebbe its just a bit of ignorance that some folks don’t realize is hurtful to others.

quote:

Originally posted by FrankF:

quote:

If a tree falls in the forest does anyone hear?

I like this one better...

If a man is talking and no women are around, is he still wrong?

quote:

by sk regarding "walk-on": mebbe its just a bit of ignorance that some folks don’t realize is hurtful to others.

especially if their voice inflection is like Jerry Seinfeld saying "Newman"

I think the cruelty in baseball is a refection of our society that can have long lasting effects ...
like sk said some are used innocently in ignorance, however insider's KNOW they are code-words -

I welcome your suggestions on how to handle other hurtful epithets ...

substitute (not good enough to start)
relief pitcher (not good enough to start)
lefty (lefties just aint right)
outfielder (not good enough to play IF)
# 9 hitter (the worst hitter)
# 8 hitter (the second worst hitter)
2B (weakest arm)
3B (not good enough to play SS)
losing pitcher (looser)
blown save (loser)
batter struck out (loser)
losing team (loser)
pinch hitter (bench loser getting a token AB)

When I used to coach at an NAIA I would call up players that could barely make our squad and talk to them about coming to our school and they would all say, "No, I'm going to walk on at ______ (fill in top 25 D-1 program here)."
It was a pretty regular thing and we coaches would visit...
"Are you recruiting Smith?"
"No says he's gonna walk on at a D-1"
and both coaches in unison:
"He may walk on, but I bet he runs off."

quote:

Originally posted by Bee>:
especially if their voice inflection is like Jerry Seinfeld saying "Newman"

"Newman evolved as a scheming mailman ... his "Name" is first mentioned during "The Revenge" episode ... followed in later episodes by his "voice only" appearing (?) occasionally, and finally much later he actually appeared on camera"


sooo, as defined above by micdsguy/dictionary.com ... Newman IS a WALK-ON

quote:

Bee quote:

especially if their voice inflection is like Jerry Seinfeld saying "Newman"

I think the cruelty in baseball is a refection of our society that can have long lasting effects ...

like sk said some are used innocently in ignorance, however insider's KNOW they are code-words - I welcome your suggestions on how to handle other hurtful epithets ...

substitute (not good enough to start) or, working his way to be a starter
relief pitcher (not good enough to start) or, mentally tough and quickly becomes game ready
lefty (lefties just aint right) or, God given tool and a lucky guy
outfielder (not good enough to play IF) or, born to play outfield
# 9 hitter (the worst hitter) or, sets up the top of the order
# 8 hitter (the second worst hitter) or, great defensive player
2B (weakest arm) or, understands the right side of the infield
3B (not good enough to play SS) or, fearless at the hot corner
losing pitcher (looser) or, short end of the stick
blown save (loser) or, loser
batter struck out (loser) or, pitcher had is number today
losing team (loser) or, played hard but came up short
pinch hitter (bench loser getting a token AB) or, getting valuable experience

Good point Bee. This list could be precieved in many ways but who's ever delivering the message and their inflection is stating the definition. All of the above are situational, Walk-on, I feel is an un-necessary status.

BEE

Cruelty in baseball or any other sport is nowhere near the cruelty in REAL LIFE----


Baseball /any sport helps a kid prepare for what is ahead but please dont equate the cruelty of sports and real life--- if a player cannot handle the cruelty of sports he/she has a big problem ahead in the REAL WORLD

bee, rz,
knows how to pitch - doesn't throw very hard

I prefer an under recruited player....

I would prefer to call it a well deserved

FFAS- "Family Funded Athletic Scholarship"

or

FFR - "Full Family Ride"